Jeremiah's tower/castle? construct

[The Fifth Ward]

What's up with THAT construct? (The one that Linden first walks through in RotE when she enters her home to see Jeremiah?) Sound's like the King and Queen's Palace. Or possibly the dwelling of the Viles?
Any thoughts on this?
My first post, sorry if it's been covered already. To bad it took me so many years to find this Website! Started LFB and TIW in '82, have read all others as soon as they came out. Insights Appreciated!

[sweetbread]

I think that it may represent the passage into the land, or , in less articulate words, the portal into the land. Outside is Linden's world, work, her car, the Berrenford Medical Center, and so on. However, inside the house, after one steps through the construct at the door, one is greeted by constructs of Mt Thunder, Revelstone, and the Arch itself.

I think the construct at the door may have been necessary for "marking" Linden and Jeremiah (and Sandy as well, who's presence in the Land is an unconfirmed suspicion) for passage into the Land. Roger too, was marked when he kidnapped Jeremiah.

[danlo]

There's at least one or two big topics on this in the RotE forum.

[wayfriend]

There's at least one or two big topics on this in the RotE forum.

Topics about the racetrack, I think, not about the faerie castle.

During her absence, the short hallway which joined the living room on one side, the dining room on the other, and the stairway to the second floor had been transformed into the site of a high, ramified castle of Tinkertoys.

Turrets of wooden rods and circular connectors rose above her on both sides. If she had not ducked, she would have struck her head on the flying rampart stretched between them. Other ramparts linked the turrets to a central keep: more turrets proliferated beyond it. The whole edifice was at once enormously elaborate, thick with details like balconies and bartizans, and perfectly symmetrical, balanced in all its parts. Its strangeness in her entryway, a pedestrian place intended for the most ordinary use, gave it an eldritch quality, almost an evanescence, as though some faery castle had been half translated from its own magical realm, and could be discerned by its outlines in slim rods and wheels like a glimpse into another dimension of being. Seen by moonlight, blurred and indistinct, it would have seemed the stuff of dreams.

Since this was made at the same time as Revelstone and Mount Thunder, I'd have to guess that it's something from the Land that Jeremiah has seen. But I don't think it's anything we have seen.

My best guess is that it's the Lost Deep of the Viles. (As you too have said, FW.) But it could also be something we cannot even guess at. I don't remember anything about such a castle for the King and Queen.

[rdhopeca]

There's at least one or two big topics on this in the RotE forum.

Topics about the racetrack, I think, not about the faerie castle.

During her absence, the short hallway which joined the living room on one side, the dining room on the other, and the stairway to the second floor had been transformed into the site of a high, ramified castle of Tinkertoys.

Turrets of wooden rods and circular connectors rose above her on both sides. If she had not ducked, she would have struck her head on the flying rampart stretched between them. Other ramparts linked the turrets to a central keep: more turrets proliferated beyond it. The whole edifice was at once enormously elaborate, thick with details like balconies and bartizans, and perfectly symmetrical, balanced in all its parts. Its strangeness in her entryway, a pedestrian place intended for the most ordinary use, gave it an eldritch quality, almost an evanescence, as though some faery castle had been half translated from its own magical realm, and could be discerned by its outlines in slim rods and wheels like a glimpse into another dimension of being. Seen by moonlight, blurred and indistinct, it would have seemed the stuff of dreams.

Since this was made at the same time as Revelstone and Mount Thunder, I'd have to guess that it's something from the Land that Jeremiah has seen. But I don't think it's anything we have seen.

My best guess is that it's the Lost Deep of the Viles. (As you too have said, FW.) But it could also be something we cannot even guess at. I don't remember anything about such a castle for the King and Queen.

Any chance its Doriendor Corishev?

[wayfriend]

Came back to add the description of the Lost Deep we have: they inhabited the Lost Deep in caverns as ornate and majestic as castles.

[DukkhaWaynhim]

Any chance at all this 'faery castle' is Foul's Creche? I don't have the books with me (I'm at work) so I can't access the description from TPTP. I do recall Foul's Creche being absolutely symmetrical, in keeping with his perfectionist nature.

dw

[rdhopeca]

Any chance at all this 'faery castle' is Foul's Creche? I don't have the books with me (I'm at work) so I can't access the description from TPTP. I do recall Foul's Creche being absolutely symmetrical, in keeping with his perfectionist nature.

dw

I believe the Creche fell into the sea. And having thought about it, I don't recall Doriendor Corishev fitting this description either.

[DukkhaWaynhim]

Um, hello, don't forget time travel, people....

I don't think I'm right, I just wanted to throw out my own guess.

dw

[sweetbread]

Um, hello, don't forget time travel, people....

This is absolutely true. Jeremiah KNEW the Theomach. If the Theomach really "died" in The One Tree (it's stated somewhere that the Theomach is now out of the picture, so it's safe to assume that he did die), then the only way that Jeremiah would have known him would either be through access to the past, or if Jeremiah's mind was in the Land since Covenant's summoning in the second Chronicles. However, since the Theomach became the Guardian during Berek's time, it seems unlikely that he would have been in contact with Jeremiah while he was guarding the One Tree.... also, Jeremiah actually spoke to the Vizard, who gave his life to compel another Insequent long before the time of Covenant.

Therefore, I do believe that Jeremiah did have access to the Land's past.... hence, it is plausable that it was in fact Foul's Creche, however, I find it unlikely that Foul would have inhabited such an ornate place....


New Theory!! Maybe it IS Foul's Creche, and Jeremiah's lego sculptures are the places where Lord Foul resides, or has resided in the past. Foul's Creche, Mount Thunder, the Arch of Time, are all places where Lord Foul has dwelt, however, Revelstone is not. But Foul said that "They (the Bloodguard) serve me without knowing it," so maybe Revelstone is where Foul resides in this series. It would make sense, the Master's living in such a close proximity to Corruption would definitely make them susceptible to the whispered manipulations of Foul....

[wayfriend]

The Theomach didn't die. He just faded away. Actually, he merged with an Elohim (supposition), and later merged with Brinn Haruchai. There's no reason to suspect he's dead AFAICT.

[sweetbread]

The Theomach didn't die. He just faded away. Actually, he merged with an Elohim (supposition), and later merged with Brinn Haruchai. There's no reason to suspect he's dead AFAICT.

Well, I believe it was mentioned somewhere (in a GI I believe) that Kenaustin would no longer play a part in the story as he is no longer needed, was something along the lines of how SRD put it IIRC.

So that means that Linden, in the present time, would be unable to invoke him according to his name....

faded away, merged, died, the end result is the same; he ain't comin' back!
















And Jeremiah, thus, would have been unable to talk to him in the present time of the Land....





















......unless, of course, he could only communicate with the Insequent who have passed along, which would explain why the Vizard could also speak to him. Actually, I don't think that he ever spoke directly with the Theomach until FR.... I think he may have spoken with other Insequent who have mentioned him, but that's all beside the point, I believe....

[wayfriend]

So that means that Linden, in the present time, would be unable to invoke him according to his name....

Yes, nitpicking, but Kenaustin Ardenol is immune from being invoked by his name. (I don't disagree with your main conclusion, tho.)

"Alone among the Insequent - so said the Vizard - the Theomach passed beyond self and craving to join the rare company of those who do not heed death. And therefore the Vizard did not scruple to reveal the Theomach's true name, for he could no longer be harmed by it."

And I agree, he no longer plays a part in the story, probably because he's sitting at the bottom of the ocean guarding the One Tree.

For, if Kenaustin Ardenol merged with the Elohim Guardian before him, as Brinn later merged with Kenaustin Ardenol (and the previously subsumed Elohim), then he would be part Elohim. Which would make him immortal: the rare company of those who do not heed death. And so too is ak-Haru Brinn.

-----

Jeremiah says he visited the Land in the past. (If he wasn't lying to cover up the fact that the Vizard is still alive.)

"Linden," Covenant suggested, his voice sloppy with springwine, "you should ask him where his mind has been all this time. He made it pretty obvious that he always had a mind. Where do you suppose it was?"

Linden kept her eyes and her heart fixed on her son. "Jeremiah? Can you tell me?"

So far, he had revealed nothing that might aid her.

He twitched his shoulders awkwardly. The tic of his eye increased its thetic signaling. "It's hard to explain. For a while" - he sighed - "I don't know how long, I was sort of hiding. It was like a different version of being in two places at once. Except the other place wasn't anywhere in particular. It was just away." Flames empty of daylight gave his face a ruddy flush, made him look feverish. "It was safe.

"But then you gave me that racecar set with all the tracks and pylons. When it was done-when you gave me enough pieces, and they were all connected in the right shapes-I had a" - he clung to Covenant with his eyes - "a loop. Like a worm that eats its own tail. I guess you could call it a door in my mind. I went through it. And when I did that, I came here.

"I don't mean 'here' the way I am now." He seemed to grope for words. "I wasn't a prisoner. I wasn't even physical. And I didn't come here - I mean to Revelstone - very often. There wasn't anybody I could talk to. But I was in the Land. I'm not sure when. I mean when in relation to now. Mostly I think it was a long time ago. But I was here pretty much whenever you put me to bed."

[IrrationalSanity]

Interesting. I'm not sure how much credit we can give Jerimiah's explanation, though, considering his being under the influence of a Kroyel and all. I'm sure it has elements of truth in it, though. Very rarely does anyone in TC world tell an out-and-out lie when a "half-truth" would do a better job.

[wayfriend]

I'm sure it has elements of truth in it, though. Very rarely does anyone in TC world tell an out-and-out lie when a "half-truth" would do a better job.

As I posted that, I was thinking along those lines, which is why I could not resist throwing in an "IF".

Suppose he's not lying.

That would mean his mind-presence had some sort of time travel ability, right?

Or would it mean that someone who did have time travel ability (Esmer, Kastenessen) was sort of pushing him around to different times?

But I'm a little bit convinced that this is a lie to cover up that the Vizard is still around somewhere.

[Mysteweave]

Jeremiah KNEW the Theomach.

No, he knew of him. I'm not at home, so I can't find the exact part, but when Jeremiah arrives in Berek's time and Linden, "TC" and the Theomach are already there, he recognises him because of what others have told him, TC, the Vizard, etc.

He'd never actually met him before.

Of course, I could be remembering wrong, in which case, please ignore me.