Star Trek

[Fist and Faith]

OK, how about The Inner Light, when Picard is zapped by that 1,000 year old probe, and, while he's unconscious for about 25 minutes, lives a lifetime on that planet!!!! That's SO awesome!!! Can you imagine??? They didn't show any of the trouble he MUST have had for at least days keeping straight which life he was in. Reality probably reasserted itself, but there's no way those memories of his family, friends, and that planet could vanish.

[Ylva Kresh]

What I like about "Inner light" is the soft, confortable, "anti-stressful" way it is told. There is no rush in the narration even though the story leaps for many years at some points. It is like nothing happens but still there is a fond memory of something left when the story is told. I think that this acctually set the episode apart for most other STNG episodes. We have seen the same theme (transported to alien world due to strange reason) many times, but this is the only one I think have captured a feeling (it made me feel for the people of this world, you seldom have the time to get to know new worlds in ST I think).

[aTOMiC]

Inner Light is one of my favorite STNG episodes. You are left wondering how the Picard character will be able to deal with the disorientation he must have been feeling when he “returned” to himself. A very impressive effort.

[[Syl]]

The memories might have faded, but they definately didn't vanish, as evinced by him playing the ocarina/recorder thing... I think I even remember a reference to it in one of the recent movies.

[Skyweir]

that was a good episode ..

there are so many really great STNG ones ..

[Fist and Faith]

Ylva,
You're absolutely right. I never thought of it that way. I imagine the writers were going for that, and it's kinda surprising that they pulled it off. As you say, it sets it apart from other Trek episodes, and from tv in general, where the point is to wow us in the allotted timespan. But since the people who built the probe didn't want whoever ran into it to learn of any specific events, but their overall culture/lives, it makes sense that the episode unfolded the way it did.

[Zahir]

My problem with TNG often lies in the fact that while events are mentioned now and then, the natural changes that would occur in characters as a result of them are almost never explored.

"The Inner Light" is a good example of that. Picard, imo, would require months of therapy after that--from his pov, he hasn't been a starship captain for decades!!!!!! Likewise when he was tortured by the Cardassians--you don't simply go back to the work the next day and have a few conversations with Counselor Troi.

Another problem--and this one I put squarely on Gene Roddenberry--is how there was almost no drama of any kind between the regular characters. It was the heart's blood of TOS, with the whole Kirk/Spock/McCoy dynamic. In fact, DS9 and VOY and ENT have all had to get around this somehow, because Roddenberry "decreed" that there were no internal conflicts among Starfleet crew members. In other words--no drama. So many of the best episodes of TNG were about crew members reacting on their own with guest stars (one that stick in my head is when Data was stolen by a collector of rare items--and reluctantly came to the conclusion that the only moral thing for him to do was commit murder).

Yet TNG had so much potential that way! I sooooo wanted Ryker to not see Data as sentient, for there to be continued sexual tension between Dr. Crusher and Captain Picard, etc. But then, the writers consistently showed themselves ham-fisted when trying to something like that--the second doctor's response to Data, for example.

For that matter, the most dramatic job to give Data would have been Chief Medical Officer! Here would be a supremely brilliant physician, one with a knowledge of treatments and diseases and possibilities far beyond anything any human is capable of--with skills as a surgeon almost beyond belief--and utterly clueless when it came to bedside manner. Now that would have been dramatic!

But no...

And notice how they never could figure out what to do with a genuinely strong female character, a la Ensign Ro (the most criminally underused character in all of TREK imo).

[Fist and Faith]

Yup. No question that the Kirk/Spock/McCoy dynamic was sorely missing. There was some romance that was little more than hinted at, but that's too easy. For me, the same-gender relationships are more difficult, and refreshing. Worf and Riker had a couple of episodes, but then Worf asked Picard to be his cha'DIch in the incredible Sins of the Father. No idea why not Riker.

My only explanation for the apparent ease of Picard's ability to distinguish his "two lives" is that the probe worked that way. They wouldn't have wanted to make the being it found crazy, so maybe it was built to allow it to be that easy. The probe was already doing impossible stuff, so what's one more thing?

The torture is another matter. I'm not sure if the fact that only an extraordinarily strong-willed person could become captain of the fleet's flagship is explanation enough for his recovery.

And the worst thing about Ro? That episode where she and Geordi were phased and invisible. From a "scientific" standpoint, has there ever been a more poorly written, self-contradicting episode of any tv show?

[Skyweir]

I may have tunnel vision when it comes to Star Trek ..particularly the SNG and Voyager .. but I .. personally .. really liked the lack of drama.

And thats one of the things I really didnt like was the soap opera-style of series DS9 became. I never enjoyed the silly romances in the original series .. Lord Trevor love the original series but I cant come to an appreciation of it as it is sooooo gender-sensitive I cant stand it at all.

You have a point Zahir .. as to the lack of credible responses to real life crises .. like the Cardassian torture episode for example .. Picard was shown to have greater difficulty getting over the time he spent with the Borg tho'.

But yes i agree .. Picard is portrayed .. as pretty much .. invulnerable, as most of the main characters seem to be ..

As far as ensign ro .. to me she wasnt a particularly real or interesting presence in the crew.

And as for data .. what was wrong with him do you think? To me he was perfect in his role .. he was supposed to be a little wooden .. and through his character all sorts of issues were raised. His desire for personality, humour, sexual experience etcc.

One of the things I value in all the star trek series .. even including the original series .. and particularly the original series .. is how the series is used to explore ethical issues, and can often relate to real world current concerns imho .. like racial profiling/prejudice .. genocide .. power .. greed .. commercial/economic interests over human/environmental concerns .. technology .. and I just love the notion of the federation .. and the 'prime directive' and all that entails ..

I loathed Enterprise as I guess it was primarily pre-prime directive .. and lost a lot because of that .. but i just didnt take to teh characters as quickly in this series .. tho' the vulcan female was probably my fav.

[dlbpharmd]

DS9 is my fav - I thought it consistently had the best writing. TNG was good too.

Can't stand Enterprise.

Voyager was OK, but I grew tired of seeing them get their tails whipped every week.

TOS? Can't watch it any longer, too corny.

[Skyweir]

yeah i dont know how popular Enterprise was in general? but i dont know anyone who actually liked it ..

we would come home after Uni to sit down and watch late night star trek .. and not miss a one intentionally .. but when Enterprise came on and after a few episodes .. it was like .. ehhh .. who cares? *shrug*

[aTOMiC]

yeah i dont know how popular Enterprise was in general? but i dont know anyone who actually liked it ..

we would come home after Uni to sit down and watch late night star trek .. and not miss a one intentionally .. but when Enterprise came on and after a few episodes .. it was like .. ehhh .. who cares? *shrug*

I think the promise of Enterprise was universally exciting to most fans. I watched the first few episodes and though I was a little disappointed I was determined to give it a chance. Though I continue to tune in to at least the first few minutes of each episode, I am actively falling away from the franchise. The prospect of seeing some of the more interesting events that were hinted at as part of the history of Star Trek was the great allure of its concept. Enterprise has de evolved into a long nauseating string of dull programs akin to Voyager, DS9 and to a lesser extent STNG. I was hoping for a return to a more fun and interesting approach in the vein of the original series. Not so.

[aTOMiC]

A side note: After re watching Star Trek II and Star Trek VI, I have to conclude that Nicolas Meyer is the only person on the planet that "gets" what Star Trek is supposed to be like. I recomend that the powers that be jettison the current leadership and give the whole kit and kaboodle to NM. just a thought.

[Ryzel]

That is The Wrath of Khan and The Search for Spock, isn't it?

[aTOMiC]

That is The Wrath of Khan and The Search for Spock, isn't it?

The Wrath of Khan and The Undiscovered Country. Leonard Nimoy directed the Search for Spock.

[Ryzel]

Oh, yeah, sorry I thought you had written II and III. I have seen both, but that was a long time ago.

[aTOMiC]

Oh, yeah, sorry I thought you had written II and III. I have seen both, but that was a long time ago.

No problem.

[Ryzel]

In fact I have seen ALL the ST movies at one time or another.

[aTOMiC]

In fact I have seen ALL the ST movies at one time or another.

Earlier in this thread I outlined the depths of my irrational devotion to Star Trek and its film incarnations. I recently bought Nemesis on dvd completing the cycle of madness that forces me to partake of all things Star Trek. I draw the line at dressing up like a Klingon.

[Fist and Faith]

I still haven't seen Nemesis. Though I'm not avoiding it, it's not a burning drive, since I haven't been too thrilled with the movies in general.

But I agree that II and VI are the best. Great stuff! And, though Generations in general isn't that big a deal, the effects were amazing. I liked the Stellar Cartography room, and, of course, the crash of the saucer section was beyond belief!! First time seeing it, probably second too, I wanted to yell at the screen, "Stop! Please stop it already! I can't take anymore!!"