Kevin's Watch

Posted: **Sat Jul 16, 2005 7:54 pm**

Lord Mhoram wrote:LOL Seriously though, Batman directors have casted some really terrible people in the past!

Well indeed. George Clooney?!

danlo, was it you who originally casted Bale as Covenant? I thought about that during "Begins," and I think he'd be great as the Unbeliever.

As soon as I saw Bruce Wayne in his prison guise, bedraggled and bearded, I thought "Oh, he has to be Covenant"

That reminds me - I was stunned when I realised how British (approximately) the cast is. Christian Bale=Welsh; Cillian Murphy (Dr Crane)=Irish; Liam Neeson=Irish; Gary Oldman=English; Michael Caine=English. Weird.

Posted: **Sat Jul 16, 2005 7:56 pm**

Junior,

As soon as I saw Bruce Wayne in his prison guise, bedraggled and bearded, I thought "Oh, he has to be Covenant"

LOL same here!

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 4:20 am**

CovenantJr wrote:Alright, I can perhaps see Two-Face being re-done, since the most memorable aspect of that film was Carrey's Riddler. Two-Face isn't as entrenched in viewers' minds as the Nicholson Joker.

I still strongly doubt the Joker's return. I concede that the card was included to tantalise the audience, in addition to the functions I mentioned above, but that's just about getting people into seats when the next one arrives. I just can't see them re-doing the Joker. It'd be a courageous decision, as Sir Humphrey Appleby would say.

Well they are casting the Joker now.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 4:27 am**

Lord Mhoram wrote:
Scarecrow etc have been repelled - and to illustrate Gordon's point about escalation.
True, plus:
Spoiler
Scarecrow is still free, though I expect the Arkham inmates will kick his ass in the streets of Gotham.

They always planned to have Scarecrow return. I remember Nolan saying Dr Crane was always the minor villain and that Ras Al Ghul was the main one. Plus, he really wasn't Scarecrow in the movie - not until the last twenty minutes.

Interesting take on the release of Arkham Asylum: that's where Gotham gets all its crazed villains. Regardless, the Joker is back. People need to remember that the character is not remembered for Jack Nicholson's role (for me, it was Nicholson playing Nicholson), but because the character is so damn popular. He is an icon. When people think 'Batman' they think 'Joker'.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 1:14 pm**

Loremaster wrote:Well they are casting the Joker now.

Ugh. I was hoping for something new. Oh well.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:12 pm**

Loremaster,

Oh, I think it's definitely a possibility that Crane will return, but the Arkham guys will definitely hunt him down.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:32 pm**

I read some other boards and a short quote from Nolan--didn't say anything directly about Joker--I think they all old quotes. But he did say something about having 3 villians in the next movie and was worried that having a main villian as large as the Joker would obscure the others. He did say that he would definately bring back Scarecrow and did not (thankfully) forsee bringing Robin in during his tour.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:40 pm**

danlo,

Then why the Joker card?

btw: on the Scarecrow. I think he was well done, but he had such a lame part in this movie. I mean, he was defeated by being tasered by Katie Holmes for God's sake!

LOL I hope he has a more significant part in the next film.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:50 pm**

mhoram--well, once again this is an old quote like 3 months ago, or so. I thought that the Joker card was simply bringing BB right up to the point that the Keaton movie started. He very well might be casting the Joker right now--Loremaster has better info than I, apparently, but I do wish he'd cite his sources.

Edit: I did some more Googling and tho I can't seem to find anything straight from Nolan's mouth--many talking heads are convinced the Joker will be in the next movie--one of the rumors, get this, has SEAN PENN being cast! He's something that Bale told MTV on comicsworld.movienews

Actor Christian Bale spoke to MTV about the Joker possibly being included in a sequel to the successful Batman Begins movie and how he feels about the infamous character.

"I want to see the Joker, because I think it will be a very different kind of Joker than people have seen before," he said. "I think even the card that you see at the end of the movie shows that it is a darker, more sinister-looking Joker than anything I have seen depicted before. I think it would be a good adversary."

Bale also talked to the Chicago Sun-Times where he expressed his thoughts on Robin, the character whom plays Batman's teenage sidekick in the comics and previous Batman films.

"Thank God, there was no Robin," Bale says. "You really don't need him because Robin makes it campy and not dark.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 8:15 pm**

danlo,

Okay thanks.

Good info there.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 10:15 pm**

danlo wrote:
"Thank God, there was no Robin," Bale says. "You really don't need him because Robin makes it campy and not dark.

Mr Bale took the words out of my mouth.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:31 pm**

danlo - sorry, the article I read was two years ago. I have no idea where it is now.

LM - I absolutely agree that the Scarecrow was underused. Though, I loved every scene he was in except for the taser scene.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:37 pm**

Loremaster,

In the first Scarecrow scene, in which he is in the court room with Holmes, and he states that the tried criminal should go to Arkham over prison, I'm pretty sure that the criminal he named was "Mr. Zsasz," who is an important villain in the comics. Probably a subtle nod to the comics, much like the black commisioner was named Loeb, the name of Gordon's predecessor in the comics as well.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:41 pm**

hey Mhory! Was there ever a Chief O'Hara or was he some patsy the Adam West TV series dreamed up?

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:44 pm**

danlo,

Yep there was a Chief O'Hara. One of Gordon's top lieutenants. I've seen him in at least two graphic novels, one of which he was killed by a serial cop killer.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:48 pm**

So he might be developed in the next one along with Dent, hmmm...cool!

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:53 pm**

A history of the Batman films, containing an entry for "Batman 2," aka the "Begins" sequel:

* Columbia Pictures released two 15-chapter, live-action movie serials, Batman (1943) and Batman and Robin (1949).

* Batman (1966), the first feature-length adaptation, based on the TV series with Adam West and Burt Ward.

* Batman (1989), directed by Tim Burton, and starring Michael Keaton as Batman and Jack Nicholson as the Joker. This movie introduces Batman as a brooding vigilante and dispenses with the campy tone. It
relied heavily on the dark atmosphere set by the Frank Miller graphic novel: Batman: The Dark Knight Returns and the comic run, Batman: Year One.

* Batman Returns (1992), also directed by Burton and starring Keaton, with Michelle Pfeiffer as Catwoman and Danny DeVito as the Penguin.

* Batman: Mask of the Phantasm (1993) feature length spinoff of Batman: The Animated Series

* Batman Forever (1995), produced by Burton, directed by Joel Schumacher, and starring Val Kilmer as Batman, Chris O'Donnell as Robin, Tommy Lee Jones as Two-Face, and Jim Carrey as the Riddler. The decision to continue the franchise without Burton or Keaton was controversial and opinions of the movie's quality were mixed.

* Batman and Robin (1997), starring George Clooney as Batman, Chris O'Donnell as Robin, Arnold Schwarzenegger as Mr. Freeze, Alicia Silverstone as Batgirl, and Uma Thurman as Poison Ivy. A huge critical and box office embarassment, with nipples on the batsuits, many believe it weakened the Batman franchise and superhero films in general.

* Batman Begins (2005), directed by Christopher Nolan and starring Christian Bale as Batman, Michael Caine as Alfred, Gary Oldman as Detective Sergeant James Gordon, Liam Neeson as Henri Ducard, Ken Watanabe as Ra's al Ghul and Cillian Murphy as the Scarecrow. An origin story that reboots the film franchise and is independent from the previous Burton/Schumacher films.

* Batman 2 (2007/2008), will be helmed by director Christopher Nolan yet again and will be written by David S. Goyer. Starring is Christian Bale as Batman, Gary Oldman as Lt. (Commisioner) Gordon, Mark Boone Jr. as Detective Arnold Flass, and Michael Caine as Alfred Pennyworth. Casting for The Joker has begun as early as 2005 following its release. The contenders to play the part are: Crispin Glover, Mark Hamill, Lachy Hulme, Sean Penn, Tim Roth, and Paul Bettany.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman#Enemies_of_Batman
btw: Mark Hammil played Joker in the excellent "Batman Animated Series" from the early 90s.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2005 12:09 am**

Crispin Glover?! The guy who played Willard!

Damm he's real creepy looking--hope he makes it!

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2005 3:22 pm**

Yeah, Crispin Glover would make a good choice, especially since he's as creepy off screen as on (from the interviews... if anybody remembers him trying to kick Letterman). Mark Hammill can do the voice, obviously, but I wonder if he has the visual presence... and after seeing him as Cock Knocker in Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back... I dunno. I can't see Sean Penn, though Tim Roth is a vague possibility. Still, there has to be better options.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2005 5:16 pm**

Crispin Glover would be fine as long as they don't put that stupid makeup face on him like they did to Jack Nicholson.