Kevin's Watch

Yes, that post is first class Chasmys.

excellent!

Yes indeed, great post!

externalized unconscious (Mahdoubt)

Can you elaborate on this?

I agree, great post! I especially like how you've brought up the point of Linden's externalized unconscious. The Mahdoubt, and likely Esmer symbolize something for her...

That is the best analysis of Linden's POV ever, as well as an explanation for the service of the Mahdoubt to the story.

*doffs cap*

Yup, good post.

But Linden still sucks.

Outstanding post Chasymys - and Welcome back to the Watch after a LONG absence!!

What I am saying is that SRD is in control of the tools his craft, and I trust him.

That's right. SRD is in control of his tools. He has chosen not to write the snappy prose he once did. That isn't going to change as soon as Covenant comes into the story. He has admitted publicly he doesn't write the same prose anymore.

If you are merely speaking about the storyline that a lot of people didn't like, that is one thing. The inclusion of Covenant and possible POV chapters might change their feelings on the matter. But if you are attributing the deadness of the writing because it is Linden's POV -- well -- that's absurd. Just look at The Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant - Unbeliever when Linden was involved. Was the prose dead then? Hmm.

well spoken

Ard Rhys wrote:But if you are attributing the deadness of the writing because it is Linden's POV -- well -- that's absurd. Just look at The Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant - Unbeliever when Linden was involved. Was the prose dead then? Hmm.

Very good point.

I didn't find Runes to be a disappointment, although I'm certainly hoping that a lot of the setting up that SRD's done is going to be paid of in style in FR and points onwards.

There were a few things that annoyed me, and obviously its quite different from the first and second chronicles. That said, the first and second chronicles are very different from each other - I know when I start LFB's, I wish I was reading TWL instead, but when I finish TPTP, I dread the change in style, content etc, and wish I could stay with Mhorram and co in the the Land. I think hat's should be doffed to SRD for not just giving us a retread of either 1 or 2, he's moving the story to new places (if not physically, emotionally, and stylistically).

I thought the strong points of Runes were great - the tense opening, the inclusion of TC's son as a new pawn of LF, and LA's relationship with Jeremiah (I had recently become a father myself, so maybe that resonated deeper than usual for me). Anele was irritating at first, then intriguing, the Haruchai remain infuriating and cool at the same time, and I would have been happy to read the entire book for no other reason than seeing Ranyhin again.

On the downside, LA's indecision annoyed me a bit, I thought SRD indulged in a bit too much "resolving mysteries" from the first two series, particularly with the Demondin (I liked NOT knowing what they were dammit), and Esmer annoyed me. The time travel thing was a weak effort by someone of SRD's calibre, and while I was prepared to tolerate it in this story, I hope we don't see anymore timetravelling shenannigans in the rest of the series - leave that to Doc and Marty in their Delorean.

It certainly isn't as good as the best books of the 1st and 2nd series, but I'd say it wasn't a disappointment and has set up the new series beautifully.

I just hope its length, huge variety of characters and possible plot lines, its at times slow pace, and the reported length of FR don't signify that SRD has fallen to the increasing trend of successful fantasy authors of dispensing with editors and attempts at restricting story creep. He's set himself, potentially, a tonne of stuff to handle in the rest of the series, and if he starts to get bogged down in his own complexities, a la George RR Martin in his last book, or horror of horrors Robert Jordan, I think I'll cry for a long long time. Don't do it Stephen!!! Embrace the editorial process and produce a 500-600 page masterpiece rather than a 1100 page mess!

I disagree that Jeremiah is a vegetable. He certainly has a mind. It just isn't very accessible. Anyway...

I think the reason why Linden loves and has adopted Jeremiah is that she sees herself in him. Jeremiah's father has never been referred to. He may be dead like Linden's or he may have divorced Jeremiah's mother. In the latter case, as the father seems to be nowhere in the equation, that counts as a pretty good virtual "I never loved you anyway".

Jeremiah's mother is deeply into religion, much like Linden's but more cultish. Both Linden and Jeremiah's mothers abused their children. In Linden's case this was emotional, while Jeremiah's mother made her children burn their hands, even if they all were under a spell. Neither mother had a healthy relationship with food; Linden's mother was obese and spent nearly all the money into her own food while in Jeremiah's family nobody got enough to eat, a constant in the Community of Retribution save for the leader. Probably they fasted a lot.

Due to her parents, Linden grew a cocoon that prevented her from getting emotionally involved with anyone. Since her relationship with Covenant, that cocoon is still there but not quite as impenetrable as it used to be. Jeremiah's condition is also a cocoon, but a far more complete one, or a different kind of one.

I have read the book three times over various intervals. Donaldson purposely pisses you off. Its a trademark. Anele and Esmer are frustrating characters. Lets not forget our beloved hero who we all wanted to kill in the first chronicles and still remains the stumbling block for the "others" that don't get the chronicles.

These are difficult books and that is why I love then so much. As do the members of this forum.

But we must admit he has a certain shtick that works. I don't know of any other fantasy writer that does this to the same extent. I actually don't read that much fantasy as I tend to read sci-fi and what they call literature which includes Pynchon, Wallace , Simmons and Borges and etc.

But Donaldson continues to amaze me with his world building and imagery.
He is brutal and at times cruel...

Like life not fantasy...

I see 192 Replies for this section, yet it is still lacking mine, so...... Here it is. I AM currently rereading it,(having just finished the first two trilogies days ago.) so the book is starting to pick up the pieces in all of the right places for me. Just having seen the land be desecrated and made whole by the sunbane and linden, respectively, has my hold on the land much more vivid at the moment. Listening to linden's outrage over what the haruchai have done, Anele's moments of sanity when he screams out in horror at the things that are swirling around in his head, The fact that the Ramen actually have a presence in this epic, the graphic and wrenching walk across time. blah blah blah. get the idea?

Yeah, it felt a lot like reading the first book of the Second Chronicles to me. Lost me, the things lost in the previous Chronicles were sorely missed, and it was difficult to get into. But I think overall, it succeeded over the First Chronicles. And I remember not being excited over a sci-fi premise, as spaceships and stuff usually bore me, but I think the Gap series was the best he has written so far. So returning to Covenant - yes, it is like starting over, and the growing pains are there. I'm missing Vain and Nom and all the Giants that came before, and sorely missing Covenant, but eventually things will shape up and probably be the best yet. I have hope as it seems to me that SRD just keeps topping himself. And I suspect the stakes will be so much more than in the past, and the tension will get unbelievable, if the last Gap book is any indication of SRD craft.

I am sad though, as when I read the first two chronicles, all books were out there, as WGW had recently been published. The Gap was difficult to wait for, but I did it. I'm looking forward to reading Runes again, probably in August, to sit back and enjoy it instead of feeling especially critical. I know he's leading us in a good direction, and we'll all be pleased, but we have to get through the foundation bits.

Jeremiah's father has never been referred to. He may be dead like Linden's or he may have divorced Jeremiah's mother.

Dead or missing fathers are a common element in the Chronicles: Roger, Elena, Linden, Sunder, the First, and the Merewives (as daughters of Kastenessen) all suffer this loss.

Good Post Chasmys.

Seems Covenant has his handicap. A disease that left him alone and not believing. Looks like Linden has her "disease" , emotional detachment. Three times she has had somebody who left her and now she trying to hold onto her son.

Ard Rhys wrote:As I've already said, it's not the wait that made me crazy about Runes. It's not the years between volumes that bothers me about Runes. It's not the action -- or lack thereof -- that bothers me about Runes (a prologue shouldn't have massive amounts of action). It is not the story that bothers me about Runes.

It is the prose that bothers me about Runes. It is a faded, shadowy reflection of what came before in the series and I think that more than anything is what bothers most who didn't like Runes as much as they were hoping to. The change in style is undeniable and inarguable if you break the sentences and paragraphs down into their components. Those components do not line up with what SRD wrote before. Sad, sad, sad.

But I will read Revenant. And keep my fingers crossed. I know it won't match the prose he had before, but maybe it will be better than Runes.

You have taken the words right out of my mouth Yes I was VERY let down with Runes.I hoped for years that he would pick the pen back up,and continue the series with another 3 or 4 books,and give it a grand send off.

Now... I at times,almost wish he never started back in on it in the first place.I will reserve final judgement until the last book.Oh and one
other thing.... The man who read for the audio book was,well,terrible.

Same one who read for the Sword OF Shannara series on CD.That was a great series of books, but I had to force my way through the audio books.Terry Anne did a wonderful job with the first books,and I dont know his name,but the reader for 'The One Tree" Just flat out 1000% brilliant work.Listening to PitchWife with his voice...wow,just wow... Bring him back,whoever he was... I have all the audio books for the series and love to listen to them all,but Runes.I have them all on my 5g Ipod,and they got allot of play let me tell ya

How do you have audio books for the Covenant series?

Someone reads them aloud into some form of recording device.



Sorry, I appear to be turning into dAN.