Kevin's Watch - what is it really?

Book 1 of the Last Chronicles of Thomas Covenant

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shadowbinding shoe
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Kevin's Watch - what is it really?

Post by shadowbinding shoe »

Time after time we begin our journeys in the Land at the top of Kevin's Watch.

Why? What is the significance of this site? This may not be the appropriate place to ask these questions but still. I want to know.

We know little of its history. Apparently at one time, Kevin climbed to its top and using his earthsight-enhanced eyes looked at the Land and the view was good (or maybe not, considering what he did in the end). While this is a nice anecdote, it doesn't explain why we keep returning to this spot. Does Foul hold some special fondness to this place? Perhaps the bird's eye view reminds him of his origins. All those pesky Land-dwellers looks very much like insects from up there. Or does he want to show Covenant (and Linden) that perspective? Or did he learn about Covenant's fear of height and immediately decided to torture him by placing him up there?

The Unbelieving Wikia has this to add:
After the Ritual of Desecration it became an area of ill omen and is often ignored by the people of Mithil Stonedown.
So Foul wanted,perhaps, to fulfill its ill reputation? Yet do people who don't live next to it believe this or is it just the Mithil Stonedowners? Maybe, the Mithil Stonedowners simply had a touch of prophecy about what will happen to the next Mithil Stonedowner to climb to its top (Lena raped, Triok ravered)

On another level we have to ask why was it named after Kevin? Kevin did a lot of significant deeds during his long life. There probably aren't that many spots in the Land that he hadn't stood on at one point or another. Yet only this area, along with his famous 7 wards are named after him. Does spending an hour enjoying the view justify naming it after him? I'm also pretty sure Kevin wasn't the only man to climb up there. We see Lena and later Hile Troy and others climb it. I could accept it if this was an ordinary land and Mithil Stonedown, a remote rural village that needed to brag that a famous dude was once there since nothing ever happened there before or after. But this is the Land we're talking about.

To add to this mystery, Kevin's Watch itself must be considered. A jutting cylinder with a flat railed top and steps leading to it isn't exactly a natural feature of the landscape. So it must be either one of two things: A cool feature the Creator put in place so denizens of his Creation could climb up it and be gladdened by the view or an ambitious architectural project someone bold and powerful decided to make for similar if perhaps less wide-reaching goals.

Now the first idea is problematic for several reasons. The first is that this region didn't have originally any such denizens to serve. The current people of the Land are all illegal immigrants from the south while the original denizens of the Land were trees and maybe horses, neither of which could climb steep man-sized steps. The second is that as the story progresses we see its components, like the steps and railing and, on our final visit, the whole shebang, crumble. Now the Creator might not have expected all the disasters his Land went through during these stories but the wearing down of the steps was probably caused by rains and winds hitting it each winter. How then could the steps be navigable when Covenant needs to go down them after all the long eons that passed since this world was created?

So let us consider the second option. The obvious suspect for it would be Kevin himself and such a project was well within his powers in all probability. If we accept it, some things become clearer. As a grand object he created, of course it was named after him just like the Wards were. Kevin's Watch also much have come to symbolize a sin of arrogance in him. He wanted to watch his people from up high. It was, perhaps, his Babel's Tower. Finally, Foul placed Covenant and Linden as a promise to the people of the Land that these people will become Desecrators, just like Kevin and a message to these visitors that they were above these people and their tragedies.

(It's interesting to consider the times people were summoned to the Land in a different spot: Hile Troy and Covenant during Illearth War)
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Post by wayfriend »

It the Watch has any significance to the Earth itself, it may be due to its proximity to Earthroot and Melenkurion Skyweir, although this is a long stretch. As far as anyone knows, there's nothing of unusual power closer to Kevin's Watch.

I think it was significant to Kevin because of the view it grants.

I think it was signficant to Foul because of it's proximity to Mithil Stonedown and innocent girls.
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Post by shadowbinding shoe »

wayfriend wrote:It the Watch has any significance to the Earth itself, it may be due to its proximity to Earthroot and Melenkurion Skyweir, although this is a long stretch. As far as anyone knows, there's nothing of unusual power closer to Kevin's Watch.
As you say, it's pretty far. And it's not even right next to the riverbank.
I think it was significant to Kevin because of the view it grants.
Or did he make it important (ie create it) because of the view it grants?
I think it was signficant to Foul because of it's proximity to Mithil Stonedown and innocent girls.
Surely you don't believe Lena was the only innocent young girl living in the Land at the time? (and I'd say her parents are much more pivotal to her role than Lena herself) I don't see Lena and her family as unique. The situation could have easily been duplicated with any Landborn girl with powerful parents.
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Post by wayfriend »

I don't think Kevin created Kevin's Watch. It was just named after him. It was probably called something else before he came along and used it during the war against the Despiser.

No, there's lots of innocent people in the Land. But, still, I think Foul picked Kevin's Watch because it would lead Covenant into Mithil Stonedown and the people there before he got to anywhere else. If not for Atiaran being half-skilled in the learning of Revelstone, and Trell being a great gravelingas, and Lena being unusually desirous of adventure, things wouldn't have worked out exactly as they had.
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Post by shadowbinding shoe »

wayfriend wrote:I don't think Kevin created Kevin's Watch. It was just named after him. It was probably called something else before he came along and used it during the war against the Despiser.

No, there's lots of innocent people in the Land. But, still, I think Foul picked Kevin's Watch because it would lead Covenant into Mithil Stonedown and the people there before he got to anywhere else. If not for Atiaran being half-skilled in the learning of Revelstone, and Trell being a great gravelingas, and Lena being unusually desirous of adventure, things wouldn't have worked out exactly as they had.
But this is the only place that's named after someone like that as far as we know. What other places are named after characters? There's Foul's Creche, Damelon's Door and Kemper's Keep, (are there any others?) All three were named after their creators. Can Kevin's Watch be the only exception?
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Post by DukkhaWaynhim »

Are you questing for contextual reasons for Kevin's Watch being what/where it is? More likely the reasons are authorial choices to drive the story. It is where it is so there must be a journey to get to Revelstone and time for Covenant to "step in it" as thoroughly as he does.
As for it's name, it is named after High Lord Kevin, who used it as a vantage point, and likely was responsible for building the steps to it. It is a good name. Must there be another reason, or other things that establish a pattern for it to be valid, or more valid?

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Post by wayfriend »

Good point, DW. Kevin might have earned the name for adding stairs. (Not sure if he did, though.)
In [u]Lord Foul's Bane[/u] was wrote:"This is the Land," Lena said joyfully, as if the outspread earth had a power to thrill her. "It reaches far beyond seeing to the north, west, and east, though the old songs say that High Lord Kevin stood here and saw the whole of the Land and all its people. So this place is named Kevin's Watch. Is it possible that you do not know this?"
In [u]The Illearth War[/u] was wrote:Troy was sure. "I've got to do it. I've been - ignorant too long. Now I've got to know. From here on we can't afford to let Foul surprise us. And I'm" - he grimaced at the fog - "I'm the only one who can see far enough to tell what Foul's doing." After a moment, he added, "That's why they call it Kevin's Watch. Even he needed to know what he was getting into."
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Post by Krazy Kat »

Kevin' Watch!
Can its name be just to obvious to have something to do with Time?
'Time' is a central part of The Ruins of the Earth.

Like Revelwood's symbolic representation of a timepiece (LFB). Or to be more accurate, the dormant mechanism that sits waiting for the seven pieces to be fitted together in place.
Why else did almost five score Ranyhyn answer the call to Thomas Covenant and the white gold ring?

Kevin's Watch also has a symmetry with the Watchtower and Revelstone.
As Dukka says, these representations and similarities are a conceptual part of the telling of the story.
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Post by shadowbinding shoe »

I am not disagreeing that Donaldson had his reasons to use Kevin's Watch as he did. I'll add even one that crossed my mind: Donaldson is fond of Kevin's Watch because it encompasses his mental image of the Land.

But story elements need internal reasons for their existence or the story will be flawed.
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Post by iQuestor »

Personally, I think Donaldson used Kevins Watch as a focus for the Land. Covenant's arrival allows him to fully see the Land right upon arrival so that he and the readers know the scope and breadth of what is at stake. Without this initial vantage, he could be back on Earth or in another time. With it we see Covenant has truly travelled to another place entirely.

In the second chrons Covenant and Linden arrive there, basically for the same reason. To show we are back in the land, but that its vastly changed. If we hadnt started here, we would have all wondered the extent of the sunbane. Since we are at KW, we know that the focus is the Land itself.

I don't think its coincidental Donaldson chose for the opening sequences of The Third chronicles to destroy the Watch. That's SRD's message to us -- this is really the end of the Land. No going back.
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Post by Vraith »

Seems to me it was a natural feature, then named for Kevin because of his uses of it...mostly I'm with what DW and IQ already said, plus a couple more things authorial/symbolic.
which I may be just making up or falsely remembering...
Am I recalling correctly or not that it is locationally connected to the RoD? Granting status/symbol for both sides of the fight, LF and Defenders?...
And...next step...didn't LF "push" TC to the watch out of Drool's chamber...Because of who TC is, his problems, and LF's knowledge of such and attachment to watch...LF is putting TC in maximum crisis, also forcing the first steps toward his prophecy, and bragging of his past victories, and scaring the bejeezus out of the Land and Lords.
[ slightly altered, but parallel, kind of thing applies when we get to second chron's.]

And...one more step...the "good" side of its destruction, potentially: yea, the Land is gone for real as it HAS been...but ALSO, no more Desecrations! No more death/destruction because "outsiders" just can't get along...so hope for what WILL be.
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Post by DukkhaWaynhim »

Hmmm, I thought the RoD was uttered from Mt Thunder.... did I make that up?
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Post by Horrim Carabal »

Kevin stood atop the Watch when he looked over the Land and saw Foul's armies couldn't be stopped. That's when he Despaired...right? The Ritual wasn't executed there but that's where Kevin fell into despite.

In fact, didn't Kevin challenge Foul to the Ritual from the Watch? It wasn't actually enacted until later, on mount Thunder, but I thought Kevin first contacted Foul and challenged him to the Ritual from the Watch?
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Post by iQuestor »

Horrim Carabal wrote:Kevin stood atop the Watch when he looked over the Land and saw Foul's armies couldn't be stopped. That's when he Despaired...right? The Ritual wasn't executed there but that's where Kevin fell into despite.

In fact, didn't Kevin challenge Foul to the Ritual from the Watch? It wasn't actually enacted until later, on mount Thunder, but I thought Kevin first contacted Foul and challenged him to the Ritual from the Watch?
No. Kevin used KW as a vantange point. However after the lords were slaughtered at Treachers Gorge, Kevin realized he could not win. sent the bloodguard home , hid the 7 wards, and challenged Foul to meet at Mt Doom where the ritual of desecration was uttered.
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Post by Krazy Kat »

Didn't Kevin challenge the Despiser to the RoD in Kiril Threndor. That would be where he lost the SoL - the Seventh Ward.

I sometimes wonder how much truth we can derive from legend.
Is it possible that Lord Foul was in actual fact the destroyer of much of the Land - not Kevin.
After all, what had really happened in Trothguard to cause so much rock to be spread over the area. As it was described, it looked like a mountain had exploded.
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Post by wayfriend »

BTW, Kevin didn't create Kevin's Dirt either. There is not an established pattern of applying possessive names only when they indicate a creator.

Of course, stepping outside the story, the author has tons of other reasons why KW is significant. Aside from the ones mentioned, I can think of others. For one, a person on the Watch is 'above' the Land, and there is a clear and delineated descent into it - metaphors galore. And, of course, we have the phallic symbol. :twisted: (The fall of Kevin's Watch as a metaphor for E.D. -- I need to write that one.)
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Post by Frostheart Grueburn »

wayfriend wrote:And, of course, we have the phallic symbol. :twisted:
Ohgods all this while the Land has had a giant stiffy and it's watching over everything! 8O

Now what does it denote that every outsider always appears upon it! 8O 8O
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Post by DukkhaWaynhim »

I guess that explains why the online Kevin's Watch has so many members...

[sigh] all this literary value, the concentrated intelligence and analysis from spots all over the globe.....and it still comes back to dick jokes. We are human, I guess. :lol:
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Post by Frostheart Grueburn »

I've exhausted my intelligence at work. Which is probably ok, since the Scandinavian sense of humor never left the Stone Age in any case.
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Post by bikebryan »

Krazy Kat wrote:Didn't Kevin challenge the Despiser to the RoD in Kiril Threndor. That would be where he lost the SoL - the Seventh Ward.

I sometimes wonder how much truth we can derive from legend.
Is it possible that Lord Foul was in actual fact the destroyer of much of the Land - not Kevin.
After all, what had really happened in Trothguard to cause so much rock to be spread over the area. As it was described, it looked like a mountain had exploded.
All we know about Trothgard was that it was the site of the final battle between the old Lords and Lord Foul's armies. In the original Chronicles, it was stated that Trothgard smoked and "bled" for centuries after that battle. It wasn't until the Lords found the second ward that they found ways to start the true healing of Trothgard.

That does, however, give me some idea of the SCALE of that powers that must have been unleashed on both sides. We see the power of the Raver/Illearth Stone/Staff of Law in TPTP, yet it produced nothing like the description of Troghgard.
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