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[Elfgirl]

Hey guys...

I do appreciate your opinions, truly - and the reason I have such an extreme view about what should breed & what shouldn't is based on the way governments pay the stupid & useless welfare trash money to perpetuate the same amount of welfare-hoovers! As an intelligent, single woman (at the time), trying to work full time and pay my mortgage, I am incensed that welfare sucking bitches (single as well) can get all manner of discounts, money for nothing - just cos they spread their legs & got pregnant. Creating a human being just for the money!!! So they can buy their frakking plasma TV. YES, that is the mentality that our government is REWARDING with MY TAXES (of which I pay and pay and never benefit from!!! NOBODY gives me bloody discounts on rates, utilities or 'free money'!)

When you work five days a week and only get less than FOUR DAYS worth pay back in your own pocket, you start to wonder why the f**k you are working. Socialist idiots who financially reward these brain-dead 'single mothers', and other welfare hoovers such as illegal immigrants, should be forced to house these people under their OWN roofs, paying for them with THEIR money. I want to send a message to all governments to put taxpayer's money to better use. By all means, build schools, hospitals and other public infrastructure, but STOP rewarding the lazy bastards who are just expecting a free ride of the taxpayers' back... 'in it for the money' without lifting a finger to contribute to society, other than producing another welfare hoover like themselves (let's face it, most of those children born of welfare whores are hardly given a fantastic role model!!)

To be fair, SOME women are forced to become single mothers - I have no problem with those women who are willing to work part time to support themselves and their children. I also have no objection to married couples who are both willing and able to work to support their kids - they can have as many as they can afford, as far as I'm concerned! Why? BECAUSE THEY WANT THESE CHILDREN FOR REASONS OTHER THAN FREE BENEFITS. My objections are that people have children for the wrong reasons, and then these kids go on to perpetuate that same mentality!!

If governments would just put their foot down & 'tough love' the welfare suckers (FINITE payments? MORE incentives to work rather than bludge? Three months of 'assistance' while you look for work?) Our stupid socialist prick government is only interested in screwing the working taxpayers while rewarding the bludgers. HOW is that fair to hard working, law abiding people? Protect the crims' rights, yet f**k over the victims'? Instead of making people stand on their own two feet (GROW THE F**K UP, in other words - THE WORLD DOES NOT OWE YOU A LIVING!) they go 'awwww, diddums...here, have some MORE money!' Haven't they figured out that the more you give people, the more they want? I believe in a hand UP, not a hand OUT. But the socialist pricks running our country have the opposite view it seems.

Sorry about ranting like this on a film thread, but the injustices and bullsh*t the working people have to deal with thanks to the suckhole welfare lobby really gets up my nose!! I should just resign & get on the dole, but because I'm not a 'minority', I'll probably get shafted & told to get another job soon or live off my savings...that happened to my fiance's mother! At 60, she is expected to find a job, after almost 12 years out of the work force due to injury and having a husband who supported her. Now he's left her, she has no income...yet the welfare bastards expect HER to get a job, while the refo trash currently invading our country get FREE housing, FREE money & all manner of assistance - and they're not even AUSTRALIAN CITIZENS!!! is it any wonder I have such a bone to pick with humanity??

I tell ya, KRudd & his bunch of suckholes are one step away from total annihilation by the working class...they are supposed to support the WORKERS, yet all they seem to be doing is handing OUR taxes over to useless third world interlopers who are probably not 'asylum seekers' but crims on the run from their OWN governments!!!

now I'll probably get a plethora of comments about being a 'racist' or something... What's wrong with trying to stand up for your own countrymen when your own government has sold you out to "foreign interests"? KRudd is sucking up to the UN for some reason - pity he forgot to ask his VOTERS whether he should...

[dANdeLION]

now I'll probably get a plethora of comments about being a 'racist' or something...

Not from me; on this I agree with you 100%!

[Elfgirl]

Not from me; on this I agree with you 100%!

Thanks ___! at least we can agree on something!

[wayfriend]

That said I do agree the government needs to get out of the business of patting people on the head with tax credits and deductions for having kids. ... Let taxes be used to raise revenue and end the use of taxation for social engineering.

Raising kids costs money. That's why you get a deduction: you need more of your income for basic needs. No ones trying to encourage anyone to have kids through taxes. We have ray guns for that. Yeesh.

Lots of things cost money. Why should I, as the parent of two children, get a break on my taxes while Jim down the street, who has no kids, does not? Why should I be favored by Government largess?

We have a progressive tax system in the US, where people who can afford less pay less. There are all kinds of VALID reasons to be against that. But claiming the child tax credit is to socially engineer more children, or claiming it is favoritism, aren't among them. (Favoritism? That's like the child who cries Not Fair when their sibling who had his/her tonsils out gets ice cream for dinner.)

[SerScot]

wayfriend,

Raising kids costs money. That's why you get a deduction: you need more of your income for basic needs. No ones trying to encourage anyone to have kids through taxes. We have ray guns for that. Yeesh.

Lots of things cost money. Why should I, as the parent of two children, get a break on my taxes while Jim down the street, who has no kids, does not? Why should I be favored by Government largess?

We have a progressive tax system in the US, where people who can afford less pay less. There are all kinds of VALID reasons to be against that. But claiming the child tax credit is to socially engineer more children, or claiming it is favoritism, aren't among them. (Favoritism? That's like the child who cries Not Fair when their sibling who had his/her tonsils out gets ice cream for dinner.)

Yes. But my point is one where I would lose money because I would lose the credit and deduction I get for my two children. My position is that there should be no deductions or credits and all tax rates (keeping the graduations) should be lowered. I don't like patting people on the head for owing but not for renting, for being married, but not unmarried, for having kids but not for being childless. None of that is the Government's business.

[Orlion]

now I'll probably get a plethora of comments about being a 'racist' or something...

I thought that was one of the most epic rants I've seen in a while... if it were in 3-D, it'd fit perfectly in this topic!

[wayfriend]

My position is that there should be no deductions or credits and all tax rates (keeping the graduations) should be lowered.

You get no argument from me there.

I don't like patting people on the head for owing but not for renting, for being married, but not unmarried, for having kids but not for being childless.

... but there you go misrepresenting the situation. You're still saying ice cream for dinner is unfair, because you are mischaracterizing relief as a reward. Tell me, do you think we're "rewarding" earthquake victims when we send them aid? We send them money, that makes it a reward, right? Hey ... are we socially engineering people to live on fault lines? Uh oh. (Not being sarcastic, just arguing by example.)

[dANdeLION]

I don't like patting people on the head for owing but not for renting, for being married, but not unmarried, for having kids but not for being childless.

If you don't like the child tax credit, or the theoretical extra money you get back by filing jointly, then file separately, don't claim dependents, and don't take the credits.

[finn]

Elfgirl,

You forgot to mention that legal migrants with visas get nothing upon entering the country. They bring their skills and doctors, nurses, teachers and sometimes pilots, dentists and other experienced professional, have to do two years in the bush before they can work in their professions in town.

If we have to accept these refugees (many of who are economic refugees or those unable to get in through the front door by legitimate means), Make the buggers contribute, by working in the regional and rural communities and have them "graduate" through their own good graces tio be able to work in the cities.

I get very angry at this as my best mate doesn't qualify, but he'd add to the worth of Australia tenfold, but he's prevented from living here whilst many parasites chip away at cracks in the system meant foir the truly and genuinely needful. These people erode the lifeboat.

[dANdeLION]

Okay, I know I prolly didn't catch every nuance of Avatar the first time through, but I'm pretty damn sure none of what you're talking about has anything to do with the movie.

[Zarathustra]

Hey guys...

I do appreciate your opinions, truly - and the reason I have such an extreme view about what should breed & what shouldn't is based on the way governments pay the stupid & useless welfare trash money to perpetuate the same amount of welfare-hoovers! As an intelligent, single woman (at the time), trying to work full time and pay my mortgage, I am incensed that welfare sucking bitches (single as well) can get all manner of discounts, money for nothing - just cos they spread their legs & got pregnant. Creating a human being just for the money!!! So they can buy their frakking plasma TV. YES, that is the mentality that our government is REWARDING with MY TAXES (of which I pay and pay and never benefit from!!! NOBODY gives me bloody discounts on rates, utilities or 'free money'!)

When you work five days a week and only get less than FOUR DAYS worth pay back in your own pocket, you start to wonder why the f**k you are working. Socialist idiots who financially reward these brain-dead 'single mothers', and other welfare hoovers such as illegal immigrants, should be forced to house these people under their OWN roofs, paying for them with THEIR money. I want to send a message to all governments to put taxpayer's money to better use. By all means, build schools, hospitals and other public infrastructure, but STOP rewarding the lazy bastards who are just expecting a free ride of the taxpayers' back... 'in it for the money' without lifting a finger to contribute to society, other than producing another welfare hoover like themselves (let's face it, most of those children born of welfare whores are hardly given a fantastic role model!!)

...


If governments would just put their foot down & 'tough love' the welfare suckers (FINITE payments? MORE incentives to work rather than bludge? Three months of 'assistance' while you look for work?) Our stupid socialist prick government is only interested in screwing the working taxpayers while rewarding the bludgers. HOW is that fair to hard working, law abiding people? Protect the crims' rights, yet f**k over the victims'? Instead of making people stand on their own two feet (GROW THE F**K UP, in other words - THE WORLD DOES NOT OWE YOU A LIVING!) they go 'awwww, diddums...here, have some MORE money!' Haven't they figured out that the more you give people, the more they want? I believe in a hand UP, not a hand OUT. But the socialist pricks running our country have the opposite view it seems.

As I said before, you'll not get much argument from me on the issue of welfare. I can certainly sympathize with frustration over people abusing the system ... the producers supporting the nonproducers.

Sorry about ranting like this on a film thread, but the injustices and bullsh*t the working people have to deal with thanks to the suckhole welfare lobby really gets up my nose!!

You should contribute more in the Tank! We need passionate views like this. You definitely have a unique perspective I've not seen expressed there ... the combination of a conservative view of welfare + a liberal view of environmental "extremism" (if you'll pardon the term).

now I'll probably get a plethora of comments about being a 'racist' or something... What's wrong with trying to stand up for your own countrymen when your own government has sold you out to "foreign interests"? KRudd is sucking up to the UN for some reason - pity he forgot to ask his VOTERS whether he should...

You won't get comment about being 'racist' from me! I don't see this as racist. I feel similarly toward illegal immigrants from Mexico (though I have no problem with legal, contributing, immigrants).

Interesting perspective.

[dANdeLION]

Was it just me, or did Colonel Miles Quaritch look and act EXACTLY like Major Chip Hazard from Small Soldiers?

[danlo]

^edit--right: who I referred to as GI Joe^

Should have seen this at the theater...in any case...I was entertained. Expected better dialogue from Cameron and at least Sigourney's character...empathized with Sully, (funny how the shaman says: Jakesully exactly as Kicking Bird says: Johndunbar) but he kept sounding like a poor man's Gibson in Braveheart. Liked Giovanni, but not so much 'GI Joe scarface' (thought the robot warrior already over done in the final Matrix movie). Though it was a great ideal that could in no way be squeezed into a mere 3 hours, I'd, still, pay 10 bucks to see the full 3-D effects on the big screen.

[High Lord Tolkien]

Once again I clicked this thread thinking it was about the Last Airbender movie.

Awesome post Elfgirl!

[SerScot]

Have y'all seen the Avatar Scriptiment?

www.docstoc.com/docs/14294813/Avatar-Sc ... es-Cameron

Here's a discussion of the scriptiment:

www.chud.com/articles/articles/21969/1/ ... Page1.html

I think it would have been a better movie.

[wayfriend]

I think it would have been a better movie.

Okay, but ...

- Earth and its environmental problems are explored ... a very Blade Runner dystopia - rainy and gray and filthy and high tech. The people are miserable and stink because of water shortages. The entire surface of the Earth is essentially industrialized ...
...
- It's revealed the Avatar program exists to train Na'vi to be an indigenous workforce for the Corporation, since it's so expensive to send human workers
...
- Pandora is a living entity and it sees the humans as a virus; it has been mobilizing the plants and animals to attack all along because it wanted to force the humans out
- There is no unobtainium beneath Hometree. The military just wants to wipe out the local Na'vi to send a message to all the tribes that they must be obeyed.

Yikes, imagine what this thread would be like.

[ItisWritten]

Yikes, imagine what this thread would be like.

Would that be the-thread-that-almost-was?

Hopefully no one will write it.

[Menolly]

What do y'all think about the re-release of Avatar, supposedly with less than ten minutes of additional footage? I enjoyed the experiences of seeing it in 3-D and in IMAX 3-D once each, but I think for additional footage I can wait for another DVD release...

[SerScot]

Wayfriend,

Here's the thing. I think the scriptiment version of Avatar would have gone a long way to deal with people's complaints about this movie. More fully fleshed out characters, better explanations for what was going on, fewer complaints about the Great White Man coming in to save the Na'vi.

Avatar isn't a short movie but it's interesting to me that many of the elements I would have liked to see were cut for time. Good grief a simple explanation of what the Unobtainium was would have dealt with a huge complaint of mine. Why the price of the mineral was so freaking high.

[wayfriend]

I actually watched Avatar, for the second time, this weekend.

Interestingly enough, a lot of interesting nuggets from the posted scriptment poked through. For example, Scully's line about 'we killed our mother' certainly refers back to the poisoned Earth beginning of that scripment. Or the early image of the arrows prickling the tires on the returning trucks, an allusion to human/Na'vi battles which the final movie never really otherwise admits happened.

Speaking seriously, I am sure a lot of things had to be dropped to make the final movie. And that tends to require changing a lot of the things that remain, as they either don't make sense or don't make good movie after the other things are cut. (And I wonder how much was reserved for an Avatar II and III, or cut under the assumption Avatar II and III could bring it back.)

SerScot, yes, I agree, the scriptment does fill in a lot of plot holes, and that would have pleased a lot of the movie's detractors here. Another class of detractors found the story unoriginal; I don't think the would find the original version an improvement. And then there is another class of movie detractor found here, who seemed to think the movie suffered from an overbearing save-the-environment message. I think the scriptment, if anything, is even more overbearing in that regard. I guess that's what I was referring to when I said, Imagine this thread.