TC Musings, Q & A, Dissecting Against All Things Ending
Moderators: kevinswatch, Orlion
- Orlion
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 6666
- Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2007 12:30 am
- Location: Getting there...
- Been thanked: 1 time
Indeed, opportunities like these won't last... and it'll be about three years until you get one final chance!
'Tis dream to think that Reason can
Govern the reasoning creature, man.
- Herman Melville
I am Lazarus, come from the dead,
Come back to tell you all, I shall tell you all!
"All creation is a huge, ornate, imaginary, and unintended fiction; if it could be deciphered it would yield a single shocking word."
-John Crowley
Govern the reasoning creature, man.
- Herman Melville
I am Lazarus, come from the dead,
Come back to tell you all, I shall tell you all!
"All creation is a huge, ornate, imaginary, and unintended fiction; if it could be deciphered it would yield a single shocking word."
-John Crowley
- Frostheart Grueburn
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 1827
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:47 pm
- Location: Gianthome
Summoning up zombie-topics again, but I've been laughing at the first two or so pages of comments about size/proportions on this thread, and also spent some time shaking my head at the various cover representations of Foamfollower, etc. Just can't wrap my mind around the idea that they'd be merely some lanky humans.*
So here's one scale/size alternative showing some variations (and everyone's of course entitled to imagine them as they prefer). It was actually quite fun to sketch, and at one point I noticed I had calculated some of my own earlier references a foot or so off. Rather rough and likely contains some bloody anatomical errors due to an unthorough check, but cleaning up the inking on this amount of characters would devour a considerable amount of hours. Probably as close to SRD's descriptions I personally can ever get, however.![Razz :P](./images/smilies/icon_razz.gif)
![Image](covenant.sagazorm.net/koot2.jpg)
Always thought the males particularly would sport disproportionately large feet to help balance their weight, and hands to match. Don't know if the Land's physics agree with those of ours, but the rule twice the size = eight times the weight still stands. So even with the daintiest Giantess, we'd begin with around 400 kilos. You wouldn't want one to step on you.
*While the art isn't bad, Briny the Pirate & co just...eäääh...
![Image](sagazorm.net/roinaa/ranska_tptpkansi.jpg)
![Razz :P](./images/smilies/icon_razz.gif)
So here's one scale/size alternative showing some variations (and everyone's of course entitled to imagine them as they prefer). It was actually quite fun to sketch, and at one point I noticed I had calculated some of my own earlier references a foot or so off. Rather rough and likely contains some bloody anatomical errors due to an unthorough check, but cleaning up the inking on this amount of characters would devour a considerable amount of hours. Probably as close to SRD's descriptions I personally can ever get, however.
![Razz :P](./images/smilies/icon_razz.gif)
![Image](covenant.sagazorm.net/koot2.jpg)
Always thought the males particularly would sport disproportionately large feet to help balance their weight, and hands to match. Don't know if the Land's physics agree with those of ours, but the rule twice the size = eight times the weight still stands. So even with the daintiest Giantess, we'd begin with around 400 kilos. You wouldn't want one to step on you.
*While the art isn't bad, Briny the Pirate & co just...eäääh...
![Image](sagazorm.net/roinaa/ranska_tptpkansi.jpg)
Last edited by Frostheart Grueburn on Wed May 22, 2013 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
- wayfriend
- .
- Posts: 20957
- Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:34 am
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 4 times
And it's just as fun to see! Since I commented on your last image showing the relative sizes of men and Giants, I feel compelled to say that this one has addressed everything I had complained about so petulantly before.Zorm wrote:So here's one scale/size alternative showing some variations (and everyone's of course entitled to imagine them as they prefer).
As for the feet - I always go by the old methematical standby: double the height means four times the surface area and eight times the weight, barring any other considerations. Therefore, Giants proportioned as humans would have double the pressure on their poor feet (eight times the weight distributed over only four times the surface area). Therefore, I find it perfectly arguable that their feet would be proportionally larger than ours in order to naturally distribute the extra pressure. On the other hand, you could argue that they are stronger and more obdurate and so don't need this. Either way works for me. But smaller feet would be right out!
.
- Shuram Gudatetris
- <i>Haruchai</i>
- Posts: 683
- Joined: Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:48 pm
- Location: Cameron, Missouri
- Contact:
- Frostheart Grueburn
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 1827
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:47 pm
- Location: Gianthome
Thanks everyone. ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
Can't visualize it, really, what with having been influenced by artists like Kristjan Raud to some extent (can't find the image that's sitting in the front cover of my Kalevipoeg paperback on Google, but he quite much sports Pitchwife's feet).
Have to conclude that SRD's not always consistent with his descriptions, however. Particularly this about Pitchwife: 'An arm's reach' taller from TWL and this from WGW...
Now, to balance all that tittytalk in the earlier pages, this finally calls for some Pure One...![Razz :P](./images/smilies/icon_razz.gif)
ETA: here's one of those humorous giant statues around Tallinna... Even with the perspective, feet.
www.myworldshots.com/Estonia/Tallinn/Ka ... 13084.html
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
To add a personal opinion: I think Giants with teeny tiny nubs for feet would appear ludicrous.wayfriend wrote:And it's just as fun to see! Since I commented on your last image showing the relative sizes of men and Giants, I feel compelled to say that this one has addressed everything I had complained about so petulantly before.Zorm wrote:So here's one scale/size alternative showing some variations (and everyone's of course entitled to imagine them as they prefer).
As for the feet - I always go by the old methematical standby: double the height means four times the surface area and eight times the weight, barring any other considerations. Therefore, Giants proportioned as humans would have double the pressure on their poor feet (eight times the weight distributed over only four times the surface area). Therefore, I find it perfectly arguable that their feet would be proportionally larger than ours in order to naturally distribute the extra pressure. On the other hand, you could argue that they are stronger and more obdurate and so don't need this. Either way works for me. But smaller feet would be right out!
![Laughing :lol:](./images/smilies/icon_lol.gif)
Have to conclude that SRD's not always consistent with his descriptions, however. Particularly this about Pitchwife: 'An arm's reach' taller from TWL and this from WGW...
Re-linked that older image to the particular thread. Took a little while to hunt down the individual files on my computer after the removals (still can't locate some cropped items...).Linden started after him, then turned back to Pitchwife. He still stood on the rim of the hill, gazing down into the river's rush as if it would carry his heart away. Though he was half again as tall as Linden, his deformed spine and grotesque features made him appear old and frail.
Koh the Face Stealer came and went, but he's still doing his best and tuning into the spirit of this first-ever question!Ananda wrote:I like how, even without a face, TC is still in a bad mood in that picture.
Serpreme wrote:why is TC always so PO?
Now, to balance all that tittytalk in the earlier pages, this finally calls for some Pure One...
![Razz :P](./images/smilies/icon_razz.gif)
ETA: here's one of those humorous giant statues around Tallinna... Even with the perspective, feet.
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
- Frostheart Grueburn
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 1827
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:47 pm
- Location: Gianthome
Double post, but on the heels of the cover art rantage, remembered this gem from the GI:
I can just about spot an allusion to Pitchwife, but a rhinoceros... Maria Antoinette... What. Who are these??? When did Hawkman appear in the Land?? Can we meet the bearded version of Aquaman from the cartoon also??
Some insanely masochistic part of myself almost wants to see this concoction.Where cover art and leeway are concerned, there is enormous variety. Some publishers refuse to let their artists read the book --
You may be interested to know that Darrel K. Sweet's original cover for WGW depicted Marie Antoinette, the Hunchback of Notre Dame, and a rhinoceros confronting Hawkman. First I wept. Then I screamed. Fortunately the success of TOT gave me the clout to insist on changes.
(01/10/2007)
![Shocked 8O](./images/smilies/icon_eek.gif)
- Vraith
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 10621
- Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:03 pm
- Location: everywhere, all the time
I'd forgotten about that, but now you mention it I cracked up, again, and really really do want to see that cover. [like I'd love to read what the original Linden was like, mentioned in the most recent interview posted...but will surely never get to]
[spoiler]Sig-man, Libtard, Stupid piece of shit. change your text color to brown. Mr. Reliable, bullshit-slinging liarFucker-user.[/spoiler]
the difference between evidence and sources: whether they come from the horse's mouth or a horse's ass.
"Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation."
the hyperbole is a beauty...for we are then allowed to say a little more than the truth...and language is more efficient when it goes beyond reality than when it stops short of it.
the difference between evidence and sources: whether they come from the horse's mouth or a horse's ass.
"Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation."
the hyperbole is a beauty...for we are then allowed to say a little more than the truth...and language is more efficient when it goes beyond reality than when it stops short of it.
- wayfriend
- .
- Posts: 20957
- Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:34 am
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 4 times
I can only think a rhinocerous was someone's interpretation of a coarser. I think at one point SRD pointed out that artists were given very vague descriptions and discouraged from actually reading the book.
If they are confronting Hawkman, that must be Gibbon. Perhaps someone thought that a chasible was something with wings?
Hawkman
![Image](3.bp.blogspot.com/_gWQaU40PH24/SdlCNoxNfoI/AAAAAAAABvc/6bJ9LzTTY9M/s400/78447-81886-hawkman_super.jpg)
If they are confronting Hawkman, that must be Gibbon. Perhaps someone thought that a chasible was something with wings?
Hawkman
![Image](3.bp.blogspot.com/_gWQaU40PH24/SdlCNoxNfoI/AAAAAAAABvc/6bJ9LzTTY9M/s400/78447-81886-hawkman_super.jpg)
.
- Lefdmae Deemalr Effaeldm
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 2943
- Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 12:45 pm
- Location: Deep in psychotic, warped and weird thoughts
I thought a rhinoceros was supposed to be a sandgorgon. Nom, more specifically, especially keeping in mind the fight with Gibbon, if Hawkman is supposed to be him.
Edit: (didn't mention the posts further above at first)
And one more awesome artwork, Zorm! Aren't you afraid people may just get used to the high quality?)
I remember LF was said to look like he could be a human or he could be a giant, that may mean the difference is not too much, or at least can be used as an excuse to say so) But no guarantee - it could well be that it was so hard to actually see him that such an err was possible.
Edit: (didn't mention the posts further above at first)
And one more awesome artwork, Zorm! Aren't you afraid people may just get used to the high quality?)
I remember LF was said to look like he could be a human or he could be a giant, that may mean the difference is not too much, or at least can be used as an excuse to say so) But no guarantee - it could well be that it was so hard to actually see him that such an err was possible.
Last edited by Lefdmae Deemalr Effaeldm on Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Frostheart Grueburn
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 1827
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:47 pm
- Location: Gianthome
I also considered the rhino might represent either Nom or a courser, and even a truly misunderstood Honninscrave (since he killed Gibbon).
Now to muse on the mystery of Marie: Linden or The First with an awful hairdo, their heads hopefully still standing atop their shoulders (though some thoolahians might disagree...does The First have her own hate-club?).
![Laughing :lol:](./images/smilies/icon_lol.gif)
- Lefdmae Deemalr Effaeldm
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 2943
- Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 12:45 pm
- Location: Deep in psychotic, warped and weird thoughts
- Frostheart Grueburn
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 1827
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:47 pm
- Location: Gianthome
[EDITED]
Boo, looks like I had worded that a bit poorly again. Apparently when I'm tired, my vocabulary devolves back into Ur-Pre-Proto-Ugric, more at home with hunting deer and finger-painting hairy mammoths on cave walls. Dx
Re: Quality: I'm glad and delighted that you find that 'high-quality', but for me and my 'personal work standards', it's a fairly rough sketch (even if it does take a while to compile). ^^; Unfinished body parts, no faces, etc. Didn't mean to sound dissing. But, I'm going to keep posting sketches besides the occasional finished work, probably even rougher than the one above, since I usually need help or feedback with something regarding them. There's one in the AATE forum right now that might need some ideas with ur-viles, for instance.
Are you sure about Linden? Some old promo material regarding the 2nd chrons still appear to float around, almost as interesting as your Russian dragon covers...
![Image](img534.imageshack.us/img534/2470/gswp.jpg)
Boo, looks like I had worded that a bit poorly again. Apparently when I'm tired, my vocabulary devolves back into Ur-Pre-Proto-Ugric, more at home with hunting deer and finger-painting hairy mammoths on cave walls. Dx
Re: Quality: I'm glad and delighted that you find that 'high-quality', but for me and my 'personal work standards', it's a fairly rough sketch (even if it does take a while to compile). ^^; Unfinished body parts, no faces, etc. Didn't mean to sound dissing. But, I'm going to keep posting sketches besides the occasional finished work, probably even rougher than the one above, since I usually need help or feedback with something regarding them. There's one in the AATE forum right now that might need some ideas with ur-viles, for instance.
Are you sure about Linden? Some old promo material regarding the 2nd chrons still appear to float around, almost as interesting as your Russian dragon covers...
![Image](img534.imageshack.us/img534/2470/gswp.jpg)
- Savor Dam
- Will Be Herd!
- Posts: 6152
- Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:02 am
- Location: Pacific NorthWet
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 4 times
I had always interpreted the rhino as a Nom reference as well. The hunchback I assumed was Honniscrave when he was trapped in the floor of the Hall of Gifts (similar to how he is shown in the eventually-used Sweet cover art). Hawkman being Gibbon and Marie Antoinette being Linden were given things...
Love prevails.
~ Tracie Mckinney-Hammon
Change is not a process for the impatient.
~ Barbara Reinhold
A government which robs Peter to pay Paul, can always count on the support of Paul.
~ George Bernard Shaw
~ Tracie Mckinney-Hammon
Change is not a process for the impatient.
~ Barbara Reinhold
A government which robs Peter to pay Paul, can always count on the support of Paul.
~ George Bernard Shaw
- Frostheart Grueburn
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 1827
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:47 pm
- Location: Gianthome
Yes, because everyone knows all giants are hideous, deformed berks called Grawp and Hurrgh with the IQ of an ant's shoe, and they'll throw you into the cooking pot the next chance they get. ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
Someone should photoshop this cover for us.
EDIT: It's a contest now.
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
Someone should photoshop this cover for us.
EDIT: It's a contest now.