2014 NFL Whipping Post

[wayfriend]

Cybrweez, part of the story has to be the unexpected luck with that kickoff turnover. The TD swung the momentum a bit, but I think that turnover deflated GB completely. (Get it? "Deflated"?) And that's why Wilson went into miracle mode ... coverage wilted. So, you can argue GB deserved to lose due to lack of some mental fortitude. Anyway, that's how I see it.

But it bodes well for the Pats that Wilson isn't as great as those last five minutes. He will get the Luck treatment. And that's how I see it, too. Pats win by 2 TDs or more. Brady gets more grudgingly-admitted but statistically-undeniable accolades.

In other news, Superbowl ticket prices apparently dropped as soon as the Pats took the AFC. Whatever you make of that, that's what I am getting really tired of.

[Cail]

I dunno, I look at this differently.

Green Bay didn't play to win, they played not to lose. That never works. Boneheaded plays like the hookslide after an interception don't let you win games. Winning teams find a way to win, and Seattle did that.

The Colts looked terrible and the Pats capitalized on this. No matter what my opinion of the team, there's some real talent there. My frustration is that somehow the #6 seed managed to outplay the #1 seed for the vast majority of that game, yet the Colts couldn't muster anything.

I've said it before, and it bears repeating....The AFC North is a meat grinder of a division. The Ravens played a tougher schedule than either the Pats or the Colts, and the rest of the North is stronger than the rest of the East or the South. This isn't me being a homer, it's a matter of record. Switch divisions for the Pats and the Browns, and I think you'd see very different results.

That said, winning teams find a way to win. The Pats beat the Ravens, and that's all there is to it. This year, New England wanted it more than Baltimore.

We'll see about next year.

[Cybrweez]

I think your statement there says more about Colts than Pats. Also, some teams just don't match up well against other teams, or have their number, for whatever reasons. That's why I was nervous about Baltimore, but felt good about Indy. And the meat grinder division can help teams, I've heard from teams plenty of times in many sports about how tougher schedule prepares them for playoff atmosphere. Poor Pats, they play chumps then have to step up for playoffs.

WF, yes, forgot about that muff. Especially b/c I understand that Bostick is supposed to block so that Nelson (who was right behind him), can make the catch. And McCarthy's bad game management/play calling is a big part too. That's what I mean, there's so many things happening in that game to add to the amazing finish. Gives people a lot to talk about.

[Fist and Faith]

What's with this underinflated ball thing? Don't both teams use the same ball?? I know I don't know much of anything about the sport, but I'd be very surprised if each team had their own ball to use during their offense. So if it's underinflated, and if that's a benefit, doesn't it benefit both?

And don't the refs handle the ball, like, a thousand times every game?? I know I'm right about that! I see players hand the ball to a ref all the time.


So how can you be using an underinflated ball that the refs can't feel, that only benefits you??

[wayfriend]

Bingo. Plus the refs inspect the balls. It's as logistically impossible as it is non-advantageous.

It's coming to light that the Colts player who caught the interception gave the ball to a ref and complained it seemed low. So the rumor began with the Colts ... go figger.

Apparently, it's going to be several more days until they can manage to measure the air pressure ...

[Cail]

It appears there's something to this....

The NFL has found that 11 of the New England Patriots' 12 game balls were inflated significantly below the NFL's requirements, league sources involved and familiar with the investigation of Sunday's AFC Championship Game told ESPN.

The investigation found the footballs were inflated 2 pounds per square inch below what's required by NFL regulations during the Pats' 45-7 victory over the Indianapolis Colts, according to sources.

"We are not commenting at this time," said Greg Aiello, the NFL's senior vice president of communications.

Troy Vincent, the league's senior executive vice president of football operations, told The Associated Press late Tuesday in response to this report that the "investigation is currently underway, and we're still awaiting findings." He told "Pro Football Talk with Mike Florio on NBC Sports Radio" earlier Tuesday that the NFL expected to wrap up its investigation in "two or three days."

Yet to be determined is what, if any, penalties may be imposed upon the Patriots. One source described the league as "disappointed ... angry ... distraught" after spending considerable time on the findings earlier Tuesday.

Part of the investigation that needs further vetting is how the 11 footballs became underinflated.

The game balls that each team received for preparation were required to be inspected and approved by referee Walt Anderson two hours and 15 minutes before kickoff, then returned to a ball attendant.

No alteration of footballs is allowed once they are approved, under league rules and regulations.

The balls are required to be inflated between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch and weigh between 14 and 15 ounces.

"We have been in complete cooperation with the league and will continue to do so," Patriots spokesman Stacey James said.

The NFL began looking into the issue because doctoring the footballs could provide a competitive advantage, compromising the integrity of the game.

Deflating a football can change the way it's gripped by a player or the way it travels through the air. Under NFL rules, each team provides balls each game for use when its offense is on the field. The balls are inspected before the game by the officiating crew, then handled during the game by home-team personnel.

Colts tight end Dwayne Allen, however, said on Twitter that the issue still didn't affect the outcome of the game.

Patriots coach Bill Belichick earlier Tuesday deferred questions about the investigation, saying reporters should ask league officials. Belichick earlier said he wasn't aware there was an issue until Monday morning and promised to "cooperate fully with whatever the league wants us to, whatever questions they ask."

Belichick, of course, was fined $500,000 in 2007 for having an assistant spy on the New York Jets' defensive signals.

Special-teams captain Matthew Slater said the Patriots "try to do things the right way. We work hard at our jobs, our professions, to be successful and it's unfortunate that things like this come up, but that's life, that's the world we live in."

Colts coach Chuck Pagano said he did not notice issues with the football and didn't specify when asked whether the Colts had reported the issue to officials.

"We talk just like they talk to officials [before the game]," he said. "We have an opportunity to talk to the officials about a lot of things."

Some Colts players -- punter Pat McAfee and cornerback Darius Butler -- took to Twitter on Tuesday night to give their spin on the situation.

Patriots wide receiver Julian Edelman said the footballs didn't feel different than usual.

And defensive tackle Vince Wilfork seemed amused by the matter and didn't shed any light on it.

"I don't know anything about that," he said. "I don't touch footballs. I tackle people."

Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers said on his ESPN Milwaukee radio show that he didn't like how referees who inspected balls before games take air out of the balls.

Hall of Fame wide receiver Jerry Rice voiced his opinion on Twitter, saying that all but one football being underinflated was too much of a coincidence.

[Vraith]

Green Bay didn't play to win, they played not to lose. That never works. Boneheaded plays like the hookslide after an interception

Switch divisions for the Pats and the Browns, and I think you'd see very different results.

On the first...I forgot about that in previous. It was the third worst thing [besides the dumb defense calls on 2nd and forever, and 3rd and half a light-year] GB did to make themselves losers. Same thought source, though. Just as you said---they started playing not to lose.

On the second...yea, you said that before, and it sure seems likely.
But---wouldn't it be funny [pure fantasy, we can't ever know], if doing that actually made the Pat's HARDER to beat?
I mean, someone here---I think you---thinks Brady is kinda a whiner, the ref's and everyone coddle him, he gets away with things cuz he's pretty... [well, maybe not that last one....]
But he has skills. A lot of them. What if the meat grinder made him stronger??? Do you REALLY want him to be a bad-ass SOB on top of it? [heh...you'd like him more as a player in that case, I think, but it wouldn't help your team at all....]

Anyway...I'm going with the Pats.
It could be a really good game...but I think the Pats defense has [just barely] a better chance of containing Seattle's offense than Seattle's defense has of containing the Pat's offense.

I'm not buying deflation-gate yet. Only anonymous sources.
And...it's been a long damn time since I handled a football, but I'm pretty sure if the balls were 10 instead of 12, every person who touched it would be like "this ball is soft, man."

[Cail]

Brady's a good quarterback when he has time. When he's rushed and/or hit, he's not. He gets flustered and makes mistakes. Maybe that would change if he faced better defenses on a regular basis, maybe not.


Deflate-gate? I dunno. It sure seems like there's something to this and that the league is genuinely pissed. If the balls were under-inflated, and if it's shown that Belichick was complicit in it, then the Patriots ought to be disqualified from competing in the Super Bowl, and Belichick should be suspended for a year. The team should probably lose their 1st and 2nd round draft picks too.

Realistically, there's too much money involved to cancel the Super Bowl, so that won't happen. But you'd better believe that everyone will put an asterisk on the Pats' season. Sean Payton got suspended, so there's certainly precedent there.

I hope it's not true, and I'm glad there's no way of knowing if they were doing it all year.

[dlbpharmd]

Brady's a good quarterback when he has time. When he's rushed and/or hit, he's not. He gets flustered and makes mistakes. Maybe that would change if he faced better defenses on a regular basis, maybe not.

The same is often said about Peyton Manning.

[Cail]

Brady's a good quarterback when he has time. When he's rushed and/or hit, he's not. He gets flustered and makes mistakes. Maybe that would change if he faced better defenses on a regular basis, maybe not.

The same is often said about Peyton Manning.

And it's a fair point.

[Fist and Faith]

Under NFL rules, each team provides balls each game for use when its offense is on the field. The balls are inspected before the game by the officiating crew, then handled during the game by home-team personnel.

Above, I said, "I'd be very surprised if each team had their own ball to use during their offense." So yeah, I'm fairly amazed that this is how it works. The system is designed in such a way as to give better opportunity to cheat!? Why? (Not to say the Patriots cheated. I have no earthly idea.)

[dANdeLION]

I think this is a big Super Bowl. I hear the Luck/Wilson angle. But if Brady wins, it's number 4, and w/2 losses, 6 Super Bowl trips. He's prolific, and a winner. Has to be considered the best ever. On other side, if Wilson wins, he'll have 2 titles in 3 years, and a great opportunity in his career to take that title. I hope Brady can hold him off 1 more year.

If Wilson wins, it'll be 2 titles in 2 years.

[Cail]

I think this is a big Super Bowl. I hear the Luck/Wilson angle. But if Brady wins, it's number 4, and w/2 losses, 6 Super Bowl trips. He's prolific, and a winner. Has to be considered the best ever. On other side, if Wilson wins, he'll have 2 titles in 3 years, and a great opportunity in his career to take that title. I hope Brady can hold him off 1 more year.

If Wilson wins, it'll be 2 titles in 2 years.

Yes, and Brady the "best ever"? Not a chance. Not as long as Montana, Young, Elway, and Unitas still exist. Brady is a great quarterback, but not on the same level as "the best".

[rdhopeca]

As a lifelong Pats fan, I cannot bring myself to be excited about the Super Bowl this year. True or not, deliberate or accidental, the pall cast over this year has drained my desire for the spectacle that would be a 4th ring.

[Cail]

As a lifelong Pats fan, I cannot bring myself to be excited about the Super Bowl this year. True or not, deliberate or accidental, the pall cast over this year has drained my desire for the spectacle that would be a 4th ring.

And that's the real shame of it. No matter what happens from this point on, every win of theirs this season is going to be questioned.

I hate the Patriots almost as much as I hate the Steelers (and it takes a lot to make a pacifist hate anything), but I feel terrible for their fans.

[Menolly]

As a lifelong Pats fan, I cannot bring myself to be excited about the Super Bowl this year. True or not, deliberate or accidental, the pall cast over this year has drained my desire for the spectacle that would be a 4th ring.

And that's the real shame of it. No matter what happens from this point on, every win of theirs this season is going to be questioned.

I hate the Patriots almost as much as I hate the Steelers (and it takes a lot to make a pacifist hate anything), but I feel terrible for their fans.

[Savor Dam]

As the Seahawk fan you all know me to be, I really prefer to entirely ignore this entire distraction about air pressure. The Patriots are the AFC champs and what their path to that was makes no difference. The same is true for the Hawks...although the last few minutes of the NFC Championship will be part of all-time highlight reels for a very long time. Whatever mistakes Green Bay made would not have not changed the outcome if Seattle had not seized the moment and found the mojo to win. By contrast, who can claim with a straight face that underinflation of the ball is the root cause of the Patriot's win over Indy?

Surely, there will be no hanky-panky with the game equipment on 1 February. Who committed what penalties in the past will be meaningless footnotes. Prior sins and/or heroics are history with no impact on what happens on the field.

Last year, the NFC Championship (SFO@SEA) was the real SuperBowl. Denver was an anticlimax. I don't assume that this year. Both sides have demonstrated tremendous heart and mad skills. Both have plenty of detractors.

This is going to be good.

Go Hawks!

[Cybrweez]

Regarding Wilson, I meant 2 titles in his first 3 years.

Yes, and Brady the "best ever"? Not a chance. Not as long as Montana, Young, Elway, and Unitas still exist. Brady is a great quarterback, but not on the same level as "the best".

I'm not sure what you base it on. Playoff performance? Brady's stands up w/any of them, when considering number of starts, win percentage, and titles. Bradshaw and Montana have 4, and Starr 5 (3 before it was known as Super Bowl), so that's why I think that 4 is needed for Brady. BTW, Wilson win percentage is crazy, will be hard to keep it up, but that's why I said whoever wins here is really big for career talk.

Regular season wins? Brady is 3rd all time, but his winning percentage is the highest.

Playoff QB rating? Brady is 13th, not bad, not great. But from your list, only Montana ahead of him. Unitas not in top 50. I don't put much weight in that rating myself, but it does give some picture. Some of those QBs haven't had a lot of opportunities tho, so their rating has lower weight.

But in terms of totals, Brady is #1 in playoff yards and TDs, and #5 for both in regular season. For picks, using totals is misleading, b/c you'll have more if you play more, so using percentage, Brady is #2 in reg season (behind Rodgers), and #26 in playoffs. Caveat w/playoffs, there are 15 QBs at 0%, and basically that list will never be confused w/best ever. Maybe they attempted 1 pass. Starr is ahead of Brady, but no one on your list.

So, Brady at 3-3 in Super Bowl (of course, I'm not sure his career is over yet), is a step behind Montana, b/c of the importance on titles. Maybe. After all, he got there 6 times, Montana only 4. Brady at 4-2 tho, passes Montana (sorry, Young, Unitas and Elway?).

Man, what if Brady had HoF WR, and a RB who is close.

[Cybrweez]

Haha, the stats overwhelm you.

Here's something about Wilson:

Head to head, Wilson is 3-0 against Aaron Rodgers, 2-0 against Peyton Manning, Eli Manning and Drew Brees, and 1-0 against Tom Brady.

Average scores in those 10 games: Seattle 29, Foes 15.

Wilson’s touchdown-to-interception differential in those 10 games: 16-8. (It was 15-4 before this year’s NFC Championship Game.)

I know, I know—give credit to the defense for being so dominant and for holding Peyton Manning to 14 points per game and Brees 11 and Rodgers 17. The Seahawks defense has been terrific in the past three years, leading the league in scoring defense in all three seasons. But Wilson has not been just an innocent bystander here.

One more Wilson morsel that will drive the quarterback-wins-is-a-meaningless-stat crowd to drink: Wilson’s 42 victories in his first three NFL seasons, in regular- and postseason games, is six more than any other quarterback in NFL history.

[Cail]

Hardly, first time I've checked back.

You can quote stats all you like. By that measure, Dan Marino was either the best quarterback ever, or the worst quarterback ever depending on whether or not Super Bowl wins mean anything.

What would be interesting - though I doubt these stats exist - would be if someone weighted a player's stats on the relative strength of their team, and on the strength of that team's schedule.

Take Barry Sanders. There probably isn't a football fan alive that hasn't said something to the effect of, "imagine how great he'd have been on a real team." But what also has to be taken into account was the strength of the Lions' division while he was playing. With the exception of the Bucs, there were three for-real teams in the NFC Central when Sanders was playing.