Kevin's Watch

Guns, when you say "Roger is a revenant of TC's and Joans imperfect union", just for one, what meaning of 'revenant' are you using? It sounds more like you are thinking of the word "remnant": something that remains. Could you clarify?

Wayfriend wrote:Guns, when you say "Roger is a revenant of TC's and Joans imperfect union", just for one, what meaning of 'revenant' are you using? It sounds more like you are thinking of the word "remnant": something that remains. Could you clarify?

Websters defines a revenant as "one that returns after death or a long absence"

Roger returned after 18 years to "claim his birthright". In our world, 18 years is a fair piece of time. Moreover, he along with Linden, Joan, and apperently Jermiah have all died in their translation to the Land.

Roger is a symbol of TC & Joans imperfect union. If TC is the White gold, and Joan (or at least her health) has some sort of connection to the Land (consider the factthat she was creating Ceasures by whacking herself on the head while wearing her ring), then the implications for what Roger is capable of in the Land as a product of their union are truly horriffic to consider.

My friends, you know that I love you all and I only say this with the utmost respect but how could you all be so stupid?
The Fatal Revenant is OBVIOUSLY the guy in the white robe pictured on the cover.

A Gunslinger wrote:

Wayfriend wrote:Guns, when you say "Roger is a revenant of TC's and Joans imperfect union", just for one, what meaning of 'revenant' are you using? It sounds more like you are thinking of the word "remnant": something that remains. Could you clarify?

Websters defines a revenant as "one that returns after death or a long absence"
Roger returned after 18 years to "claim his birthright". In our world, 18 years is a fair piece of time. Moreover, he along with Linden, Joan, and apperently Jermiah have all died in their translation to the Land.

Roger is a symbol of TC & Joans imperfect union. If TC is the White gold, and Joan (or at least her health) has some sort of connection to the Land (consider the factthat she was creating Ceasures by whacking herself on the head while wearing her ring), then the implications for what Roger is capable of in the Land as a product of their union are truly horriffic to consider.

That def could be applied to Thomas Covenant himself! <- perfect for the Paradox of the White Gold.

A Gunslinger wrote:Roger returned after 18 years to "claim his birthright".

Ah. I get you. But I would say that not everything that is a symbol of something is a revenant.

High Lord Tolkien wrote:My friends, you know that I love you all and I only say this with the utmost respect but how could you all be so stupid?
The Fatal Revenant is OBVIOUSLY the guy in the white robe pictured on the cover.

Where's the thread for that? I've been dying to find out who it is.

This of course may be old news to everyone but me but I just saw this for the first time the other day. (Sorry but it took me a while to find the right existing FR thread to post this in.)

If you go to SRD's official site and look in the upper left hand corner of the opening page under his name you will see a changing graphic touting FR. At one point the graphic will provide a link to what it calls a "trailer" which will open up in a new window. Referring to Linden, here is some of the text from that trailer:

But now her heart has darkened and the staff with it.
Betrayal and battle have burned her to the core
leaving nothing of her former self
but a fatal revenant.

So while certainly there could be more than one meaning of FR or more than one actual FR, it would seem that Linden is certainly in the mix!

Oh, I forgot to mention the last line

"Oh, Linden. What have you done?"

Appropriate curveball as to who is the revenant...

lurch wrote: the quick little " was it her imagination" that she may be in a ambulance rushing to a hospital,,oww, that son of a gun!!

Huh?? Did I miss that "quick little" somewhere?

Here are a couple of quotes (I've got it on mobipocket, so the page #'s are screwed).

P. 969 (~252 in the book):

His design for the salvation of the Land made no provision for his ex-wife's wedding band-or for their fatal son.

I think it's one of the few times SRD uses the word fatal in the book. I'm pretty sure he'd use it very carefully.

There's also this:

P. 1719 (~448):

To her ears, she sounded callous. Her tone falsified what she felt. But remnants of dreams clunt to her like revenants. Vile scurrying seemed to lurk beneath the surface of her attention. When she had restored Joan's wedding band, she had made possible atrocities like the destruction of First Woodhelven.

That's the only time he used the word revenant in the book. I don't think it's all that helpful, but I figured I'd point it out. (Kind of funny that he uses remnant and revenant in the same sentence-see Wayfriend's post at the top of the page.)

its definately Linden. Like it was said before a revenant is someone who returns after a lengthy absense. And fatal means "causing or capable of causing death; mortal; deadly" or "causing destruction, misfortune, ruin, or failure". The second one fits Linden pretty well, since ever since the Staff of Law darkened she seemed to care about nothing but her secret purpose of resurrecting TC. And that act is apparantly leading the the rousing of the WotWE which is obviously "causes destruction, misfortune, ruin, failure, and death".

yeah, i was a bit puzzled about who the fatal revenant was. i never really saw anything scary when i was actually reading the book but if the law of death has been broken just like when kevin was resserected then wouldn't that make covenant the ghost

no bloody wonder the urviles were supporting linden

i get a shiver up my spine just thinking about all the scenes they appear

In SRD books the meaning behind a title is left purposefully ambiguous but usually boils down to two identifiable characters or ideas. The fatal revenant is anybody in FR who is both fatal and a revenant. This could refer to either TC or Roger.

All the points about Linden being the fatal revenant are well taken. But I believe the title "Fatal Revenant" is mostly a reference to Roger (posing as his father's revenant) with the extremely fatal intention of using the Power of Command to rouse the Worm of the World's End.

All things considered and SRD being the writer he is, I'm pretty convinced that there is not one fatal revenant, but several.

Linden, surely.
TC, surely.
Anele, in at least one sense (as being decreed by fate, and returning from the past).
Roger, probably.
Joan? I have kind of a hard time grasping her in the last chrons since her mind's all gone, but her use of wild magic is surely fatal and echoes of TC's inability to master it aswell.
Jerry? Is he "returning" to the Land, or maybe even "returning" to Linden? But on the other hand, he hasn't ever really been there with her earlier.
The list goes on... the guy on the cover included. But one name just sprang to my mind - what about the Theomach? Do his ablilities and (actions) qualify him for revenant-ship too?

But if you'd force me to pick one, I'd pick two: Linden and TC.

TheWormoftheWorld'sEnd wrote:

Spoiler

possibly a spoiler. I should add that Roger is a possible candidate for being a fatal revenant because of his disguise, not because of who he is.

I agree with you,but Roger may be the fatal revenant because of his disguise AND because of who he is.

Of course,Linden and/or TC are most likely to be what SRD meant by "Fatal Revenant".

I thought it was Elvis.

Who Is The FATAL REVENANT?

Isn't that a bit like watching the Star Wars pre-quels and asking "Who is the Phantom Menace?"

hyarmion wrote:Who Is The FATAL REVENANT?

Isn't that a bit like watching the Star Wars pre-quels and asking "Who is the Phantom Menace?"

No,because it's obvious who it is in Start Wars,but in TCTC there are several characters who could be Fatal Revenants,each in his/her own way. The trick is to figure out to who EXACTLY was SRD referring to.
In SW (Phantom Menace),you have only 2 "candidates" - out of which only one presents a direct threat.

I take it you think TC is the Fatal Revenant?

Vanja the Gravelingas wrote:The trick is to figure out to who EXACTLY was SRD referring to.

Or not. Personally I think SRD digs ambiguity, and intentionally chooses titles that can have multiple referrents.