I love Fantasy Series, can't enough of the long story. But I need something that continues character and world development past the halfway point of the series.
I started The Sword of Truth Series and after Book 5 I was disgusted with how bad the story broke down to nothing but review of the previous books and "fluff" that really did nothing to advance the story. So, I'm pretty much done with that one. I'm too scared at reviews to bother going any further with it.
I'm reading ASOIAF and finished ASOS last night. I want to read AFFC but it's my understanding that it's only half a story and I'd need ADWD to finish the actual intended book...so I'm waiting for ADWD before I go any further with ASOIAF.
Should I bother with series such as:
The Sword of Shannara (spelling?)
The Wheel of Time
I know they're popular, but my research shows that the popular opinion is that they also stall out before they finish...
Please help me, I...must have...epic...fantasy series. [/Shatner] lol
I need some suggestions...
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Luke The Unbeliever
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I need some suggestions...
Brian: Who cured you?
Ex-Leper: Jesus did, sir. I was hopping along, minding my own business, all of a sudden, up he comes, cures me! One minute I'm a leper with a trade, next minute my livelihood's gone. Not so much as a by-your-leave! "You're cured, mate." Bloody do-gooder.
Brian: Well, why don't you go and tell him you want to be a leper again?
Ex-Leper: Uh, I could do that sir, yeah. Yeah, I could do that I suppose. What I was thinking was I was going to ask him if he could make me a bit lame in one leg during the middle of the week. You know, something beggable, but not leprosy, which is a pain in the @$$ to be blunt and excuse my French, sir.
Ex-Leper: Jesus did, sir. I was hopping along, minding my own business, all of a sudden, up he comes, cures me! One minute I'm a leper with a trade, next minute my livelihood's gone. Not so much as a by-your-leave! "You're cured, mate." Bloody do-gooder.
Brian: Well, why don't you go and tell him you want to be a leper again?
Ex-Leper: Uh, I could do that sir, yeah. Yeah, I could do that I suppose. What I was thinking was I was going to ask him if he could make me a bit lame in one leg during the middle of the week. You know, something beggable, but not leprosy, which is a pain in the @$$ to be blunt and excuse my French, sir.
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Fist and Faith
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I think the original Shannara trilogy is great fun. Lots of fun, creatures, fights, magic, etc. Never gets too deep, but there's a couple moments. Nothing new happened in the second series (Scions?), and I didn't bother going beyond that. (I tried Running with the Demon, but, imo, it wasn't good enough to go on.)
As always, READ EARTHSEA!
A Wizard of Earthsea
The Tombs of Atuan
The Farthest Shore
Tehanu
Dragonfly**
The Other Wind
**Dragonfly is a novella that can be found in a collection called Tales from Earthsea. Tales has some other stories set in the archipelago that are not part of the story arc of the six listed above. However, at least a couple of them are FANTASTIC, and all are at least very good.
As always, READ EARTHSEA!
A Wizard of Earthsea
The Tombs of Atuan
The Farthest Shore
Tehanu
Dragonfly**
The Other Wind
**Dragonfly is a novella that can be found in a collection called Tales from Earthsea. Tales has some other stories set in the archipelago that are not part of the story arc of the six listed above. However, at least a couple of them are FANTASTIC, and all are at least very good.
All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon
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stonemaybe
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an invasion from the next-door thread Try Julian May's 'Saga of the Exiles' (The many-Coloured Land, The Golden Torc, The Nonborn King, The Adversary) and then when you love that, there are the Galactic Milieau books that are based in the same universe (different time) (Jack The Bodiless, Diamond Mask, The Magnificat, and the prequel Intervention) but that link the story magnificently.
For another really meaty but not fantasy series try Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey/Maturin series. 21 books and their all as good as the first!
Aglithophile and conniptionist and spectacular moonbow beholder 16Jul11
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stonemaybe
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I'd steer away from Brooks's Shannara series - just peruse the first one, Sword of Shannara, and you'll find uncomfortable similarities with a certain other famous fantasy book whose acronym is LotR... I liked Brooke's Landover series much better, personally. And as for Jordan, you're still untainted, don't go there! The world is very good, but the characters and story steadily decline starting with book 4-5, and reach a nadir in book 10 that makes people want to puke at the thought of how much money and time they wasted on that. Book 11 is better, but really, don't go there... you don't want to finish a series just because you've read 11 books so far and it'd be all for nothing if you didn't read the last one!
Apart from this weird guy called Donaldson, there are lots of other interesting fantasy authors out there. For example, you might want to try the KW anthology
Apart from this weird guy called Donaldson, there are lots of other interesting fantasy authors out there. For example, you might want to try the KW anthology
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[Syl]
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Definately second the Malazan Book of the Fallen. Also, The Prince of Nothing series by R. Scott Bakker. For something a litle lighter, there's Tad Williams' Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn books. And, of course, there's either Latro in the Mist or The Wizard Knight by Gene Wolfe.
"It is not the literal past that rules us, save, possibly, in a biological sense. It is images of the past. Each new historical era mirrors itself in the picture and active mythology of its past or of a past borrowed from other cultures. It tests its sense of identity, of regress or new achievement against that past.”
-George Steiner
-George Steiner
As always, I'll plug Philip Jose Farmer's Riverworld series. Excellent stuff.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
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"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
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"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
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_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
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Roland of Gilead
- <i>Haruchai</i>
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A very under-rated epic fantasy is Paul Kearney's Monarchies of God. Excellent writing, good characters, complex plot. Kearney can cram more into a 300 page novel than a lot of authors with twice as many pages to work with.
It also has the advantage of being COMPLETED - five novels, all in affordable mass market paperbacks.
The story is a fantasy analogue of the Renaissance period - major characters include a king, an explorer/mariner, a magician, a priest and a soldier. In fact, the story of the soldier's rise from the ranks to command is the best I've ever read - it puts a lot of contemporary military and historical writers to shame.
It also has the advantage of being COMPLETED - five novels, all in affordable mass market paperbacks.
The story is a fantasy analogue of the Renaissance period - major characters include a king, an explorer/mariner, a magician, a priest and a soldier. In fact, the story of the soldier's rise from the ranks to command is the best I've ever read - it puts a lot of contemporary military and historical writers to shame.
"I am, in short, a man on the edge of everything." - Dark Tower II, The Drawing of the Three
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Ainulindale
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I agree with Erikson, and have to recommend R. Scott Bakker's Prince of Nothing Trilogy - required epic fantasy reading.
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"I think it's undignified to read for the purposes of escape. After you grow up, you should start reading for other purposes" - M. John Harrison
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Fantasybookspot.com
Check out the first issue of Heliotrope - featuring articles by R. Scott Bakker, Jeff VanderMeer and more!
"I think it's undignified to read for the purposes of escape. After you grow up, you should start reading for other purposes" - M. John Harrison
I've been meaing to read this for a while.Ainulindale wrote:and have to recommend R. Scott Bakker's Prince of Nothing Trilogy - required epic fantasy reading.
Must get round to it.
But if you're all about the destination, then take a fucking flight.
We're going nowhere slowly, but we're seeing all the sights.
And we're definitely going to hell, but we'll have all the best stories to tell.
Full of the heavens and time.
We're going nowhere slowly, but we're seeing all the sights.
And we're definitely going to hell, but we'll have all the best stories to tell.
Full of the heavens and time.
I have really enjoyed the books by Dennis L. McKiernan, for the reasons you describe: continuing world and character development. The books themselves take place in different ages of the world of Mithgar, and the older stories are often referenced as legends in the newer ones - and of course, various elves show up throughout.
The writing itself makes you care about the characters, who are constantly learning and developing throughout their adventures, and the tone is generally good-hearted.
The only complaint I've had is that they follow Tolkien a bit too slavishly (not as bad as Brooks, though), but even then, the twists on old icons is fairly refreshing.
You can start with any book, but the Hel's Crucible Duology is a pretty good place to start and get a feeling for the world and it's characters.
www.amazon.com/gp/product/0451454588/10 ... e&n=283155
The writing itself makes you care about the characters, who are constantly learning and developing throughout their adventures, and the tone is generally good-hearted.
The only complaint I've had is that they follow Tolkien a bit too slavishly (not as bad as Brooks, though), but even then, the twists on old icons is fairly refreshing.
You can start with any book, but the Hel's Crucible Duology is a pretty good place to start and get a feeling for the world and it's characters.
www.amazon.com/gp/product/0451454588/10 ... e&n=283155
“If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.”
-- James Madison
"If you're going to tell people the truth, you'd better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you." - George Bernard Shaw
-- James Madison
"If you're going to tell people the truth, you'd better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you." - George Bernard Shaw
Despite its flaws, I think Wheel of Time might be something you will like. Many of the people who think it stalls midway attribute that to the expansion of plotlines and characters. Something I actually liked. I hate series that want you to believe a grand world-wide conflict is taking place and confine it to a small cast and a small set.
Erikson, as others have mentioned, also might be up your alley. Definitely Bakker as the first three are the primo course and secundi is along the way.
Jacqueline Carey might be your cup of tea as well, though she write machination fantasy over real epic fantasy. No cosmic battles of good and evil, but some really nice complex studies in human nature and the struggle between people who have no morals and those who try to at least have some.
For new books, Scott Lynch's The Lies of Locke Lamora might be an interest to get in on the ground level. Nowhere near as complex as the others mentioned above, but it is a fun roller coaster of a ride (the others are trains -- the roller coaster, for all that you see everything coming, is still thrilling and enjoyable and the ride is what entertains you -- the trains are those books that take you on a real journey with sudden unexpected vistas unfolding and the readers reward not only the journey but the destaination as well).
Another series I recently reread is Melanie Rawn's Dragon Prince/Dragon Star series. It still holds up. Again. It is simplistic compared to some, because Rawn doesn't involve herself in trying to keep the reader guessing. The reader is in on the various efforts, plottings and plannings for the mot part. But she writes action well. She allows her "good" characters to do "bad" things out of necessity. She lets her characters plot and plan with the best of them -- in fact Rawn was one of the first to relaly delve into the realm of ambition and politics and allowing sheer greed and desire for power over others on a human scale to take center stage. There is romance but done so in not only believable fashion (for romatic fictionalization) but also with a healthy leavening of real relationship ups and downs. Rawn likes big casts of characters. Many of whom are pretty and handsome and noble. But it is fantasy after all (as Kate Elliott's clever blog rntry devles into).
C.J. Cherryh writes a great series which is often overlooked. The fifth book, Fortress of Ice (all have Fortress in their titles) comes out later this fall.
Lois McMaster Bujold writes great fantasy as well with three Chalion books out and a new duology set to start in about a month's time.
Erikson, as others have mentioned, also might be up your alley. Definitely Bakker as the first three are the primo course and secundi is along the way.
Jacqueline Carey might be your cup of tea as well, though she write machination fantasy over real epic fantasy. No cosmic battles of good and evil, but some really nice complex studies in human nature and the struggle between people who have no morals and those who try to at least have some.
For new books, Scott Lynch's The Lies of Locke Lamora might be an interest to get in on the ground level. Nowhere near as complex as the others mentioned above, but it is a fun roller coaster of a ride (the others are trains -- the roller coaster, for all that you see everything coming, is still thrilling and enjoyable and the ride is what entertains you -- the trains are those books that take you on a real journey with sudden unexpected vistas unfolding and the readers reward not only the journey but the destaination as well).
Another series I recently reread is Melanie Rawn's Dragon Prince/Dragon Star series. It still holds up. Again. It is simplistic compared to some, because Rawn doesn't involve herself in trying to keep the reader guessing. The reader is in on the various efforts, plottings and plannings for the mot part. But she writes action well. She allows her "good" characters to do "bad" things out of necessity. She lets her characters plot and plan with the best of them -- in fact Rawn was one of the first to relaly delve into the realm of ambition and politics and allowing sheer greed and desire for power over others on a human scale to take center stage. There is romance but done so in not only believable fashion (for romatic fictionalization) but also with a healthy leavening of real relationship ups and downs. Rawn likes big casts of characters. Many of whom are pretty and handsome and noble. But it is fantasy after all (as Kate Elliott's clever blog rntry devles into).
C.J. Cherryh writes a great series which is often overlooked. The fifth book, Fortress of Ice (all have Fortress in their titles) comes out later this fall.
Lois McMaster Bujold writes great fantasy as well with three Chalion books out and a new duology set to start in about a month's time.
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- Immanentizing The Eschaton
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Good post Gyrehead. I agree with you in part about the WoT. For all it's flaws, I like it. My problem was not the expansion of plots and characters, that, like you, I enjoy. But it is twofold...first, that so little actually happened in too many of the books, whereas the pace could have been evened out better, and second, that those plots are now being resolved with almost indecent haste, as Jordan runs out of books.
It deserves at least a few more books Ithink, rather than the one more that is planned. I fear too many things will be left dangling, or else it will be as frenetic as the latest book.
As for Rawn, I enjoy the Dragon Prince series and re-read it quite often. I must get around to the other series.
--A
It deserves at least a few more books Ithink, rather than the one more that is planned. I fear too many things will be left dangling, or else it will be as frenetic as the latest book.
As for Rawn, I enjoy the Dragon Prince series and re-read it quite often. I must get around to the other series.
--A
The only books in the series that dipped in quality for me in any way were the last three. And that is because in Winter's Heart I think Jordan made a strong and conscious effort to change the series from "ongoing" to "now we must end things". I think the series needed to go to thirteen or fourteen to truly address all the things I want addressed. And that is still being just fine knowing that Jordan wants to end the series with a "no nice neat packaged endings". But the last two books resolved things with much less detail than they were set up. Which should not happen.
If you enjoyed Rawn you might like Jennifer Fallon's Second Sons' trilogy (my apologies if you have already mentioned a liking or dislkining for them). She writes some okay fluff with her Hythrun Chronciles but the Second Sons series I really thought was clever and topnotch. And that advice goes out to everyone else as well.
If you enjoyed Rawn you might like Jennifer Fallon's Second Sons' trilogy (my apologies if you have already mentioned a liking or dislkining for them). She writes some okay fluff with her Hythrun Chronciles but the Second Sons series I really thought was clever and topnotch. And that advice goes out to everyone else as well.
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iQuestor
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My favorite series other than SRD's are:
Robin Hobb's Assassin Series, LiveShip Traders, and Tawny Man series (all related)
LE Modesitt's Chaos and Order series - now at 13 books, I've read 10. it is pretty unique, and some books cover the same ground but from the evil perspective, which you symapthize with. It is pretty cool to read the same account from the evil guy's point of view and actually sympathize with him....
Jack Chalker's Well World series - OK Vote, who here has read these???? Pulpy SciFi at its best !!
Robin Hobb's Assassin Series, LiveShip Traders, and Tawny Man series (all related)
LE Modesitt's Chaos and Order series - now at 13 books, I've read 10. it is pretty unique, and some books cover the same ground but from the evil perspective, which you symapthize with. It is pretty cool to read the same account from the evil guy's point of view and actually sympathize with him....
Jack Chalker's Well World series - OK Vote, who here has read these???? Pulpy SciFi at its best !!
Becoming Elijah has been released from Calderwood Books!
Korik's Fate
It cannot now be set aside, nor passed on...
Korik's Fate
It cannot now be set aside, nor passed on...
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Totally agree. For me, 10 was the really bad one. 9 wasn't that great, nor was 7.gyrehead wrote:I think the series needed to go to thirteen or fourteen to truly address all the things I want addressed....But the last two books resolved things with much less detail than they were set up. Which should not happen.
I actually quite liked 11, but it was just too fast.
No need to apologise, there's no way you could know either way. And as it happens, I've never even heard of her.gyrehead wrote:If you enjoyed Rawn you might like Jennifer Fallon's Second Sons' trilogy (my apologies if you have already mentioned a liking or dislkining for them). She writes some okay fluff with her Hythrun Chronciles but the Second Sons series I really thought was clever and topnotch. And that advice goes out to everyone else as well.
Will keep an eye out.--A