Is it unrealistic to even attempt to make a movie?

[Horrim Carabal]

I agree Horrim ... Id like to see it across many episodes .. to ensure not too much is lost .. of the Land, the inhabitants of the Land .. and of course to ensure that the context is made clear.

Yes, but where to divide the Chronicles into seasons? Could a first season end with the retrieval of the Staff of Law from Drool?

[Ur Dead]

I see 3 years...
One year for each set of Chronicles.
Now the length of the 3 would vary.
There are 5 translation events.(3 in the first and 1 each in the other two)
The amount of encounter events in each book would set the number of
episodes. the events depending on story impact and action.(Let not just have the boring talking only)
Give an example:
Episode 1 - Leper and Arrival (gives knowledge to viewer)
Intro - and credits Shows people reaction to camera with revulsion and avoidance. 30 secs.
Show TC walking down street and going into the building - 15 sec
Interaction of TC paying bill 2 minutes
Meeting the old man,the accident and translation -3 mins
Drool and Foul (Fouls embedded message)interactions and the view from Kevin's watch- 5 minutes
Lena and the perilous decent of kevin's watch. 8 mins
Hurtloam and meeting Lena's parents and and warnings. 3mins
Stonedown event and the rape. 10 mins
Off to Revelstone and Tricock. 7 mins
Soring Woodhelm and test of truth event 10 mins
The Celebration and Ur-viles 7 mins
Meeting Saltheart. 3 mins
The River ride.. 5 mins
Events at arrival - Revelstone 10 mins
End of Episode..
around 77 minutes of storyline. 1.5 hours including commercials.

Now some of the scenes would be more or less of what I have predicted.
But you get the idea.

[Gaius Octavius]

Off to Revelstone and Tricock. Sounds interesting.

"My name is Tricock. Can you guess why?"

[Forestal]

"My name is Tricock. Can you guess why?"

Rooster breeder?

[SleeplessOne]

I see 3 years...
One year for each set of Chronicles.
Now the length of the 3 would vary.
There are 5 translation events.(3 in the first and 1 each in the other two)
The amount of encounter events in each book would set the number of
episodes. the events depending on story impact and action.(Let not just have the boring talking only)
Give an example:
Episode 1 - Leper and Arrival (gives knowledge to viewer)
Intro - and credits Shows people reaction to camera with revulsion and avoidance. 30 secs.
Show TC walking down street and going into the building - 15 sec
Interaction of TC paying bill 2 minutes
Meeting the old man,the accident and translation -3 mins
Drool and Foul (Fouls embedded message)interactions and the view from Kevin's watch- 5 minutes
Lena and the perilous decent of kevin's watch. 8 mins
Hurtloam and meeting Lena's parents and and warnings. 3mins
Stonedown event and the rape. 10 mins
Off to Revelstone and Tricock. 7 mins
Soring Woodhelm and test of truth event 10 mins
The Celebration and Ur-viles 7 mins
Meeting Saltheart. 3 mins
The River ride.. 5 mins
Events at arrival - Revelstone 10 mins
End of Episode..
around 77 minutes of storyline. 1.5 hours including commercials.

Now some of the scenes would be more or less of what I have predicted.
But you get the idea.

I've been toying around with a Covenant script for a couple of years now; months can go by without me even looking at it - but over the past two weeks I've returned to it and adapted a decent chunk for the first time in a long while.

I recently added up the word-count a couple of days ago and was surprised that I had around 25,000 words written.
Breaking them up into roughly 5000-word scripts means I have nearly 5 episodes written, at (very roughly) maybe 35-40 minutes per episode.

I think ultimately I'd have to reset the demarcation lines between one episode and the next in order to extend them to a more standardized length, but its doable. If I'm being realistic then I probably have something more like 4 unpolished scripts for a season based on Lord Foul's Bane .

Trickiest aspect so far is trying to explicate at least some of Covenant's internalized thoughts and feelings in order to give an audience deeper understanding of the character.

Also, dramatising stuff like Covenant's time at Revelstone is a bit of a balancing act; you wanna include all the relevant exposition, but there are some sections that need re-working in order to hold an audience's interest.

I suspect that if/when I ever get through scripting Lord Foul's Bane I'd end up with around 10 episodes.

The Illearth War would be a longer season and would require significant restructuring, otherwise Covenant/Elena would be absent from the screen for weeks on end.

edit: little known fact - Tricock was the name of the warder at the gates of Foul's Creche ..

[Ur Dead]

I think revise on the number of years it would run .. about 6 years.

As why the GoT used a whole season per book is that you had multiple
characters in multiple settings. That is time consuming. The 1st chronicles
mainly one person Although I grant the IEW has some of the setting.
(It all one line until Trothguard) You have.
1. Hile Troys Army storyline.
2. TC and Elena travels to the Earthblood.
3. Shetra and the Giants story.

3 or 4 episodes dealing with TC arrival ,interaction with Hile Troy, awakening of
Loric Krill and effect. setting out to see the loremasters and events that cause the army going one way and Elena & TC the other.
fifth Army and Elena stories
sixth - Elena, Army first encounter (retreat), Shetra story (which her husband dies at the forbidding)
seventh - As Army entrenching against the vortex, The Giants demise would
be told. Elena frustrations and finally finding out about "Power of Command"
eigth- Elena travel to the Earthblood and ends right when she drinks the Earthblood. Troy's army at the city, his blindness and the retreat toward Garroting Deep
Last one - Battle at Deep, summoning the Forestal., retreat into the Deep,
encounter at Gallow Howe. Meeting Bannor and TC which tell the rest of Elena story. Hile Troys conversion.

yea maybe 2 years or one very long season (up to 20) for the 3 books.

[Skyweir]

Sleepless we might be having a Watchy catch up in Melbs .. pm me if youre interested and Ill keep you posted.

Not sure if Ive flagged this previously

[SleeplessOne]

Sleepless we might be having a Watchy catch up in Melbs .. pm me if youre interested and Ill keep you posted.

Not sure if Ive flagged this previously

aww - that would be amazing, unfortunately I've moved up to beautiful Cairns 6 months ago

[SleeplessOne]

I think revise on the number of years it would run .. about 6 years.

As why the GoT used a whole season per book is that you had multiple
characters in multiple settings. That is time consuming. The 1st chronicles
mainly one person Although I grant the IEW has some of the setting.
(It all one line until Trothguard) You have.
1. Hile Troys Army storyline.
2. TC and Elena travels to the Earthblood.
3. Shetra and the Giants story.

3 or 4 episodes dealing with TC arrival ,interaction with Hile Troy, awakening of
Loric Krill and effect. setting out to see the loremasters and events that cause the army going one way and Elena & TC the other.
fifth Army and Elena stories
sixth - Elena, Army first encounter (retreat), Shetra story (which her husband dies at the forbidding)
seventh - As Army entrenching against the vortex, The Giants demise would
be told. Elena frustrations and finally finding out about "Power of Command"
eigth- Elena travel to the Earthblood and ends right when she drinks the Earthblood. Troy's army at the city, his blindness and the retreat toward Garroting Deep
Last one - Battle at Deep, summoning the Forestal., retreat into the Deep,
encounter at Gallow Howe. Meeting Bannor and TC which tell the rest of Elena story. Hile Troys conversion.

yea maybe 2 years or one very long season (up to 20) for the 3 books.

Agree with what you say, and I like the way you've structured the Illearth War there, although I'd probably devote a bit more time to the Seareach plot, which I absolutely love.

[Skyweir]

And on your TCTC telly series

Id like to see some pre setting stuff .. to enable the viewer to empathise with the conflicted nature of TC .. so his life with Joan, her family's reaction to TC .. her pregnancy and leaving .. no lets call it abandonment of TC due to nothing allegedly than his poor health .. the misfortunes of leprosy .. and potential legacy of leprosy .. then his solo existence as a rejected male .. alone .. the frustrations of a lonely life .. his doldrum existence ..

How the township reacts to him .. his feelings as a disenfranchised human .. his doctor, the pastor

Then going into town to pay his bills ..

Cue school girls in short dress uniforms .. etc .. blah blah

To my mind the viewer has to have the opportunity to empathise with TC .. or the dream world experience and especially rape of Lena .. will seem abhorrent.. which it is ... but the viewer needs to see this alternate reality through TCs eyes. It must seem like a dream state .. as TC saw it. In dreams you permit yourself liberties you wouldnt in your real world. To me .. that distinction must be clear

[SleeplessOne]

And on your TCTC telly series

Id like to see some pre setting stuff .. to enable the viewer to empathise with the conflicted nature of TC .. so his life with Joan, her family's reaction to TC .. her pregnancy and leaving .. no lets call it abandonment of TC due to nothing allegedly than his poor health .. the misfortunes of leprosy .. and potential legacy of leprosy .. then his solo existence as a rejected male .. alone .. the frustrations of a lonely life .. his doldrum existence ..

How the township reacts to him .. his feelings as a disenfranchised human .. his doctor, the pastor

Then going into town to pay his bills ..

Cue school girls in short dress uniforms .. etc .. blah blah

To my mind the viewer has to have the opportunity to empathise with TC .. or the dream world experience and especially rape of Lena .. will seem abhorrent.. which it is ... but the viewer needs to see this alternate reality through TCs eyes. It must seem like a dream state .. as TC saw it. In dreams you permit yourself liberties you wouldnt in your real world. To me .. that distinction must be clear

Absolutely, Skyweir.

In my homespun attempt at a script I quickly realised I'd have to actually write some scenes depicting Covenant's pre-leprosy life.

In the book of course Covenant merely remembers and muses about this period.

To relay the downward spiral of Covenant's life after his diagnosis you could either add narration/voiceover, which I personally didn't think would suit the material at all, or include a flashback that shows a time when Covenant was married, had a son and a successful career.

You're %100 correct that Covenant's slide into depression and despair needs to be made really explicit so that the audience will at least have some degree of empathy for him prior to his translation to the Land.

My pretty simple idea was for Covenant, en route to the Bell co. offices (after his encounter with the little boy and her mother - 'you should be ashamed') would cross paths with a former friend from his hometown.
Covenant would seek to make eye contact, exchange a nod, but would be shunned by this former friend.
A simple flashback from there to a dinner at Haven Farm with the very same former friend in happier times would create an opportunity to show that Covenant had friends, a family - they would talk about his best-seller etc.

From there, continue the flashback to construct a brief arc in which Covenant ignores the first signs of his leprosy, Joan and Roger's return home and her subsequent discovery of the leprous spot on his hand, then diagnosis, Leprosarium and encounter with the gnarled former-hermit ('kill yourself - better than this').

Wind up the flashback with Covenant discovering groceries near his letterbox and notification that his electricity bill is in credit, which would bring us neatly back to Covenant's present time, right outside the Bell Co. offices.

That first episode would be a balancing act between laying out Covenant's miserable life and his fantastical translation to the Land.

One of my favourite television pilots was for Breaking Bad - Vince Gilligan and co. balanced that episode out perfectly; first setting up Walter White's pathetic life and then ratcheting things up in the 2nd half of the show.
They did such a great job of shoring up the audience's empathy for Walter that he was able to get away with all kinds of dire deeds before the viewers started to turn against him.

As for your comment regarding Covenant's mental state leading up to the rape of Lena, that too is absolutely critical.
I agree that one would need to somehow show the dream-like quality that those early Land-based chapters evoke, while also encapsulating Covenant's escalating distress.

[Forestal]

That first episode would be a balancing act between laying out Covenant's miserable life and his fantastical translation to the Land.

I'm just getting mental images of Covenant falling and hitting his head on the coffee table... then fade to black, cliff hanger, end of episode.

Although I know it was a car the first time... that's still the image I'm getting. Weird how the mind works.

[SleeplessOne]

That first episode would be a balancing act between laying out Covenant's miserable life and his fantastical translation to the Land.

I'm just getting mental images of Covenant falling and hitting his head on the coffee table... then fade to black, cliff hanger, end of episode.

Although I know it was a car the first time... that's still the image I'm getting. Weird how the mind works.

It is ..

That first transition of Covenant from downtown to Kiril Threndor is vividly written and would adapt itself visually really well.

The red lights of the police car morphing into what eventually resolves as Drool's eyes is a great segway; the further reveal of Drool himself and the chiaroscuros play of light on the surfaces of the cavern could be spectacularly disorienting ..

[Skyweir]

I love the flashback idea .. that would be an awesome tool to set the context of his life nicely.

I also love the either being hit by the car or hitting the table with his face ... and fading to black.

If you need someone to shoot a pilot my son is a brilliant videographer .. and photographer.. has drone too .. to capture smooth pan to aerial shots. And he is Melbourne based .. but works all over Oz.

[SleeplessOne]

I love the flashback idea .. that would be an awesome tool to set the context of his life nicely.

I also love the either being hit by the car or hitting the table with his face ... and fading to black.

If you need someone to shoot a pilot my son is a brilliant videographer .. and photographer.. has drone too .. to capture smooth pan to aerial shots. And he is Melbourne based .. but works all over Oz.

Thank you Skyweir.

Wow your son sounds quite a talented guy - my son is actually quite clever in the audio department, he's across it all and has worked with some big names (none bigger than the Wiggles!) - between our kids we could probably cover the series

Honestly though I have basically no ambition for my attempt at a script beyond actually completing it to my own satisfaction...

I am glad to hear you (or anyone!) didn't hate the flashback idea though, as it was one of the few things I had to actually add in; most of it has been basically editing the book down, with the occasional sentence of dialogue tinkered with and the odd creative decision as to what would or wouldn't work for a visual medium.

For instance: there are a fair few songs throughout the chronicles. Often SRD's lyrics are beautiful and slyly expositional, and in the context of the books the songs - sometimes potent, powerful songs - work well.
I'm not sure how something like that would work on tv, though ... if mishandled could come across a bit silly - imo.
I've chosen to present some of the songs as spoken-word recitations, while still preserving a couple of sing-y bits.
So; small choices like that crop up quite regularly.

As to your suggestion of fading to black: in the case of Covenant's collision with the police car that's kind of how its written anyway, as I recall it.
There is a brief fade to black, although I think the 'spear'-like red lights of the police car might endure.
But hell yes there'd wanna be that feeling of a 'void'!

[wayfriend]

Oh, yes, the movie/show would have to grab you and show you why you want to watch it before you dig into the leprosy.

What I would do is begin with Covenant awakening on a stone floor. Micro-flash crossing the street and being hit by a car. Zoom out - see the Watch from above (just like Blackhawk's piece) as Covenant stands up and sees it himself. Now you've hooked them with a wtf. Lena arrives. Another micro-flash, to the store and the girls. TC and Lena talk, she asks who he is, what he's doing. That's when we flash back longer. A letter saying his bill was already paid. Covenant: Hellfire! -- another WTF moment. The walk into town, the shunning. etc.

The point is, you have to hook them before you can expect the patience required for a depressing backstory. Otherwise a quick judgement will have them changing channels.

Breaking Bad had this problem. It was really slow and depressing at the beginning. I know that I only continued because I had the word that it got better.

[Horrim Carabal]

Oh, yes, the movie/show would have to grab you and show you why you want to watch it before you dig into the leprosy.

What I would do is begin with Covenant awakening on a stone floor. Micro-flash crossing the street and being hit by a car. Zoom out - see the Watch from above (just like Blackhawk's piece) as Covenant stands up and sees it himself. Now you've hooked them with a wtf. Lena arrives. Another micro-flash, to the store and the girls. TC and Lena talk, she asks who he is, what he's doing. That's when we flash back longer. A letter saying his bill was already paid. Covenant: Hellfire! -- another WTF moment. The walk into town, the shunning. etc.

The point is, you have to hook them before you can expect the patience required for a depressing backstory. Otherwise a quick judgement will have them changing channels.

Breaking Bad had this problem. It was really slow and depressing at the beginning. I know that I only continued because I had the word that it got better.

A Covenant series could go totally gonzo and start off with the Creator forging the world, Foul messing with it, the Creator locking him inside the Arch as punishment....then seque into TC at the Leprosarium or Joan leaving him. That juxtaposition would be jarring to say the least.

[Forestal]

A Covenant series could go totally gonzo and start off with the Creator forging the world, Foul messing with it, the Creator locking him inside the Arch as punishment....then seque into TC at the Leprosarium or Joan leaving him. That juxtaposition would be jarring to say the least.

I think that would make the Land far too real to the viewer and would alienate Covenant more than necessary - if you can keep things seeming like Covenant's unbelief is a reasonable thing, you have a chance that people won't just stop watching "that fantasy show with the rapist main character".

[SleeplessOne]

A Covenant series could go totally gonzo and start off with the Creator forging the world, Foul messing with it, the Creator locking him inside the Arch as punishment....then seque into TC at the Leprosarium or Joan leaving him. That juxtaposition would be jarring to say the least.

ooh; that'd make for an awesome opening credits montage (the Creator/Despiser stuff).

I think that would make the Land far too real to the viewer and would alienate Covenant more than necessary - if you can keep things seeming like Covenant's unbelief is a reasonable thing, you have a chance that people won't just stop watching "that fantasy show with the rapist main character".

I tend to agree with this; I like the approach of grounding the material in stark reality before pulling the rug, with plenty of time spent on Covenant's plight in the 'real world'.
Maybe a fantastical opening credits sequence would be adequate to assure viewers that they will get to the 'fireworks factory' soon enough.

[Skyweir]

I agree with Forestall too .. though there will be early opportunity for Horrims ideas .. cos totally awesome

Really Wayfriend is right .. the pilot needs some solid hooks and I love the wtf moments.

You know its a pretty exciting project .. and sometimes you just have to work the story boards and move things around and into place .. some truly awesome ideas here.


As with your TCTC songs, music ideas .. they could work behind a narrative.. or a non narrative scene or even as opening song or behind the credits.

I reckon you have too much worked out to slide in to a drawer. But I get the personal satisfaction value .. but how cool to actually put it together and send it to someone .. or somewhere that can pitch it .. even to SRD . Hed probably love it

There are enough fans here thatd love it AND Watchers thatd be happy to support such a project.


More power to you Sleepless.