Please. DO NOT DEBATE THE ISSUES!!!! Just point out what you've changed your mind on. There are plenty of existing threads to debate topics.
Have you changed your opinions over the years?
And can you attribute it to the Tank in anyway?
My biggest one would be gay marriage.
I used to be against it.
Years ago I signed a ballot petition in Mass to ban it.
Now...I don't really care.
It's two people who want to share their lives.
Big whoop, what's the big deal?
I don't really have any gay friends or even anyone who engages me in conversation about it.
I think the Tank has a lot to do with my change in thinking.
Gitmo is another.
I love the concept and it's execution but wtf?, how freaking long are we going to hold people without a trial?
Don't think the Tank was my tipping point on this though.
Have you changed your opinions over the years? And..
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High Lord Tolkien
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Have you changed your opinions over the years? And..
https://thoolah.blogspot.com/
[Defeated by a gizmo from Batman's utility belt]
Joker: I swear by all that's funny never to be taken in by that unconstitutional device again!
[Defeated by a gizmo from Batman's utility belt]
Joker: I swear by all that's funny never to be taken in by that unconstitutional device again!
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Zarathustra
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Same here with gay marriage. I've mentioned this one before. It was definitely the Tank that caused me to think about it in more detail. I was never against it, but I didn't think the argument for it (i.e. discrimination, equal rights, etc.) was sound. Now I do.
I've also changed my mind from agnosticism to atheism ... but that was due to reading Dawkins (and originally I was raised Christian, and changed my mind to agnosticism).
I may have to change my opinion on our national debt, taxes, etc., based on Brinn's MMT thread, if I can ever find the time to really delve into that.
I am also a little more worried about abuses of executive power and limits of Constitutional freedoms now that Obama is in office. I'm open to the possibility that I wasn't hard enough on Bush for this issue.
[Edit: oh yeah ... Cail changed my mind on red light cameras.]
I've also changed my mind from agnosticism to atheism ... but that was due to reading Dawkins (and originally I was raised Christian, and changed my mind to agnosticism).
I may have to change my opinion on our national debt, taxes, etc., based on Brinn's MMT thread, if I can ever find the time to really delve into that.
I am also a little more worried about abuses of executive power and limits of Constitutional freedoms now that Obama is in office. I'm open to the possibility that I wasn't hard enough on Bush for this issue.
[Edit: oh yeah ... Cail changed my mind on red light cameras.]
Joe Biden … putting the Dem in dementia since (at least) 2020.
changed my mind on this:
i used to think "why do citizens need guns. they don't need guns. only people who need guns are cops and military. that way you can tell a law abiding citizen from one who has criminal intent!"
naivete bordering on out and out stupidity.
i just didn't think it was necessary for citizens to need guns so i didn't see any reason for this amendment. in otherwords i thought it an outdated idea cause "we're not like that anymore" and "gun control" was a good idea!!! no really. i did.
because of the Tank i now see the reasons why the NRA (and others) have fought so long and hard to keep this amendment from being tampered with or, god forbid, set aside in some way.
thats just the first thing, off the top of my head, that i can think of that i've changed my mind on politically that was influenced by the tank.
Amendment II
A well regulated Militia, being neccessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
i used to think "why do citizens need guns. they don't need guns. only people who need guns are cops and military. that way you can tell a law abiding citizen from one who has criminal intent!"
naivete bordering on out and out stupidity.i just didn't think it was necessary for citizens to need guns so i didn't see any reason for this amendment. in otherwords i thought it an outdated idea cause "we're not like that anymore" and "gun control" was a good idea!!!
no really. i did.because of the Tank i now see the reasons why the NRA (and others) have fought so long and hard to keep this amendment from being tampered with or, god forbid, set aside in some way.
thats just the first thing, off the top of my head, that i can think of that i've changed my mind on politically that was influenced by the tank.
you're more advanced than a cockroach,
have you ever tried explaining yourself
to one of them?
~ alan bates, the mothman prophecies
i've had this with actors before, on the set,
where they get upset about the [size of my]
trailer, and i'm always like...take my trailer,
cause... i'm from Kentucky
and that's not what we brag about.
~ george clooney, inside the actor's studio
a straight edge for legends at
the fold - searching for our
lost cities of gold. burnt tar,
gravel pits. sixteen gears switch.
Haphazard Lucy strolls by.
~ dennis r wood ~
have you ever tried explaining yourself
to one of them?
~ alan bates, the mothman prophecies
i've had this with actors before, on the set,
where they get upset about the [size of my]
trailer, and i'm always like...take my trailer,
cause... i'm from Kentucky
and that's not what we brag about.
~ george clooney, inside the actor's studio
a straight edge for legends at
the fold - searching for our
lost cities of gold. burnt tar,
gravel pits. sixteen gears switch.
Haphazard Lucy strolls by.
~ dennis r wood ~
Lots of things. My overall philosophy has shifted from very conservative to (almost) utterly libertarian. The result is that people on both sides of the mainstream political spectrum think I'm nuts.
I was not nearly hard enough on Bush for the wars and the gross expansion of the Executive Branch.
I was against gay marriage (but ok with civil unions). Now I want government completely out of the marriage debate and I don't care who enters into binding legal contracts.
Edit- And I am now completely against the incursions into privacy that have been done in the name of homeland security.
I was not nearly hard enough on Bush for the wars and the gross expansion of the Executive Branch.
I was against gay marriage (but ok with civil unions). Now I want government completely out of the marriage debate and I don't care who enters into binding legal contracts.
Edit- And I am now completely against the incursions into privacy that have been done in the name of homeland security.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
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Vraith
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On economics, especially the gov't/private interaction, I think I'm about to alter drastically for the second time since I started coming here.
Gay marriage I didn't change...but before, it was just an impression that it would be nice if my gay friends could if they wanted. Now it's a fundamental matter of constitutional rights.
More of a happy discovery than a mind change: There are a heck of a lot more people out there than I thought that are not pure Right, Left, or soft cream filling.
Gay marriage I didn't change...but before, it was just an impression that it would be nice if my gay friends could if they wanted. Now it's a fundamental matter of constitutional rights.
More of a happy discovery than a mind change: There are a heck of a lot more people out there than I thought that are not pure Right, Left, or soft cream filling.
[spoiler]Sig-man, Libtard, Stupid piece of shit. change your text color to brown. Mr. Reliable, bullshit-slinging liarFucker-user.[/spoiler]
the difference between evidence and sources: whether they come from the horse's mouth or a horse's ass.
"Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation."
the hyperbole is a beauty...for we are then allowed to say a little more than the truth...and language is more efficient when it goes beyond reality than when it stops short of it.
the difference between evidence and sources: whether they come from the horse's mouth or a horse's ass.
"Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation."
the hyperbole is a beauty...for we are then allowed to say a little more than the truth...and language is more efficient when it goes beyond reality than when it stops short of it.
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Rawedge Rim
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SoulBiter
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Abortion... there was a time when I was for it as a choice for birth control.
Now Im against it unless the womans or the childs life is in danger.
Same sex marriage - Im still against it ... but as Cail said. Im for the govt getting out of the marriage business. Make all couple govt documents for this civil unions or contracts.
Now Im against it unless the womans or the childs life is in danger.
Same sex marriage - Im still against it ... but as Cail said. Im for the govt getting out of the marriage business. Make all couple govt documents for this civil unions or contracts.
We miss you Tracie but your Spirit will always shine brightly on the Watch 
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Rawedge Rim
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Amen.SoulBiter wrote:Abortion... there was a time when I was for it as a choice for birth control.
Now Im against it unless the womans or the childs life is in danger.
Same sex marriage - Im still against it ... but as Cail said. Im for the govt getting out of the marriage business. Make all couple govt documents for this civil unions or contracts.
“One accurate measurement is worth a
thousand expert opinions.”
- Adm. Grace Hopper
"Whenever you dream, you're holding the key, it opens the the door to let you be free" ..RJD
thousand expert opinions.”
- Adm. Grace Hopper
"Whenever you dream, you're holding the key, it opens the the door to let you be free" ..RJD
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aliantha
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You guys won't believe this, but I supported Nixon in '72 (too young to vote, tho), and voted for John Anderson in '76. I've been getting more liberal as I get older.
I'm with Vraith in that my economic views are undergoing a paradigm shift. That's definitely due to the Tank.
I'm with Vraith in that my economic views are undergoing a paradigm shift. That's definitely due to the Tank.
EZ Board Survivor
"Dreaming isn't good for you unless you do the things it tells you to." -- Three Dog Night (via the GI)
https://www.hearth-myth.com/
Pretty impressive that you voted for Anderson a full 4 years before he ran for president......aliantha wrote:You guys won't believe this, but I supported Nixon in '72 (too young to vote, tho), and voted for John Anderson in '76. I've been getting more liberal as I get older.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
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aliantha
- blueberries on steroids
- Posts: 17865
- Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 7:50 pm
- Location: NOT opening up a restaurant in Santa Fe
Cail wrote:Pretty impressive that you voted for Anderson a full 4 years before he ran for president......aliantha wrote:You guys won't believe this, but I supported Nixon in '72 (too young to vote, tho), and voted for John Anderson in '76. I've been getting more liberal as I get older.
That's what I get for trusting to memory. Dates tend not to stick in my head....And now I can't remember who I voted for in '76. Ford, I think. I always liked him.
EZ Board Survivor
"Dreaming isn't good for you unless you do the things it tells you to." -- Three Dog Night (via the GI)
https://www.hearth-myth.com/
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Avatar
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Hahaha, great thread HLT. 
And good posts guys.
Would have to think about it...the one that springs immediately to mind is that I was opposed to prescribing mood altering medication to people, but Brinn pointed out the hypocrisy of my view (in much nicer terms than that) and I had to concede that if you want them, you should be able to take them. (It was in the Close, but that's not important.)
Mainly, I think that the 'Tank has made me more tolerant and open-minded. Especially towards Christians, conservatives and Americans.
It's improved my ability to contain additional points of view. And that's one of the most important things there is. It's opened me up to the reasoning behind arguments with which I disagree, and even if I still disagree, at least I can see why people feel that way. (In most cases.)
It reminds me almost daily that stereotyping is an utter waste of time, because people are far more complex than we like to give them credit for.
(Oh, hey, I thought of another one. I used to be vaguely opposed to capital punishment, but discussing it here caused me to realise that there are circumstances under which it's not only acceptable, but desireable with some caveats.)
--A
And good posts guys.Would have to think about it...the one that springs immediately to mind is that I was opposed to prescribing mood altering medication to people, but Brinn pointed out the hypocrisy of my view (in much nicer terms than that) and I had to concede that if you want them, you should be able to take them. (It was in the Close, but that's not important.)
Mainly, I think that the 'Tank has made me more tolerant and open-minded. Especially towards Christians, conservatives and Americans.
It's improved my ability to contain additional points of view. And that's one of the most important things there is. It's opened me up to the reasoning behind arguments with which I disagree, and even if I still disagree, at least I can see why people feel that way. (In most cases.)
It reminds me almost daily that stereotyping is an utter waste of time, because people are far more complex than we like to give them credit for.
(Oh, hey, I thought of another one. I used to be vaguely opposed to capital punishment, but discussing it here caused me to realise that there are circumstances under which it's not only acceptable, but desireable with some caveats.)
--A
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Cagliostro
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I'm not a regular attendee, but after seeing many of the especially good arguments on the other side of the fence, I have frequently rethought why I feel a certain way and not just following the political line. I may have also caused some discomfort with a friend of mine a few times when discussing politics. We don't seem to discuss them as often as we used to, which is a pity. But I think the Tank is particularly good at letting me see how the other side thinks without having to listen to some talk show pundit. The arguments here are much more sound, typically.
Life is a waste of time
Time is a waste of life
So get wasted all of the time
And you'll have the time of your life
How economics, here in the US, is the biggest one. Altho previously, I would have to say I just didn't have a clue, so its not really a change, but more a learning.
Which applies to a lot of topics here, learning. Can't say for any topic that I had spent time on and had a strong opinion, that any have changed. Probably b/c I'm always right...
Which applies to a lot of topics here, learning. Can't say for any topic that I had spent time on and had a strong opinion, that any have changed. Probably b/c I'm always right...
--Andy
"Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur."
Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.
I believe in the One who says there is life after this.
Now tell me how much more open can my mind be?
"Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur."
Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.
I believe in the One who says there is life after this.
Now tell me how much more open can my mind be?
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Zarathustra
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 19641
- Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:23 am
Yes indeed. HLT should clinch the Watchie for this one.Zarathustra wrote:Great thread.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
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Holsety
- The Gap Into Spam
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- Location: Principality of Sealand
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More than anything else, I was primed to become a democratic voter around 2004 and sometime before 2008 I decided I wasn't going to vote after all. I think it may have been during the democratic primaries.
Abortion, I used to be for it in really dire situations, now I am basically ok with it for any reason. (this wasn't due to the tank, I just became more callous)
Agreed, and the Tank was part of my view on this. Also, actually handling a gun actually made me more willing to accept them for no particular reason.lucimay wrote:changed my mind on this:
Amendment II
A well regulated Militia, being neccessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
i used to think "why do citizens need guns. they don't need guns. only people who need guns are cops and military. that way you can tell a law abiding citizen from one who has criminal intent!"
i just didn't think it was necessary for citizens to need guns so i didn't see any reason for this amendment. in otherwords i thought it an outdated idea cause "we're not like that anymore" and "gun control" was a good idea!!!
because of the Tank i now see the reasons why the NRA (and others) have fought so long and hard to keep this amendment from being tampered with or, god forbid, set aside in some way.
thats just the first thing, off the top of my head, that i can think of that i've changed my mind on politically that was influenced by the tank.
Same, except I used to be for gay marriage w/out necessarily caring about government's role in marriage.I was against gay marriage (but ok with civil unions). Now I want government completely out of the marriage debate and I don't care who enters into binding legal contracts.
Abortion, I used to be for it in really dire situations, now I am basically ok with it for any reason. (this wasn't due to the tank, I just became more callous)
I am still against capital punishment, but discussions in the tank definitely made me care less about preventing it.(Oh, hey, I thought of another one. I used to be vaguely opposed to capital punishment, but discussing it here caused me to realise that there are circumstances under which it's not only acceptable, but desireable with some caveats.)
Overall I'm still conservative fiscally but I'm a little more liberal socially now than I was pre-Tank.
I've decided that it doesn't matter which party is in power, they are all tax and spend whores. That's why this year, if you are an incumbent, I'm voting for the other guy. The only way we're going to show those sorry bastards that we mean business is vote their asses out.
I've decided that it doesn't matter which party is in power, they are all tax and spend whores. That's why this year, if you are an incumbent, I'm voting for the other guy. The only way we're going to show those sorry bastards that we mean business is vote their asses out.