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Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 5:33 pm
by Vraith
Avatar wrote:Agreed.
And reconstruction was no picnic for blacks or whites if they were southern.
--A
A lesson that seems history has to teach over and over: It is bad to keep punishing the losers afterwards.
There's quite a strong case to be made that Hitler and WWII might not have happened if it weren't for the punishments heaped on Germany after WWI.
Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 6:09 pm
by Cybrweez
Yea, I see the lesson. I'm also aware that the Germans, or in this case, the south, are the agitators both times. So they set up the scenario in which they receive punishment, which then sets up the scenario for them to receive more punishment. Maybe the better lesson, stop being stupid (20th century Germany, 19th century south).
Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 8:20 pm
by Hashi Lebwohl
The Confederacy's main problem was that they believed the fantasy that an agricultural economy could outperform an industrial economy. This isn't to say that agriculture is not important--food and clothing are vital necessities--but agriculture is mind-numbingly slow compared to industry. Also, the plantation owners had developed an aristocracy for themselves which even Europe was moving away from at that time; while the rest of the West was marching into industrialization the Old South was actually moving backwards.
If either of the following things had happened then the Confederacy might have been able to last longer or possibly even be victorious:
1) if the French had won the Battle of Puebla in 1861 then they would have been able to supply the Confederacy with troops and weapons. Spain had fallen far from being a world power and Napoleon III wanted to become the preeminent power in Europe; being able to keep the United States divided would have done much to seal his position. Mexico, on the other hand, had not forgotten the events of 1836--Texas Independence was only 25 years before the Civil War and memories do not fade that quickly. Texas, being somewhat part of the Confederacy, meant that Mexico was diplomatically opposed to them as well as their erstwhile French allies.
2) if the oil field around Beaumont had been discovered and tapped 45 years before they actually were then the Confederacy would have had an ample supply of money from the oil. Spindletop in 1856 would have been sufficient to turn the tide of the mid- to late-Civil War--embargo any oil going to the North to stop any fuel-run machinery they were using. Distilled petroleum products combined with internal combustion engines could have given the Confederacy more efficient trains and possibly automobiles for moving troops.
I am no fan of the Confederacy and I do not with they had won. However, considering alternatives and trying to analyze what might have happened is almost as fun as studying the actual history of what did happen.
Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:53 pm
by Lady Revel
HLT said:
I just finished reading:
The Devil in the White City: Murder, Magic, and Madness at the Fair That Changed America
That book was so good, I read it twice.