Kevin's Watch

Well, I guess I'll just have to post it............GREAT,THANX AV! You seem to have figured at least that much of my personality,NEVER back down from a challenge.........Oh,well, it'll give me something to do.......

spacemonkey wrote:Not to offend you either Prebe,but as an atheist(as you proclaim to be) you're basically saying that your life and experiences are nothing,you live for nothing except yourself and when Death does strike you,it's over.I cannot accept that for myself.Maybe it works for you,It won't for me.

Av answered very well for the "your life and experiences are nothing" part. As for the "when Death does strike you,it's over" part, it's not a matter of what works for me, it's a matter of what the situation is. I have never experienced anything to make me think there is anything after life. In my younger years, I disliked and feared the thought of the oblivion I expected was waiting at the end of the road. But that did not make me able to believe something that I didn't have reason to believe in.

Fortunately, I no longer dislike or fear oblivion. Over time, for various reasons, it became merely unsettling. I also came to bother thinking about it less frequently. At this point, I find the thought to be quite peaceful. Mind you, I'm not actively persuing it. Believing that oblivion will last a good deal longer than my life will have lasted, I figure it makes sense to hang around for a bit. And, now that I have children, I'm going to put it off as long as I can. But when I'm staring it in the face one day, I'm planning to give it a smile and a sigh.

spacemonkey wrote:I've had a number of experiences(not necessarily with God) that I cannot discount.

As I said, I have no such experiences.

As for being offended by your posts, I sure hope you start paying more attention to the spaces after your commas!

Fist wrote:At this point, I find the thought to be quite peaceful.

Me too. The only thing I've ever disliked about the thought is a vague sense of offense that the world will have the temerity to continue without me if I die.

(On really solipsist days, I know that it will completely dissappear from existence on that day. But I'm unsure whether it will happen for everybody, or just for me. )

--A

spacemonkey wrote:Not to offend you either Prebe,but as an atheist(as you proclaim to be) you're basically saying that your life and experiences are nothing,you live for nothing except yourself and when Death does strike you,it's over.I cannot accept that for myself.Maybe it works for you,It won't for me.I've had a number of experiences(not necessarily with God) that I cannot discount.I am a very scientific person,but my faith and my science walk hand in hand......

I should say that I am a nontheist (best label to put myself under), which goes even further than atheism in this regard. I do not feel that a belief in god is of relevance to my daily life, and were god to come down and confront me and order me to change my life I would do my best not to (although when you're facing an all powerful being you might end up doing things you don't agree with). I live life as a good person because goodness is what I seek for all people. I don't believe there is any inherent punishment for someone who is evil. I don't even believe evil people (or more generally people who do mostly wrong) are leading an unfullfilled life or are unhappy or anything like that. I just have a sense of right which I follow.

On further note about the jew thing...I have to say that, as someone who has turned away from Judaism, I respect a lot of aspects of the religion and the process of conversion is one of them. I find that it's a much better qualification than the more raccial "your mother was a jew" qualification that keeps me being known as a jew today. About the only thing I share with Jews in general is a sort of general love for Israel (which isn't necessarily shared by all jews anyway), but that is more inspired by direct experience and family/friend ties there instead of ties as a religious homeland.

As an ex-fundy, I also respect this process of conversion. I saw far too many people "convert" to fundamentalist christianity in a way that I now see as being harmful.

Good posts folks.

Yeah Holsety...the precepts of a self-derived moral code.

--A