Kevin's Watch

Yes, as I can't say for sure that there is no god, but I wont say that there is either

Fair enough

I believe there is a God, but it's partially because of how I view nature itself that gives me that belief. Unfortunately, I can't give anybody else my eyes, so they can't see what I see. I suppose I could be merely a product of my upbringing, unable to choose any belief system except the one I was force fed during my formative years, but I don't buy that. If it were true, then why do I still find myself to be unique? I do attend church regularly, but I generally look upon organized religion the same way I look upon any other organized thing, like crime for instance. The bible speaks of true religion as taking care of widows and the like. Organized religion has a tendancy to add unneccessary things to true religion, so I attempt to avoid it at all costs. As for evolution, I don't see how that either verifies or disproves creation. Can't created things evolve?

danlo wrote:dAN I don't think ur listening to me--

I heard you. I think I even understood you. Sorry if I offended you; sometimed my accelerator pedal works better than my brake pedal

I neither believe nor disbelieve. "I don't care" would be the simplest way to put it, but that gives the wrong impression. "It doesn't have any bearing on how I live my life" would be more accurate. Generally, I assume that my life is my responsibility, and I live it according to my own set of values. Sometimes, in my darkest hours, I pray...usually for strength; not because I necessarily believe, but because I don't necessarily disbelieve, and in hardship I will take all the help I can get, so it's worth asking.

Organised religion is slightly dodgy ground in places, though. I don't have a problem with a group of people subscribing to the same set of beliefs; what I'm not so keen on is dogma, inflexibility and elitism. Also, the fact that so often religion is used as an excuse for things that should never happen - we all know examples of that...

But, on the whole, I have no involvement with religion/God. Not because I have no respect for it, but because - to the best of my knowledge - I'm the one who is control, and I'm happy to take that responsibility. But I never discount the possibility of God's existence, nor do I oppose it.

I'm just curious... how many people on these boards have read C. S. Lewis's "Screwtape Letters"? For awhile in my life, I was an athiest, very closed mindedly athiest, actually, and then I started to think about certain things... and now I consider myself more of a deist. Anyways, Screwtape Letters is very interesting, as it outlines a few of the reasons why, I think, I started to believe in God and certain moral convictions. I don't think its necessarily flawless or perfect, but certainly thought provoking ; '

MixoLocrian wrote:I'm just curious... how many people on these boards have read C. S. Lewis's "Screwtape Letters"? '

I have read it a couple of times, usually when I need to get myself out of a funk. I love the book.

Mhoram has a thread devoted 2 The Screwtape Letters in the Lewis forum at the Hangar, if u're interested. (just click my www 2 get there)

I love The Screwtape Letters. What a classic.

Zeph wrote:HAHAHAHAHHAHAAHA!!!!! You are the one spouting misinformation. You quote little pieces of my statements that allow to best argue against me & don't even have the decency to take time to understand what I'm saying. When I wrote about genes thinking, it was out of sarcasm & I said so. But you continue to take my words out of context for your own benefit.

I have not taken your quotes out of context, only parsed them for brevity. The context remains intact in your earlier posts and I invite anyone to peruse those posts at their leisure and draw their own conclusions.

Zeph wrote:I don't really care about you in the slightest Brinn.

Come now Zeph....not even the little tiniest bit? Now you've gone and hurt my feelings!

Zeph wrote:So far, very few people have had any kind of respect toward me here. WHich is why I am the way I am here. If I were to have been accepted without the reproaches I received them maybe I would be a much more agreeable guy. I am the result of the cliques attacking someone's idea which wasn't like theirs.

IIRC you came to the Watch with an antagonistic attitude and proceeded to make broad generalizations. I will post a transcript below of the first time I responded to you. Please note that this exchange occurred after your initial post on rape in which you made broad generalizations about the core nature of men and women. I had read you "Rape" post and disagreed with your view vehemently but had refrained from posting a reply. Nevertheles what follows is our first official exchange at this forum:

Zeph wrote: I have to tell you that I'm not much for comedy of my favorite books. This isn't to say that I don't have a sense of humor and that I enjoy some of your comedy (The Land for Dummies, etc.), it's just that I take the books fairly seriously.
I suspect that the original poster of this topic suggested that Covenant should bring something small with him instead of a penknife, something that he could carry, so a car or something would be out of the question. This question also interests me because it puts you in Covenant's shoes, a place where at least half the readers would feel themselves uncomfortable to be.
If I were Thomas Covenant and I knew that I was going to the land then I would bring a mini-DVD player with a small assortment of documentaries from national geographic and the history channel. The reason that I would do this is because although the Lords are willing to accept that he comes from a different place than the Land, they seem unable to believe that this could mean another real dimension. It is almost as if they believe that he might come from another part of the world of the land. But if he could show them a DVD on WW2 or that that people of his world who had the capability to record them on such incredible technology found the most terrifying creatures to be lions and sharks, then they would be more apt and willing to listen to him when he said that the land was a dream to him. I think it would help them come up with more distinct proof for him that the land was real such as the obvious proof that he dreamed within his 'dream', something I believe Morham touched upon.
That is what I would do. I'm not saying that its the best idea but I like it.

Brinn Responded:

And I'll tell you that I take comedy very seriously (how's that for paradox...or is it technically irony?) and I don't appreciate you making serious of our humor.

Welcome to the Watch Zepha!

As you can see it was a humorous exchange followed by a welcome. The smiley's clearly denote the humorous nature of my reply. From the get go I was willing to listen to you and provide you with respect. Your views were controversial but I think that spirited debate about competing ideas is valuable and you were sure to bring some debate to the Watch. I even defended you when your thread was filibustered. However, after that, I never again directly responded to one of your posts as they quickly became discourteous and argumentative. Look back and re-read this whole thread and tell me who launches the first salvo.

Regardless, I am suggesting a general amnesty. I would like to start again. You have conviction and strong opinions and I find those to be admirable traits. You state that your surliness and general disposition are a result of the way you have been treated. OK I'm willing to accept your perspective. If that is true than let us make a fresh start. I cannot speak for others...only myself, but I am willing to extend my hand in friendship and provide you with the respect that you ask for as long as you are willing to provide the same respect in return. Are we in agreement?


Sincerely,

Brinn

Yeah...so, is everything cool here now? It's my job for things to be cool, so if they arn't, just let me know and I can work them out. Heh. Anyway.

To Zephalephelah: If you arn't calm now, just calm down. We're all cool here. If people are giving you problems, then yelling and insulting them won't solve anything. There are better ways to work it out. Talk to me or something.

To Everyone Else: Just give the guy a break. We're all cool here.

So yeah, we cool?-jay

im cool, some would say too cool, but they're just jealous...

Cool as the other side of the pillow!

Zephalephelah wrote: I deserve to be here just as they do. And should someone find it intolerable, who unlike you actually has power here you little boy, then I'll come back as a different login but the same person again & again & again & again & again. Because I feel slighted you cretin, closed-minded, arrogant, pathetic, little worm.

My 2 cents worth here.

Carry on like this and I will take you out - permanently.

Hierachy wrote:im cool, some would say too cool, but they're just jealous...

LOL!

Vain wrote:

Zephalephelah wrote: I deserve to be here just as they do. And should someone find it intolerable, who unlike you actually has power here you little boy, then I'll come back as a different login but the same person again & again & again & again & again. Because I feel slighted you cretin, closed-minded, arrogant, pathetic, little worm.

My 2 cents worth here.

Carry on like this and I will take you out - permanently.

Oh, so we're to death threats now is it?

You called me a name, wah, where do you live, I'm gonna beat you up, wah. STFU!

hem hem Soooooo is there a God?[/i]

Please lets not start this again, it's gone to far already.

I think we need to take a look back at the first post in this topic...

Darth Revan wrote:I realise this might be a sensitive issue to some people, but I want this topic to be an educational, mature discussion. Where people talk about what their beliefs are. Not arguing. Everyone is intitled to there own beliefs, and to express those beliefs without being criticized.

This really is not the place...

I agree

Me too!