Guy Tasered; right or wrong?
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- Immanentizing The Eschaton
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Really? What about the guy who kills his daughters rapist? Is that the same as the guy who murders his wife for the insurance?sgt.null wrote:really? this i have to hear? because one does not accidently commit a major felony. and there are many better choices for survival. and murder does not include self defense.Avatar wrote:There's plenty of room for grey in murder, drug dealing, armed robbery, assault and kidnapping.
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sgt.null
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we've had this debate. i believe we agreed on timing. during the act or if the courts refused to punish. and only if you were willing to face judgement yourself was the consensus.Avatar wrote:Really? What about the guy who kills his daughters rapist? Is that the same as the guy who murders his wife for the insurance?sgt.null wrote:really? this i have to hear? because one does not accidently commit a major felony. and there are many better choices for survival. and murder does not include self defense.Avatar wrote:There's plenty of room for grey in murder, drug dealing, armed robbery, assault and kidnapping.
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me? i'm willing to meet my Maker after killing the bastards.
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Marx, Lennon
Good Dog...
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But the point is there's a grey area.
And if there is one in something like murder, there must be one in most things. (Can't find one for paedophilia though...assuming real paedophilia and not things like consensual "statutory rape" so the answer is clearly either execute them or lock them up permanently.)
--A
And if there is one in something like murder, there must be one in most things. (Can't find one for paedophilia though...assuming real paedophilia and not things like consensual "statutory rape" so the answer is clearly either execute them or lock them up permanently.)
--A
I agree. There's gray everywhere. And what a boring color! Though Gandalf was gray, and, well, he rocked.
Though he was gay too! (sorry, couldn't resist, from another thread - Ian McKellan, awesome guy)
Aside from the example that I noted about an 18 yr old being convicted as a sex offender for experimenting (and not penetrating!) his 17 yr old friend, and other similar gray areas, I find pedophilia about as executionable an offense there can be. The pedophile who acts on their rage destroys a child's entire life; their rape will never take its leave. Not to mention the collateral damage...mother, father, sisters, brothers, aunts, uncles, cousins, children, friends...it's endless.
And gosh. That sounds like Thomas Covenant. His collateral damage was vast. It even destroyed his daughter, who - heaven forbid - wanted to couple with him.
Could he pay a greater debt than to see his own daughter coming on to him? And then enacting her own Ritual of Desecration?
And the whole mess on the Colossal. Ick. She picked TC over Foul, and that's foul.
It's a lot to ask a reader to deal with.
Though he was gay too! (sorry, couldn't resist, from another thread - Ian McKellan, awesome guy)
Aside from the example that I noted about an 18 yr old being convicted as a sex offender for experimenting (and not penetrating!) his 17 yr old friend, and other similar gray areas, I find pedophilia about as executionable an offense there can be. The pedophile who acts on their rage destroys a child's entire life; their rape will never take its leave. Not to mention the collateral damage...mother, father, sisters, brothers, aunts, uncles, cousins, children, friends...it's endless.
And gosh. That sounds like Thomas Covenant. His collateral damage was vast. It even destroyed his daughter, who - heaven forbid - wanted to couple with him.
Could he pay a greater debt than to see his own daughter coming on to him? And then enacting her own Ritual of Desecration?
And the whole mess on the Colossal. Ick. She picked TC over Foul, and that's foul.
It's a lot to ask a reader to deal with.
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." (Anais Nin)
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sgt.null
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i differ on statutory with just about everyone here. and i don't concede on murder. i would murder the bastard, but would stand trial and judgement. (by two different authorities.)Avatar wrote:But the point is there's a grey area.
And if there is one in something like murder, there must be one in most things. (Can't find one for paedophilia though...assuming real paedophilia and not things like consensual "statutory rape" so the answer is clearly either execute them or lock them up permanently.)
--A
Lenin, Marx
Marx, Lennon
Good Dog...
Marx, Lennon
Good Dog...
That's a funny thing there, that 'ol "age of consent" thing.
Did you realize that it's OK to sleep with a 16-year old, but it's illegal to photograph her while you're doin' it (that's kiddie porn)?
Did you realize that it's OK to sleep with a 16-year old, but it's illegal to photograph her while you're doin' it (that's kiddie porn)?
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
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"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
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"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
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"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
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Ahahahhahaha now thats funny...well its not really but its a comical gap in our laws.Cail wrote:That's a funny thing there, that 'ol "age of consent" thing.
Did you realize that it's OK to sleep with a 16-year old, but it's illegal to photograph her while you're doin' it (that's kiddie porn)?
Of course our laws have never made alot of sense...... You are legally an adult and able to be sued, serve in the armed forces, vote, etc etc at 18 but you cant drink until you are 21
We miss you Tracie but your Spirit will always shine brightly on the Watch 
In South Carolina, Missouri, Indiana, and Iowa, the legal age of consent for males in M-F sex is 14.
Interesting link.
www.avert.org/aofconsent.htm
Interesting link.
www.avert.org/aofconsent.htm
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." (Anais Nin)
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Taser parties stunning success with female clients
Social events aimed at female clients and their personal safety
Nicole Gomez
Special for The Republic
Nov. 29, 2007 12:00 AM
Pack up your Tupperware, and get ready for a new kind of party.
Dana Shafman, founder of Shieldher Inc., has recently started sponsoring Taser parties, giving women a chance to buy Tasers for $300, or $350 with a laser beam to help with aiming.
Shafman's parties allow women to get together to discuss concerns and learn about the Taser C2, the newest consumer Taser that is similar to the device police officers use. "I felt that we have Tupperware parties and candle parties to protect our food and house, so why not have a Taser party to learn how to protect our lives and bodies," Shafman said.
"It is not the literal past that rules us, save, possibly, in a biological sense. It is images of the past. Each new historical era mirrors itself in the picture and active mythology of its past or of a past borrowed from other cultures. It tests its sense of identity, of regress or new achievement against that past.”
-George Steiner
-George Steiner
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sgt.null
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Alexandria police sergeant fired after using Taser
La. -- A 13-year veteran of the Alexandria Police Department has been fired after using a Taser stunning device on a woman he had pulled from a car during an April arrest.
Police Chief Daren Coutee confirmed Tuesday that Sgt. Kenneth Rachal was fired late last week.
Captured on the officer's in-car video camera is footage of Rachal pulling Doris Moses, 28 at the time of the incident, out of her car. He then used a Taser on her and threw her to the ground before arresting her.
City prosecutor Brian Mosley decided there was no probable cause to arrest Moses, and she never faced prosecution.
The chief said he couldn't say anything about the investigation other than that Rachal was terminated because the officer has already appealed. A hearing date hasn't yet been set.
Moses never filed complaint forms against Rachal. The matter was forgotten about until September when Moses requested a copy of the video and hired attorney Greg Aymond, Coutee said.
La. -- A 13-year veteran of the Alexandria Police Department has been fired after using a Taser stunning device on a woman he had pulled from a car during an April arrest.
Police Chief Daren Coutee confirmed Tuesday that Sgt. Kenneth Rachal was fired late last week.
Captured on the officer's in-car video camera is footage of Rachal pulling Doris Moses, 28 at the time of the incident, out of her car. He then used a Taser on her and threw her to the ground before arresting her.
City prosecutor Brian Mosley decided there was no probable cause to arrest Moses, and she never faced prosecution.
The chief said he couldn't say anything about the investigation other than that Rachal was terminated because the officer has already appealed. A hearing date hasn't yet been set.
Moses never filed complaint forms against Rachal. The matter was forgotten about until September when Moses requested a copy of the video and hired attorney Greg Aymond, Coutee said.
Lenin, Marx
Marx, Lennon
Good Dog...
Marx, Lennon
Good Dog...
Anyone got a copy of the video?
“If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.”
-- James Madison
"If you're going to tell people the truth, you'd better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you." - George Bernard Shaw
-- James Madison
"If you're going to tell people the truth, you'd better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you." - George Bernard Shaw
So - even Moses indicates that the officer told her that she was resisting arrest, which coincides with the officer's written report. Her attorney told her to stop talking when she said that...
I can't imagine that the officer was in any danger whatsoever from her, however. If she was one of two large men who were both resisting arrest...but she wasn't.
Still, if an officer tells you that you're under arrest, you don't argue. You say, OK, and spread 'em. ESPECIALLY if you think there's racial bias involved. If an officer tells you that you ran a red light, and you were in the intersection when the light turned yellow, you wait until court to argue your case, never with the officer. From what the newscaster was saying, it seems that Moses was familiar enough with law enforcement that she should have understood those very basic "rules of engagement".
Racially biased? Hard to tell. Excessive use of force? Absolutely. That was ridiculous.
I can't imagine that the officer was in any danger whatsoever from her, however. If she was one of two large men who were both resisting arrest...but she wasn't.
Still, if an officer tells you that you're under arrest, you don't argue. You say, OK, and spread 'em. ESPECIALLY if you think there's racial bias involved. If an officer tells you that you ran a red light, and you were in the intersection when the light turned yellow, you wait until court to argue your case, never with the officer. From what the newscaster was saying, it seems that Moses was familiar enough with law enforcement that she should have understood those very basic "rules of engagement".
Racially biased? Hard to tell. Excessive use of force? Absolutely. That was ridiculous.
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." (Anais Nin)
I won't be too quick to judge after what happened a few nights ago.....
To preface this, I'm in decent shape. I run 6 miles a day, and I lift 3 days a week. I'm not a bodybuilder by any stretch, but I'm not unhappy with my physique. I also have a near-ridiculous lack of fear.
At about 12:30 Monday night (Tuesday morning), I woke up to a pounding on my door. There is literally no one I could think of that would be coming by at that time of night, so I cautiously, quietly peeked out of the peephole in the door. There was a smallish guy in his mid 30s staggering around in the hallway. He was quite obviously drunk. Now I understand that people tend to get a bit disoriented when they're drinking, and the guy probably staggered to the wrong apartment.
I opened the door and told him he had the wrong apartment. He became agitated and told me his friend lived here. I repeated that he was in the wrong place and told him to leave. Then he advanced on me and tried to get into my home.
Several things flashed through my mind at this point.
-I don't have any clue who this guy is or what he's on.
-I can take him.
-If he gets inside, I can wail on him with legal impunity.
Deciding that discretion is indeed the better part of valor, and not wanting to spend all night filling out reports, I took a step back, shut the door, and called 911. The guy lost it and started beating and kicking my door.
The cops showed up, told him to get on the floor, and the guy didn't comply. 3 cops, 2 billy clubs, and 5 minutes later, the guy was restrained. I wouldn't have blamed them at all if they'd tased him.
The point being that physical size, sex, or age has absolutely no bearing on how hard someone will fight when presented with unwanted restraint.
To preface this, I'm in decent shape. I run 6 miles a day, and I lift 3 days a week. I'm not a bodybuilder by any stretch, but I'm not unhappy with my physique. I also have a near-ridiculous lack of fear.
At about 12:30 Monday night (Tuesday morning), I woke up to a pounding on my door. There is literally no one I could think of that would be coming by at that time of night, so I cautiously, quietly peeked out of the peephole in the door. There was a smallish guy in his mid 30s staggering around in the hallway. He was quite obviously drunk. Now I understand that people tend to get a bit disoriented when they're drinking, and the guy probably staggered to the wrong apartment.
I opened the door and told him he had the wrong apartment. He became agitated and told me his friend lived here. I repeated that he was in the wrong place and told him to leave. Then he advanced on me and tried to get into my home.
Several things flashed through my mind at this point.
-I don't have any clue who this guy is or what he's on.
-I can take him.
-If he gets inside, I can wail on him with legal impunity.
Deciding that discretion is indeed the better part of valor, and not wanting to spend all night filling out reports, I took a step back, shut the door, and called 911. The guy lost it and started beating and kicking my door.
The cops showed up, told him to get on the floor, and the guy didn't comply. 3 cops, 2 billy clubs, and 5 minutes later, the guy was restrained. I wouldn't have blamed them at all if they'd tased him.
The point being that physical size, sex, or age has absolutely no bearing on how hard someone will fight when presented with unwanted restraint.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________