Kevin's Watch

Mordant's Need isn't a need it's a MUST

Holsety wrote:Maybe I should clarify, since upon reading what I actually wrote in the topic I was by no means specific. I enjoyed the series as a whole and thought the plot was interesting. However, for whatever reason I didn't enjoy the prose style and such as much as his other works.

I can't cite any specific examples, but I often had the feeling that X statement or dialogue was somewhat simple.

the thing that struck me as SOON as i started reading The Mirror of Her Dreams (started reading it this past Saturday,almost finished now) was how much it sounded just like how SRD talks when he's explaining something!!!
i mean i could almost hear him in some passages.

that's really what drew me into the story.
its completely different in style and tone than Gap or The Chrons.

(for a sample of what i mean, watch episode 40 of Fantasy Bedtime Hour)

I should really read these again. I have 'em on my shelf ready to go. But Donaldson is sometimes a chore rather than a joy to read, but his payoffs are so damn good. And chore is probably the wrong term, but I can't think of it right now. It's just that it takes a lot more work than, say, a Harry Potter book.
I think I've only read the MN books once (probably the first book twice to remind myself what I read to prepare for the second book), and I remember that I enjoyed them, and the payoff was great, but all that sticks out is that there was some guy in some Arabian Nights type setting wanting to rape the main character. I know there was a lot of political intrigue, but...yeah, I think I was expecting another Covenant, and this just felt alien and not as inviting to me. The Gap well made up for it all, though, and was much easier to read, for some reason, aside from all the unpleasantness.
I think I was in high school when I read them, or early college, so I really must reread. I'll probably enjoy them a lot more now.

I remember a big sci-fi/fantasy reader friend of mine had never read any Donaldson before, and he picked up Lord Foul's Bane and didn't like it. For some reason, he later picked up the MN series, or maybe borrowed from me, and claimed he liked them better than Covenant. I had to disagree, and forced him beyond the first Covenant book, and he later agreed with me.

Well, I should reread, and maybe do the "newbie perspective" thing so many do around here. And since I have the memory of a fly for stuff I've read even a year ago, it will more than likely be like reading for the first time.

We are planning to start a very informal group read next week if'n you wanna come on in and play with us. Come on Cagbro....you know you wanna.....

count me as one of SRD's fans who loved MN, and while it was not a story on the epic scale of the TC Chronicles, the character work in it is superb, imo, and is a great yarn with a unique approach to "magic".

Lucimay wrote:the thing that struck me as SOON as i started reading The Mirror of Her Dreams (started reading it this past Saturday,almost finished now) was how much it sounded just like how SRD talks when he's explaining something!!!

I think that hearing an author speak changes what happens when you read him next. (Go way back in time to this post.)

I had a chance to hear him speak very recently; I'm wondering what that will do when I read Fatal Revenant, with more than a little trepidation.)

Cameraman Jenn wrote:We are planning to start a very informal group read next week if'n you wanna come on in and play with us. Come on Cagbro....you know you wanna.....

Yeah....awright

I can see why some people find it difficult to get into MN, especially if they come from other SRD writings, as the style here is completly different. Initally I found these very hard to get into. Kinda dry, lesser scale, and where TC immeadiately struck me as tragic, Terisa struck me as kinda whiney and mopey more than anything else. I first started them on a very looooong plane ride, and that was probably a good thing, 'cause it forced me to keep reading. And I'm very glad I did. They really took off for me in the second half of the first book, and just got better from there.

I have reread them once, and now that I know where things are going the beginning "slowness" seems to make more sense. And I don't consider Terisa a whiney character any more, in fact I find her to be pretty darn interesting. Though she's not my favorite character in the books by any stretch. That would have to be Joyse or Joyse's insane imager (sorry, I'm blanking on the name, I don't have my books with me).

"Balls of a goat!" How could you forget Adept Havelock! Welcome!

Yup, that was the name. Thanks for the assist (and the welcome).

Welcome indeed.

--A

Hrm, I think my perspective is extremely different from most Donaldson fans when it comes to Mordant. MN was the first Donaldson I read, and at a very young age too. (I was 12 or so when I read it) I was coming right out of my complete disillusionment with The Wheel of Time. (That was about when Path of Daggers came out and it started to get REALLY shitty) At the time, I knew I was reading something MUCH better than WoT. I was completely entranced by this world, even as a juvenile. I'm not sure if I read it before or after LOTR, (It was about the same time I know) but I always like MN more than any other fantasy I had ever read.

Several years later I reread the books (after I graduated High school) and unearthed another level of character depth I had never seen before. The cast of characters is simply the most endearing I had ever encountered, and as far as an ensemble goes, I think MN has one of the strongest in any novel I have read (even the Gap). There isn't ONE character that wouldn't horribly diminish the story by his/her absence.

Finally, I was ready for Covenant, which I blazed through with a furious passion, (my dad tried to push it on me after I had read MN the first time, but I just wasn't ready. I got halfway through the Illearth war and that was as far as I could get)

After Covenant, for the sake of Completion, I read the Gap (which remains my favorite work of SRD. I agree with him that it is his Magnum Opus).

However MN then and now had/has a special place in my heart. After all, even after you read LOTR, the Hobbit stays special.

And I CERTAINLY don't think MN is hackneyed. Especially today, with the massive amount of cheap epic fantasy out there, simple cheap Arthurian fantasy is something of a rare commodity. Mordant isn't the Land, but it is no less compelling. It's a world much more like our own than the Land is, and that's not what a lot of people read fantasy for, but if makes his characters so much more vivid. To me, Joyce and Havelock are MUCH more real than Mhorim and Elena.

The prose may not be as florid, but the storytelling is just as strong, the payoff no less satisfying. All of Donaldson's worlds are different flavors of pie from the same store. The pies are all good cause the store is a damn good one. But, everyone has his or her own favorite flavor. I will NEVER understand people who like Key Lime more than Lemon Meringue, but damn, I know that he makes a damn good Key Lime.

Excellent post The Dreaming.

--A

interesting thread ..

I've read Mordant's Need, about (eek!) 15 years ago, and recently bought 2nd hand copies which I've yet to re-read .. I might have to dust them off and try and get through 'em quickly in the month-long wait 'til Fatal Revenant is released in Australia ..
My main memories of the book focus on the more erotic scenes, which tells me I need to get my mind outta the gutter

Especially since there weren't all that many of them.

Re-read it. There's far more to them than that.

--A

I just reread MN and have to say I really loved it! I didn't remember most of the story (especially in the 2nd book) so it was almost like reading new SRD! Now I can't wait to read them again.

I do remember that the first time I read it when it came out, I wanted it to be more like TCTC... or that is to say, I had expectations that it would be. So I liked it, but it didn't reach the same depths (which I still feel). In so many ways, it takes the same concepts but twists them into different forms. But this time, without any expectations, I was able to fully enjoy it for what it is. A great story, with great characters, and really fun reading with a lot of surprises. I also love the depth of intrigue, which becomes a hallmark of the Gap, but wasn't very important in TCTC.

Two things I can think of set MN apart from TC.

1. The plot is so intricate; that really is the focus. Plot + character development (focused tightly on Terisa and Geraden). Had SRD taken the time to develop Mordant the way he did the Land, gad! the books never would have ended.

2. MN is sci-fi in fantasy garb. I say so because of the mirrors and how they are handled. It's not really 'magic' or 'lore' or even psychology- they just add an unexpected but always thought-provoking plot element. That's what makes it okay to bring in a guy in a space suit, complete with blasters.

I like the way SRD cast the books as 'fairy tales' in the introduction. That creates a mindset that this is going to be different from TC, and it's okay. Less dark, but satisfyingly brilliant in its own merits.

Yes, I also love the fairy tale beginning of the book.

And since this was actually the first SRD series I had ever read, I had no pre-conceived notions of what it should be.

It is a very different style, that's for sure. In a way it demonstrates Donaldson's ability as a writer. At first I wasn't sure that I liked it, but part of that I think comes from the fact that it is as said a much more subtle book. You notice that the intrigues and struggles mostly happen at Joyse's court for one thing--these are a people wary and suspicious of one another, made up of uneasy alliances of necessity. This is a sharp contrast to the Land, where there are good and evil forces at work, plain and simple. Some wonder why the Ravers didn't just infiltrate Revelstone. If Ravers existed in Mordant they would have destroyed the kingdom in a month; in the Land inevitably anyone with any sense of Lore would see them for what they were. I think that alone demonstrates the difference.

Another interesting contrast is this: while in the Land those who are devoted to higher learning are deeply connected to the very place they live in, in Mordant it's quite the opposite. They are seeing rather narrowly other places that they try to gain a small measure of control over. Right away it's clear that these are people for whom control and power is very important. Even the way they go about things with one another is different--they are reluctantly together, forced to be together as a compromise with Joyse.

Because of these contrasts Donaldson has to go at a different pace--it becomes much more important to present many characters to have an intrigue driven story take place.