Kevin's Watch

High Lord Tolkien wrote:I still think that the One Tree is really a horn like structure on top of the Worm's head like a unicorn.

What type of tree do you suppose it could be: gilden, banyan, tamarind....?

Krazy Kat wrote:

High Lord Tolkien wrote:I still think that the One Tree is really a horn like structure on top of the Worm's head like a unicorn.

What type of tree do you suppose it could be: gilden, banyan, tamarind....?

obviously

WORMWOOD.


Duh.

High Lord Tolkien wrote: I still think that the One Tree is really a horn like structure on top of the Worm's head like a unicorn.

Wow. I like this idea. So if this is true it means that we're going to see the One Tree again, riding on the snout of the Worm. It laso means that when the Worm will see Linden holding her staff it's going to get mighty angry and will be 'One Treeing' her!

I always imagined it as the tip of its tail.

I'm Murrin wrote:I always imagined it as the tip of its tail.

I think this is contradicted by TOT. Before they reach the one tree island they pass a vast gathering of Nicor that is supposed to be their spawning ground, ie the Worm's tail. It's proximity to the island was taken as evidence that the Worm rests in a circle with its tail and head close to one another. But with the new information in AATE that the Worm is only a few hills long we can conclude that this is not true.

Vraith wrote:

Krazy Kat wrote: What type of tree do you suppose it could be: gilden, banyan, tamarind....?

obviously

WORMWOOD.

Duh.

LOL How do I give you something for that zinger?! Well played.

shadowbinding shoe wrote:

I'm Murrin wrote:I always imagined it as the tip of its tail.

I think this is contradicted by TOT. Before they reach the one tree island they pass a vast gathering of Nicor that is supposed to be their spawning ground, ie the Worm's tail. It's proximity to the island was taken as evidence that the Worm rests in a circle with its tail and head close to one another. But with the new information in AATE that the Worm is only a few hills long we can conclude that this is not true.

Maybe à la Gozer, the Worm is "whatever it wants to be". Or at least, whatever SIZE it wants to be?

Remind me, where is their spawning ground linked to the worm's tail? I don't recall that.

shadowbinding shoe wrote:It laso means that when the Worm will see Linden holding her staff it's going to get mighty angry and will be 'One Treeing' her!

Don't make it sound so dirty, someone may make a hentai out of it. And we already have the obligatory tentacle monster.

Frostheart wrote:

shadowbinding shoe wrote:It also means that when the Worm will see Linden holding her staff it's going to get mighty angry and will be 'One Treeing' her!

Don't make it sound so dirty, someone may make a hentai out of it.

Hey, I take no responsibility for any hentai craziness I may have inspired.

And we already have the obligatory tentacle monster.

What, you mean She? Aren't hentai tentacle monsters supposed to be male?

You forgot the Lurker!

Frostheart wrote:

You forgot the Lurker!

I did

I'm Murrin wrote:Remind me, where is their spawning ground linked to the worm's tail? I don't recall that.

Elemesnedene, maybe

I've just finished a reread of The One Tree, sooo enjoyable! It's interesting how much more closely discussions like this make me attend to any clues that SRD has included in the story regarding the One Tree and the Worm. An interesting thing that Findail says that I hadn't payed heed to before is the relationship between the One Tree and the Worm (Chapter 27, p. 471 of my copy):

'The One Tree is not destroyed. It is a mystery of the Earth. While the Earth endures, it too will endure in its way.'

Earlier Linden has also said something interesting (back in the days when she actually said relevant things!) (Chapter 25, p. 456):

'Something else here.... They're connected - but they aren't the same.'

'The Tree isn't why nothing lives here. It doesn't make the air smell like the end of the world. It doesn't have that kind of power. There's something else here..... Resting.'

I always thought that the One Tree was something growing out of the Worm, like an extension of it, but now I'm reconsidering that. I am now seeing them as two separate things, so I think the likelihood of the One Tree travelling with the Worm is a lot less than I would have previously thought.

It's also interesting to speculate (now that we know the physical size of the Worm) how the earth will end. I had always imagined that the Worm was much bigger so that its awakening and uncurling would destroy the world. Now I can imagine the Worm eating all the Earthpower in the world, but then heading off into the cosmos leaving the empty (but intact) husk of the world behind. (Would this soulless world end up like ours?)

I've also been thinking about the Elohim, The One Tree and the Guardian. Brinn says Chapter 24, p. 445:

'Ur-lord,.... the approach to the One Tree lies before you.... I have opened it to you.'

The Elohim placed a guardian at the site of the One Tree, not to prevent anyone from approaching it, but to only permit certain people to approach it, Berek and Covenant. Those people had to be accompanied by certain other kinds of people who were willing to die (or give their life for them). It raises interesting question about the Elohim's motives, but in a good way for a change.

The speculation continues!

u.

P.S.

Vraith wrote:

Krazy Kat wrote:

High Lord Tolkien wrote:I still think that the One Tree is really a horn like structure on top of the Worm's head like a unicorn.

What type of tree do you suppose it could be: gilden, banyan, tamarind....?

obviously

WORMWOOD.


Duh.

I almost laughed at this, but then I looked at the setup and started to think that Krazy Kat could easily be a Vraith alt and then the joke just looked as lame as all Vraith's jokes

u.

ussusimiel wrote: I almost laughed at this, but then I looked at the setup and started to think that Krazy Kat could easily be a Vraith alt and then the joke just looked as lame as all Vraith's jokes

u.

It may be lame, but I promise you K.K and I are completely different folk. I don't have any alts.

good find on Findail, though...I had forgotten that.

I am wondering how Berek made the staff in the first place. Findail told TC that Berek was able to take a branch from The One Tree because it didnt have a guardian then, didnt have to win his way to the tree thru combat that would rouse the Worm enough to prevent the branch being taken and that Berek himself appointed the first guardian...but now we know this was a lie.

So, how was Berek able to take a branch and Covenant could not, when both basically made the approach the same way?

Darkdenubis wrote:I am wondering how Berek made the staff in the first place. Findail told TC that Berek was able to take a branch from The One Tree because it didnt have a guardian then, didnt have to win his way to the tree thru combat that would rouse the Worm enough to prevent the branch being taken and that Berek himself appointed the first guardian...but now we know this was a lie.

So, how was Berek able to take a branch and Covenant could not, when both basically made the approach the same way?

On to WGW now and this point caught my attention. Findail says that the Tree didn't have a guardian, but, IIRC, we're told in the Last Chrons that the Elohim did set a guardian on the Tree. (Could someone remind where that is in the Last Chrons?)

The difference between Berek and Covenant would most likely be the White Gold. It may be that any approach by White Gold towards the Tree would cause a reaction (regardless of Covenant having the venom reducing his control). If this was the case then anyone (in this case Seadreamer) who touched the Tree would cause the Worm to defend it in the manner it did.

u.

ussusimiel wrote: On to WGW now and this point caught my attention. Findail says that the Tree didn't have a guardian, but, IIRC, we're told in the Last Chrons that the Elohim did set a guardian on the Tree. (Could someone remind where that is in the Last Chrons?)

u.

I don't have the specific chapter in front of me, but I think it's in FR, when Stave tells Linden the story of the Haruchai's first encounter with the Insequent. That's when Linden comes to comprehend The Theomach's true identity.

dlbpharmd wrote:

ussusimiel wrote: On to WGW now and this point caught my attention. Findail says that the Tree didn't have a guardian, but, IIRC, we're told in the Last Chrons that the Elohim did set a guardian on the Tree. (Could someone remind where that is in the Last Chrons?)

u.

I don't have the specific chapter in front of me, but I think it's in FR, when Stave tells Linden the story of the Haruchai's first encounter with the Insequent. That's when Linden comes to comprehend The Theomach's true identity.

That sounds right. (Not sure I have the stomach for a Last Chrons reread )

It raises interesting questions though, because the Guardian is not invincible. Obviously, the Deus Ex nature of the Insequent allows for the ability of the Theomach to defeat the Wurd of the Earth, but why did the the Elohim allow for the possibility that an ordinary mortal (if you could call the Haruchai that) could defeat the Guardian? Did they foresee that Berek and Covenant would need to approach the Tree at some point?

There may also be some retconning going on because Brinn (as Guardian) says that he is many beings because that that is how the Guardian is renewed over the ages. He implies that ak-Haru Kenaustin Ardenol is the general, rather than specific, name for the Guardian. This would indicate that at the time of writing of WGW that SRD had no conception yet of the Insequent.

u.

ussusimiel wrote: There may also be some retconning going on because Brinn (as Guardian) says that he is many beings because that that is how the Guardian is renewed over the ages. He implies that ak-Haru Kenaustin Ardenol is the general, rather than specific, name for the Guardian. This would indicate that at the time of writing of WGW that SRD had no conception yet of the Insequent.

u.

On the last, I'm pretty sure you're close to right...I THINK I remember something from the G.I. where SRD said he hadn't come up with the Insequent yet, per se, but the space they fill/role in the story was there and intentional. Pretty sure he also said there was an "oops" with the Guardian timeline.
As far as the name...ak-Haru part is possibly just the generic name for guardian...but Kenaustin Ardenol is the specific, True Name of the Insequent who filled that role. It's interesting that the Haruchai have a different kind of relationship with that particular embodiment of the Guardian than the rest of the world:
For them, it's personal.
...which gave me a thought that isn't likely to be true, but I really like it:
Brinn was able to defeat the Guardian because he knew it's true name.
He wouldn't use it, even if he knew the power the name would have...that's "lore," or a "weapon," in their terms. Still, knowledge is power....

AND...that made me realize::: Brinn DEFINITELY knew exactly who/what he was fighting and how it would do battle, if not the whole time at least he did as soon as he saw the Guardian. The Har. do not forget. . To me, that changes the tone/implications of the Haruchai story up to that point [at least it might... on my next read through it'll be in my mind.

I don't think anyone else has followed that thought before...apologies if I'm accidentally plagiarizing someone.

Vraith wrote:
AND...that made me realize::: Brinn DEFINITELY knew exactly who/what he was fighting and how it would do battle, if not the whole time at least he did as soon as he saw the Guardian. The Har. do not forget. . To me, that changes the tone/implications of the Haruchai story up to that point [at least it might... on my next read through it'll be in my mind.

I don't think anyone else has followed that thought before...apologies if I'm accidentally plagiarizing someone.[/color]

Brinn couldn't have done that.
When the Theomach became the Guardian the "transcended" (i think that was the term) his name. So he couldn't be invoked anymore.

"the Theomach passed beyond self and craving to join the rare company of those who do not heed death. And therefore the Vizard did not scruple to reveal the Theomach's true name, for he could not longer be harmed by it."