Timeless Rock Albums

[sgt.null]

Vraith - the best Dead album is American Beauty. and it is a great album. Friend of the Devil, Box of Rain, Ripple / Brokedown Palace, Sugar Magnolia, Til the Morning Comes - all amazing songs.

[dANdeLION]

I'm visualizing in my mind three intersecting axes:

Edge: Earnest <――――> Decadent
Emotion: Raw <――――> Ironic
Sound: Spare <――――> Indulgent

The hypothesis is that anytime a rock milieu develops too far down an axis, it will induce a cultural break that is at least in part antipode. Let's consider a few test cases:

British Invasion - a roots movement whose raw emotion overthrew ironic popular music

Jimi Hendrix Experience / Dylan Goes Electric (Blues) - a further development of roots from a spare folk aesthetic into a more indulgent sound

Prog Rock & Heavy Metal Kill Hendrix & Joplin - the triumphant return of irony

Punk / NWOBHM vs. AOR / Arena Rock - ironic indulgence put in a cage by snarling raw, spare movements

Glam Is Back, With Mousse - ironic, decadent jailbreak

GnR Kicks the Poseurs To The Curb - irony takes a boot of raw emotion to the skull

Anti-Rockstar Rockstars - take your raw decadence and shove it, says Seattle, we're serving up earnest irony with your Starbucks

Jack White Doesn't Give A Fuck - earnest ironic pop rock bulldozed into an unmarked grave by a wall of raw power

It's just a theory folks, and I'm not sure it really works. Feel free to kick the crap out of it (like you needed permission...).

Your post is very ironic. I still cannot get over the irony of the term 'indulgent', or, more specifically 'self-indulgent', which is the first thing said the moment an artist attempts to rise above the boundaries imposed by the truly self-indulgent; I.E the record labels.

[Obi-Wan Nihilo]

It's quite elementary, really. Symphonic accompaniment and 7 minute drum solos are indulgent. BB King's playing and 2 minute punk rock songs are spare. That is the contrast I was evoking. Indulgence, BTW, does not rule out art. Some art is indulgent, some art is minimalist.

[Vraith]

Well, as a critical perspective/lens, I think you could get some insight and mileage out of it.
I'd think you'd consider a 4th dimension [though it might overlap/be included in what you have already...I'd have to think on it] along the lines of:

Atttitude [mode? function? stance?] communicative<------->masturbatory.

[Obi-Wan Nihilo]

That's interesting Vraith, it's one of those "what is art?" questions in a way. I probably spent an hour tinkering with the axes I posted, but it's hard to feel that they are anything resembling complete -- I wouldn't rule a wholesale revision either. What you have suggested is quite interesting, and like you I'll have to think about it, because the qualities I am trying to contrast all connect with their opposite as well as each other on some level.

Edit... Thinking out loud... is decadent irony inherently masturbatory? What about raw indulgence? Hmmm...

A few thoughts occurred to me just now in the shower (I do my best thinking in there): first, any major artist is going to both transcend (i.e., span) the axes as well as evolve along them. Second, the enduring worth of art itself is likely linked to this ability to span and incorporate contrasting aesthetics. For instance, Pink Floyd manages to span raw emotion and irony in their seminal works (but, they are always earnest). And third, there is a kind of Sun <――――> Moon dynamic along the axes I mentioned. An unbalanced spectrum of too much unalloyed Sun or Moon limits the evocative transcendence of the music in question.

[Obi-Wan Nihilo]

Perhaps "indulgent" is the wrong word seeing as it's a loaded term. "Extravagant" might be better.

[lucimay]

timeless....hmmm


axis; bold as love, are you experienced, electric ladyland

sgt. pepper, rubber soul, the white album

disraeli gears

blind faith

john barleycorn must die

thick as a brick, aqualung, warchild

led zepplin II, III, IV, and Houses of the Holy

tales from topographic oceans, yessongs, fragile

strange days, morrison hotel

american beauty

music from big pink, stagefright



these are just the ones off the top of my head that i feel fall under the topic heading "rock"

(so yeah...no CSN, Joni, or Rickie Lee Jones, nor Motown artists in there cause none of that is really "rock" to me)

[Wildling]

Classic albums?

Hmm ....

Slayer - Reign In Blood
Def Leppard - Pyromania ( I'd say Hysteria but I find it too ... poppy ... at times)
AC/DC - Back In Black
Megadeth - Peace Sells
Anthrax - Among The Living
Deep Purple - Machine Head
X - Live at the Whisky a Go-Go (I don't know if this counts since it's a live album instead of a studio album of new material. If it doesn't count then sub in Los Angeles)
ZZ Top - Eliminator
U2 - The Joshua Tree
Stevie Ray Vaughan - In Step
Sonic Youth - Goo and Daydream Nation
Sex Pistols - Never Mind The Bollocks
INXS - Kick
Huey Lewis & The News -Sports (Calm down. It's a good album. AND their most well known.)
Fleetwood Mac - Rumours
Black Sabbath - Paranoid