AN OPEN LETTER TO JAY - About Profanities!

[Insanity Falls]

AN OPEN LETTER TO JAY

Hey Jay!

I've got myself into a fight again!
Please help us High Lord! We need you!

This bust up was triggered by me, wait for it, amusingly saying "goddamn", and then that being deleted by a moderator, and this I found hilarious! But then undue words were added, and it deteriorated into quite a burly bawl.

We really need leadership!

I am VERY suprised that swear-words used by Stephen Donaldon's most famous character are not allowed, (if that is truly the case). I mean VERY surprised!

All the same, I am very happy to aquiesce to policy!

But what is it?

If Covenant swear-words are not allowed, please make a clear statement where we will all see it, so that we all know how to meet the board's requirements.

Mind you, it would seem to me to be both an unenforcable and pointless policy! However, it is of course, your call!

Bust-ups spoil the enjoyment of other readers (although they can be of high-importance to the participants!).

It is a damn shame, because it was a REALLY exciting thread!

And all that happened to trigger this train-wreck was me telling myself to "hold the press" and "wait a goddamn minute" as something really exciting sprang up into my mind when I was entering my post.

And what I said really excited people, and I was expecting the thread to really take off.

And then bang : train-wreck!

A great shame!

Please take a lead and help!

With kind respect,
Stephen

[Queeaqueg]

He may use non-offensives words but there are Christans here who might find you taking the Lord's name in vain offensive...

[Worm of Despite]

I am VERY suprised that swear-words used by Stephen Donaldon's most famous character are not allowed, (if that is truly the case). I mean VERY surprised!

All the same, I am very happy to aquiesce to policy!

But what is it?

If Covenant swear-words are not allowed, please make a clear statement where we will all see it, so that we all know how to meet the board's requirements.

Regardless of whether certain profanities are used by characters of the Thomas Covenant novels, that does not nullify the fact that those words still offend certain people. Out of respect for the offended, I humbly recommend that you try your best to refrain from their usage. Also: please remember that this is a family board.

[Myste]

When you're quoting from the Chrons, using the language Covenant does is pretty much inescapable, but when you're not, there's probably some other way of expressing the feeling. We're family-friendly, we try to be inclusive of absolutely everyone, and that includes people who don't care for profanity.

The key is that this is a big community, with a lot of different members from different backgrounds, and we all try to respect each other as best we can. And that means avoiding language that others might find offensive, degrading, or even just immensely irritating.

[Lord Mhoram]

Wait. Since when has this been a family board? If people find a swear offensive, they dont' have to post in the thread.

[Worm of Despite]

Maybe I'm wrong, but people have always been saying it's a family board. I know of at least two parents who have kids that come here, etc., and they might be concerned about what their kid stumbles upon. They shouldn't have to cautiously wade through threads.

[variol son]

But who constitutes what is acceptable for a "Family" website? If my little brother or sister where old enough to have read SRD, and were frequenting this place, I would be ok with them reading g-d every now and then. Which is what it is. Even words such as that are used very infrequently in my experience.

Sum sui generis
Vs

[Loredoctor]

I have trouble that some people are offended by such words here yet like SRD's works.

[ChoChiyo]

I don't care if people use "bad" words, as long as they are not directed at other people.

"d*** it," is one thing, but "d*** YOU" is another altogether.

[Worm of Despite]

I'm not offended by the words; I say them myself from time-to-time, but the fact remains that other people here ARE offended when you say g-d. I'm just suggesting, that, for the sake of those who get offended by such words, that we try to use alternative words, out of respect. I personally have no problem with that/think it's not too much to ask.

And yeah, we could get into a debate about if KW is a family board or not, but I think that's subverting the core issue.

[Loredoctor]

Should we then demand SRD edits his works so as to not offend people?

[Worm of Despite]

I don't know how your logic works, but, then again, I don't think I want to know.

[Loredoctor]

*sigh* I was being sarcastic, Foul. I think it is ridiculous that one can accept SRD's use of the words, love his work, yet get offended by it's use at KW.

[Worm of Despite]

I think it's ridiculous to compare two extremely different mediums of communication: a book and a community board.

Edit: okay, yeah, I personally find it ridiculous. I read the SRD books, see some profanities, and it's just another word to me. Of course I can't understand why someone would be offended after seeing such words in SRD's books, but, since they're offended, we might as well at least try to keep the profanity at a small trickle, out of common courtesy.

[Loredoctor]

KW IS NOT a family board - it is a board for adults and teenagers to discuss SRD's works. The fact of the matter is if you claim offense by what other people say and not what SRD writes then you are overreacting. Yes, they are different mediums, but using them is using them. When will it end? All it will take is for other beliefs to visit KW and start claiming offense by any old comment.

[Worm of Despite]

KW IS NOT a family board - it is a board for adults and teenagers to discuss SRD's works.

I would argue that KW is a family board, as preteens frequent here, and, to my knowledge, the daughter of a mod still goes here (or maybe not anymore).

[Loredoctor]

This is what we agreed to when we signed up:

You agree not to post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, sexually-orientated or any other material that may violate any applicable laws. Doing so may lead to you being immediately and permanently banned (and your service provider being informed). The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. You agree that the webmaster, administrator and moderators of this forum have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic at any time should they see fit. As a user you agree to any information you have entered above being stored in a database. While this information will not be disclosed to any third party without your consent the webmaster, administrator and moderators cannot be held responsible for any hacking attempt that may lead to the data being compromised.

Nowhere does it state that Falls is wrong.

[Worm of Despite]

Forget it. I've said my bit. If you want to use the profanity, I don't care, but others might, is all I'm saying. I guess they'll just have to fend for themselves. Stupid Foul, stop taking up for 'em.

[kevinswatch]

Ok ok, let's all be cool here.

Yeah, as we've said every now and then, personally, I like to keep the Watch a "family-friendly" site. Some Watchers have mentioned that they let their children come here, and as a result, I'd prefer the keep the language PG or PG-13.

Like Loremaster was saying though, if someone doesn't find the language used in SRD's books offensive, then they should have no problem if the same language is used here.

However, like Lord Foul was saying, people can be offended easily by many things, and we don't want to outright say "too bad, suck it up" for people who are offended by certain words.

But, the one thing that's great about this board is that we're all mature people...so I think we can work something out. Right now, there are currently no words on the censor list except for the f-word. Should we start making a list of words we can all agree to censor?

But really, I don't think this is a huge problem... It's not like we have people running around cursing in every post.

Can't we all just agree to be respectful of other people here and to watch our language? If someone is bothered by a word, then to stop using it? If you yourself are bothered by a word, to let someone (like myself) know?

I think we can all be reasonable.

So yeah, I'm not sure the best way to go about this. Any suggestions?-jay

[Loredoctor]

KW IS NOT a family board - it is a board for adults and teenagers to discuss SRD's works.

I would argue that KW is a family board, as preteens frequent here, and, to my knowledge, the daughter of a mod still goes here (or maybe not anymore).

It is not - no where is there writing stating so. ALL it takes is for one family-minded person to state 'I am offended by rape and torture, could we please stop talking about it in threads as I think KW is a family board. As the books are a different medium to forums, I think mentioning it here is wrong and offensive.'