Has anyone here read the Harry Potter series? What do you think about it?
I haven't read the books or seen the movies. I've avoided reading it under the theory that it is aimed at 10 yr olds. What brings this to my mind is that in that fantasy movie poll it ranks 2nd after LOTR. My 13 yr old niece is up on Harry Potter, but she knows nothing about LOTR. I have no grounds for comparison.
Harry Potter
Moderator: Menolly
-
Sevothtarte
- Giantfriend
- Posts: 347
- Joined: Fri Nov 29, 2002 4:27 pm
- Location: a position or site occupied or available for occupancy or marked by some distinguishing feature
I've read the series about twenty times (no kidding)... so, of course, I love it. The first book is pretty ordinary - physically weak but clever and good boy escapes his dumb, mean relatives and enters a world of magic, becomes the big enemy of a school bully, but goes on to save the day with his sidekicks.
Still, the book is good, because Rowling is an excellent writer. Her style is witty, funny and easy to understand without being simple. She's good at giving suprising solutions - it's simple in the first book, the one the heroes take for the villain isn't it in fact, but it get's complicated and better in every new book. And it all makes sense, the plots as well as the world itself.
In fact, every book is better than the one before. They migh be labeled children's books, but that's crap. I don't believe in these categories. The Harry Potter series has wit, charm, humour, intelligence, good characters in a believable world - that's what I ask for, no matter for which reader group marketing believes them to be.
I've watched the first movie and was gravely disappointed. By the actors (except Snape, Hermione and maybe Ron) as well as in general. True, it looks great, good special effects. But that's not what makes a world believable, and it's certainly not what makes HP great. A big part of the books charm are the side characters. You don't just have Harry and his two friends, you have all these others you love - Neville, Fred, George, Peeves, etc. - and they are practically left out in the movie. Either totally (Peeves) or they only just get a few seconds, say one sentence, and that's it (Fred & George). It's a matter of time and place, you can't fit everyone and everything in - this is a fine excuse, but the loss still remains, and it's huge.
I don't plan watching the second movie soon because the first was that big a disappointment for me. Still, I know a lot of people who didn't read the books but like both movies, so it might be usual "doesn't come up to the book" factor. In any case, if you want to make up your mind about HP, first read the books. At least the first three. The first is, as I said, not that much different from many books. The second might be the weakest of them regarding the level of her writing, but it's definitely the funniest. The third and fourth are simply brilliant, although or maybe because things are turning darker, evil, deadly.
Btw, if anyone here knows a decent HP discussion forum, I'd be very grateful for the link, I haven't yet found one.
Still, the book is good, because Rowling is an excellent writer. Her style is witty, funny and easy to understand without being simple. She's good at giving suprising solutions - it's simple in the first book, the one the heroes take for the villain isn't it in fact, but it get's complicated and better in every new book. And it all makes sense, the plots as well as the world itself.
In fact, every book is better than the one before. They migh be labeled children's books, but that's crap. I don't believe in these categories. The Harry Potter series has wit, charm, humour, intelligence, good characters in a believable world - that's what I ask for, no matter for which reader group marketing believes them to be.
I've watched the first movie and was gravely disappointed. By the actors (except Snape, Hermione and maybe Ron) as well as in general. True, it looks great, good special effects. But that's not what makes a world believable, and it's certainly not what makes HP great. A big part of the books charm are the side characters. You don't just have Harry and his two friends, you have all these others you love - Neville, Fred, George, Peeves, etc. - and they are practically left out in the movie. Either totally (Peeves) or they only just get a few seconds, say one sentence, and that's it (Fred & George). It's a matter of time and place, you can't fit everyone and everything in - this is a fine excuse, but the loss still remains, and it's huge.
I don't plan watching the second movie soon because the first was that big a disappointment for me. Still, I know a lot of people who didn't read the books but like both movies, so it might be usual "doesn't come up to the book" factor. In any case, if you want to make up your mind about HP, first read the books. At least the first three. The first is, as I said, not that much different from many books. The second might be the weakest of them regarding the level of her writing, but it's definitely the funniest. The third and fourth are simply brilliant, although or maybe because things are turning darker, evil, deadly.
Btw, if anyone here knows a decent HP discussion forum, I'd be very grateful for the link, I haven't yet found one.
-
aliantha
- blueberries on steroids
- Posts: 17865
- Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 7:50 pm
- Location: NOT opening up a restaurant in Santa Fe
Read all the books, seen both movies, eagerly awaiting the fifth book (yes, that's my toe that you hear tapping!).
I think it's pretty universally acknowledged that the second book is the weakest. My 13-year-old daughter says it's her least favorite of the books. But we thought the movie was okay.
JK Rowling has said that she never intended for the books to be considered kids' books, and as the series continues, that becomes more and more apparent. Aside from its hefty size, the 4th book was much more of an adult-type read. And as they couldn't seem to get the first two movies under three hours, I hate to think how long the movie version of book 4 will be (yeeeesh).
I agree that it's too bad that many of the characters have been given short shrift in the movies -- we've been particularly heartbroken that Peeves has been cut altogether ("Shan't say nothing if you don't say please!" "Please!" "NOTHING!"). And okay, Daniel Radcliffe is not an Academy Award winner, and the kid who plays Ron grimaces a lot. But still, we've enjoyed the movies.
Read the books. They're a lot of fun.
I think it's pretty universally acknowledged that the second book is the weakest. My 13-year-old daughter says it's her least favorite of the books. But we thought the movie was okay.
JK Rowling has said that she never intended for the books to be considered kids' books, and as the series continues, that becomes more and more apparent. Aside from its hefty size, the 4th book was much more of an adult-type read. And as they couldn't seem to get the first two movies under three hours, I hate to think how long the movie version of book 4 will be (yeeeesh).
I agree that it's too bad that many of the characters have been given short shrift in the movies -- we've been particularly heartbroken that Peeves has been cut altogether ("Shan't say nothing if you don't say please!" "Please!" "NOTHING!"). And okay, Daniel Radcliffe is not an Academy Award winner, and the kid who plays Ron grimaces a lot. But still, we've enjoyed the movies.
Read the books. They're a lot of fun.
And if you are in the mood for recommendations add "Gardens of the Moon" and "Deadhouse Gates" to the list. I just finished the last of these and they were excellent. I will start on "Memories of Ice" forthwith.Damelon wrote: Now, when to get the time for it. My reading list has grown rather long lately.
"Und wenn sie mich suchen, ich halte mich in der Nähe des Wahnsinns auf." Bernd das Brot
-
Reisheiruhime
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 2573
- Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 3:22 pm
-
duchess of malfi
- The Gap Into Spam
- Posts: 11104
- Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 9:20 pm
- Location: Michigan, USA
Release date for HP5
They announced a release date for Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix today. In the US, at least, it will come out in June. I can't remember the exact date, but I think it's about the 21 or 22. 
Love as thou wilt.
-
Sevothtarte
- Giantfriend
- Posts: 347
- Joined: Fri Nov 29, 2002 4:27 pm
- Location: a position or site occupied or available for occupancy or marked by some distinguishing feature
Both UK and US, both children's and adult's versions will be released on June 21.
38 chapters, 255,000 words, 1/3 longer than GoF.
Bloomsbury also showed two teasers from the book:
1) the book opens thus: "The hottest day of the summer so far was
drawing to a close and a drowsy silence lay over the large, square
houses of Privet Drive. ...The only person left outside was a
teenage boy who was lying flat on his back in a flowerbed outside
number four."
2) later on there is this passage (Dumbledore speaking): "It is
time ... for me to tell you what I should have told you five years
ago, Harry. Please sit down. I am going to tell you everything.'"
38 chapters, 255,000 words, 1/3 longer than GoF.
Bloomsbury also showed two teasers from the book:
1) the book opens thus: "The hottest day of the summer so far was
drawing to a close and a drowsy silence lay over the large, square
houses of Privet Drive. ...The only person left outside was a
teenage boy who was lying flat on his back in a flowerbed outside
number four."
2) later on there is this passage (Dumbledore speaking): "It is
time ... for me to tell you what I should have told you five years
ago, Harry. Please sit down. I am going to tell you everything.'"
-
Sevothtarte
- Giantfriend
- Posts: 347
- Joined: Fri Nov 29, 2002 4:27 pm
- Location: a position or site occupied or available for occupancy or marked by some distinguishing feature
I don't love Harry Potter. But you HAVE to read the series. It already rivals LOTR as the most successful fantasy series ever, and it may soon surpass it.
I actually find her writing a bit weak. For example - until book 4, I couldn't picture what a Quittich match actually looked like. I don't think her descriptive abilities are very good, especially if you start to compare them to Tolkien or SRD.
What she is good at--actually, what she's amazing at--is small, inventive touches that brings HP's world to life. My favorite is the clock at the Weasley's house that, rather than telling time, tells where each Weasley is at a given moment (home, school, work, etc.) That's cool. And the books are filled with that kinda stuff.
I actually find her writing a bit weak. For example - until book 4, I couldn't picture what a Quittich match actually looked like. I don't think her descriptive abilities are very good, especially if you start to compare them to Tolkien or SRD.
What she is good at--actually, what she's amazing at--is small, inventive touches that brings HP's world to life. My favorite is the clock at the Weasley's house that, rather than telling time, tells where each Weasley is at a given moment (home, school, work, etc.) That's cool. And the books are filled with that kinda stuff.
-
Mick Axbrewder
- Servant of the Land
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2003 9:57 pm
Tolkien and SRD have very different styles of description and I think that Rowlins is closer to Tolkien than she is to SRD. I note that while Tolkien will tell you about the geography of places and also their history as well as a fairly general description of how they look, SRD will usually just sketch them and tell us how the places feel. It is kind of strange really, but surely you remember phrases like:dukkha wrote:I actually find her writing a bit weak. For example - until book 4, I couldn't picture what a Quittich match actually looked like. I don't think her descriptive abilities are very good, especially if you start to compare them to Tolkien or SRD.
"Revelstone met the invaders with a wonder like they had never known."
"He walked forward into the sempiternal springtime."
On one level these tell you almost nothing about Revelstone and Andelain, but on another level they tell you almost everything you need to know about them. Note how SRD uses uncommon words to describe things and places to get these effects too. On the first page of TWL he describes Lindens apartment as "spavined out", "wearing its habit of desuetude" and "condign", thereby conveying to us the essence of the place but he never tells us anything (that I can remember) about the apartment itself (how many rooms, what color walls, layout etc.)
Rowlins seem a lot more focused on action.
"Und wenn sie mich suchen, ich halte mich in der Nähe des Wahnsinns auf." Bernd das Brot
I've enjoyed all the books, but of course I realize they're juvenile literature and some allowances must be made for same (the idea that three first year students could have gotten to the Sorceror's Stone for example!)
And there's an interesting pattern I noticed.
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
A
H
E
A
D
After reading some really wonderful essays about "BtVS" and how their characters interact, I realized some parallels between the two series.
The central characters in both consist of three friends: A Hero (Buffy/Harry), a comical Sidekick (Xander/Ron) and a really brainy Sidekick (Willow/Hermione). What's more, both trinities have a very protective older figure (Joyce/McGonnagul), a challenging older figure (Angel, then Spike/Snape), and a genuine mentor whose strength is arcane knowledge (Giles/Dumbledore).
The Hero also has a dark twin or shadow opponent (Faith/Tom Riddle).
In book one of HP, the Hero had to go deep underground and keep a great Evil from returning. In season one of BtVS, the Hero had to go deep underground and keep a great Evil from returning.
In book two of HP, the Hero had to send someone he once considered an ally into oblivion, using a sword in the process. There was also a bit about the mouth of a statue. In season two of BtVS, Buffy had to send someone she once loved into hell, using a sword. Oh yeah, there was also a bit about the mouth of a statue.
In book three of HP, an innocent was framed for murder and the Hero had to prevent the government from comitting murder. During this, Harry and company learned they had been betrayed. In seaon three of BtVS, an innocent was framed for murder and the Hero had to stop the Mayor from committing murder. Along the way, Buffy and her friends learned they had been betrayed.
In book four of HP, the government becomes a dupe of a great evil who is defeated by Harry due to a surprising magical situation. In season four of BtVS, a government agency becomes the dupe of a great evil who is defeated by Buffy due to a surprising magical situation.
Hmmmmmmm....
Makes one think, does it not?
And there's an interesting pattern I noticed.
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
A
H
E
A
D
After reading some really wonderful essays about "BtVS" and how their characters interact, I realized some parallels between the two series.
The central characters in both consist of three friends: A Hero (Buffy/Harry), a comical Sidekick (Xander/Ron) and a really brainy Sidekick (Willow/Hermione). What's more, both trinities have a very protective older figure (Joyce/McGonnagul), a challenging older figure (Angel, then Spike/Snape), and a genuine mentor whose strength is arcane knowledge (Giles/Dumbledore).
The Hero also has a dark twin or shadow opponent (Faith/Tom Riddle).
In book one of HP, the Hero had to go deep underground and keep a great Evil from returning. In season one of BtVS, the Hero had to go deep underground and keep a great Evil from returning.
In book two of HP, the Hero had to send someone he once considered an ally into oblivion, using a sword in the process. There was also a bit about the mouth of a statue. In season two of BtVS, Buffy had to send someone she once loved into hell, using a sword. Oh yeah, there was also a bit about the mouth of a statue.
In book three of HP, an innocent was framed for murder and the Hero had to prevent the government from comitting murder. During this, Harry and company learned they had been betrayed. In seaon three of BtVS, an innocent was framed for murder and the Hero had to stop the Mayor from committing murder. Along the way, Buffy and her friends learned they had been betrayed.
In book four of HP, the government becomes a dupe of a great evil who is defeated by Harry due to a surprising magical situation. In season four of BtVS, a government agency becomes the dupe of a great evil who is defeated by Buffy due to a surprising magical situation.
Hmmmmmmm....
Makes one think, does it not?
"O let my name be in the Book of Love!
It be there, I care not of the other great book Above.
Strike it out! Or, write it in anew. But
Let my name be in the Book of Love!" --Omar Khayam
It be there, I care not of the other great book Above.
Strike it out! Or, write it in anew. But
Let my name be in the Book of Love!" --Omar Khayam
By successful do you mean according to book sales figures?dukkha wrote:I don't love Harry Potter. But you HAVE to read the series. It already rivals LOTR as the most successful fantasy series ever, and it may soon surpass it.
I have read all the Harry Potter books and have enjoyed them as well. And yes, I have seen both movies, and I`m not ashamed to say that I saw HP2 four times (I have a few young nieces and nephs) but, imo, the series does not compare to LOTR.
Zahir, being a great fan of BtVS, I find your comparisons very interesting and it definiely does make one wonder - could it all be just coincidence or is there something else, dare I say sinister, at hand.
Oh I don't think there's anything sinister involved. Joss Whedon and J.K.Rowling are both drawing upon mythical archetypes. Patterns show up in all sorts of stories, from Gilgamesh and the Mahabarata to James Joyce and Stephen R. Donaldson. The art lies in taking those elements (nearly always on a subconcious level) and interpreting them in new ways.
IMHO
IMHO
"O let my name be in the Book of Love!
It be there, I care not of the other great book Above.
Strike it out! Or, write it in anew. But
Let my name be in the Book of Love!" --Omar Khayam
It be there, I care not of the other great book Above.
Strike it out! Or, write it in anew. But
Let my name be in the Book of Love!" --Omar Khayam
The magic starts at precisely 9.01am on June 21 apparently.
There is a world-wide embargo with everyone involved with the distribution of HP & The Order Of The Phoenix unable to open a single box until one minute after 9am on the day of release.
The book will set you back $44.95 AUS so I don't know what that is in US or Euros or anything.
I'll be there, pushing all the kids out of the way, battling to get my copy
There is a world-wide embargo with everyone involved with the distribution of HP & The Order Of The Phoenix unable to open a single box until one minute after 9am on the day of release.
The book will set you back $44.95 AUS so I don't know what that is in US or Euros or anything.
I'll be there, pushing all the kids out of the way, battling to get my copy
-
Worm of Despite
- Lord
- Posts: 9546
- Joined: Sat Oct 26, 2002 7:46 pm
- Location: Rome, GA
- Contact:
*Snaps fingers*