Babylon 5

Post by **Cail** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:41 pm

Not a fan of season 5, but I liked Crusade.

Post by **sindatur** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 9:29 pm

Creator wrote:What did you think of the last season? I felt it was a bit of a let down after the climactic Shadow / Vorlon resolution. And then the poisioned earth ...

S5 started Rough, because of the unsurety of being renewed, so JMS had to close up all the threads at the end of S4. It should have been that S4 threads lapped a few episodes into S5, and the S5 threads were introduced in S4 (IE: The Earth Civil War should've ended by Ep 3-5 of S5, while the Telepaths should've started filtering onto B5 in the last 3-5 episodes of S4. This would've made a much smoother transition, and the start of S5 wouldn't have been so rough and seemingly slow.

by mid S5, though, I felt the episodes were just as good as the show ever was, with the Alliance going after Centauri Prime, Londo's keeper, Lennier's betrayal. Garibaldi's drinking.

Also, Claudia Christian's departure, caused the need to bring in Lochley, and in the final season it was a little to late to have to get to know a new Station Captain.

Post by **Fist and Faith** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 10:49 am

Never got around to this show. I just watch the first episode last night. We'll see how it goes. I only knew J. Michael Straczynski from comic books. He wrote some fantastic stuff.

Post by **sindatur** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 1:03 pm

Fist and Faith wrote:Never got around to this show. I just watch the first episode last night. We'll see how it goes. I only knew J. Michael Straczynski from comic books. He wrote some fantastic stuff.

Season 1 spends alot of time building the Universe and introducing Plot/Arc threads slowly (That are often difficult to see until you've seen it all the way through), and some people find it too slow. If you find that to be the case, stick with it, and you should be greatly rewarded

Post by **Hashi Lebwohl** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 1:57 pm

Agreed--Season 1 is the weakest but then JMS was trying to get a space-based show off the ground which wasn't Star Trek *and* he was directly competing with DS9 at the time.

The rumors never did get settled about DS9/B5. Both are shows set on a station next to a wormhole/jump gate, both have a host of shadowy characters coming and going at all times, both feature two races who have only recently gotten out of a war with one planet freeing itself from occupation by the other planet (Narn = Bajor, Centauri = Cardassian), and the captain of the station has a special destiny ahead of him. I haven't checked in a while but the rumor is that JMS pitched B5 to Paramount before DS9 was in the works....

Still....Rodenberry liked JMS and thought the show was well-done. It is telling that Keonig jumped at the chance to play Bester--JMS left much of the characterization to Koenig's decisions--and that Majel Barrett herself plays a character on the show.

Post by **Ananda** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 4:21 pm

I really enjoyed B5 but, yes, the first season was very bad. Much of the second was not very good, either. But, as Sin says, it does pay off.

Just be careful to not let your high after watching it lead you to watch his next series as that was perhaps the worst show ever made.

Post by **Hashi Lebwohl** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:11 pm

Crusade was okay but I can't stand how JMS gimped the Psi Corps. In reality--as real as we can get when telepathy is the subject--Psi Corps should have owned all of Earth and there wouldn't have been anything the mundanes could have done about it.

It was interesting to have Galen on that show, though. I say "interesting" because by that time Galen was one of the most powerful beings in the galaxy but you wouldn't know it to look at him. He had uncovered secrets of technomancy which made him just about equal with any of the First Ones--he could cloak or shield himself like a Shadow, fire Shadowship energy blasts from his hands, interface with any technology, or even encase you in a bubble which collapses on itself as it gets pushed out of existence.

Post by **Fist and Faith** » Sat Aug 30, 2014 12:26 am

Alfred Bester's The Demolished Man is one of the best psi books I've read. I thought it was great to see that name when I was looking at the Psi Corps Trilogy books.

Post by **ussusimiel** » Sat Aug 30, 2014 12:27 am

It is certainly a show that builds well and rewards investment. There is a hammyness to the first series that is kind of nice on a rewatch, and the series certainly finds its feet from the 2-3 season onwards. I can see the DS9 parallels now that they are pointed out, and they don't really matter as there are enough significant differences to make the two series both unique in their own ways.

These may qualify as the first box-set experience I have ever had and I gobbled them up!

u.

Post by **Sorus** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 2:21 am

I'm one of those weird people who actually liked the first season.

I remember the DS9 controversy from Star Trek conventions - B5 would always get booed when it was mentioned. It was unpopular to admit to liking it. Good thing I never cared much about being popular.

Post by **sindatur** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:25 pm

Sorus wrote:I'm one of those weird people who actually liked the first season.

In case I gave the wrong impression, I too like Season 1, and was actually hooked solid by the 7th Episode, and could see that Babylon 5 was much more than any other show.

Regarding the DS9/B5 Controversy, I loved them both. I was lucky enough that my WB Station showed them back to back on Wednesday Nights. Best viewing night ever, only seconded by Farscape Fridays on SciFi Channel.

Post by **Vraith** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 5:28 pm

sindatur wrote:Best viewing night ever, only seconded by Farscape Fridays on SciFi Channel.

I quite enjoyed Farscape, though I sometimes picked on it. It had it's problems, and B5 was better...but still.
Sci-Fi friday had a pretty good run...[I think it was only a one-season gap...roughly...between end of Farscape, and beginning of BS-Galactica reboot...and it had some other offerings I liked at least a little.]

Post by **Sorus** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:30 pm

sindatur wrote:In case I gave the wrong impression, I too like Season 1, and was actually hooked solid by the 7th Episode, and could see that Babylon 5 was much more than any other show.

That's about when I got hooked, too.

Vraith wrote:I quite enjoyed Farscape, though I sometimes picked on it.

Me too - nothing wrong with that. It shows you care. I tore holes in BSG from time to time, and that was probably my favorite show ever.

Post by **sindatur** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:06 pm

Sorus wrote:
sindatur wrote:In case I gave the wrong impression, I too like Season 1, and was actually hooked solid by the 7th Episode, and could see that Babylon 5 was much more than any other show.
That's about when I got hooked, too.

Vraith wrote:I quite enjoyed Farscape, though I sometimes picked on it.
Me too - nothing wrong with that. It shows you care. I tore holes in BSG from time to time, and that was probably my favorite show ever.

Yea, Mindwar got me close (Don't know why it's amongst the least popular episodes), but, And The Sky Full of Stars definitely hooked me

Post by **Sorus** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:34 pm

Mindwar was a good episode. The first real look at the Psi Corps, and the resulting tensions and conflicts.

Signs and Portents was an apt name for the first season. The stage for most of the major plot lines was set, even if people didn't realize it at the time.

I should go through and watch it all again marathon-style. Never done that. I imagine it is a different experience.

Post by **ussusimiel** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:37 pm

Sorus wrote:
Vraith wrote:I quite enjoyed Farscape, though I sometimes picked on it.
Me too - nothing wrong with that. It shows you care. I tore holes in BSG from time to time, and that was probably my favorite show ever.

I ran out of steam with Farscape, not sure why. I think I began to find something repetitive and predictable about the episodes. I also found it hard to get invested in the characters. Maybe I watched too many of them too close together. I think I preferred both of the main actors/characters in SG-1.

u.

Post by **Hashi Lebwohl** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:05 am

Sorus wrote: I should go through and watch it all again marathon-style. Never done that. I imagine it is a different experience.

It is. As I bought the box sets of the 5 seasons a couple of years ago we watched one episode per day all the way through the end. I had forgotten--or underestimated--how moving some of the stories can be.

I do admit that JMS really dropped the ball--he set himself up to have an amazing show had he followed the adventures of G'Kar and Lyta as they traveled the galaxy. As it is, he went with Crusade--which didn't appeal as much--and the "didn't strike while the iron was hot" show which was Tales of the Rangers (or something like that).

Post by **I'm Murrin** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:40 am

ussusimiel wrote:
Sorus wrote:
Vraith wrote:I quite enjoyed Farscape, though I sometimes picked on it.
Me too - nothing wrong with that. It shows you care. I tore holes in BSG from time to time, and that was probably my favorite show ever.
I ran out of steam with Farscape, not sure why. I think I began to find something repetitive and predictable about the episodes. I also found it hard to get invested in the characters. Maybe I watched too many of them too close together. I think I preferred both of the main actors/characters in SG-1.

u.

How far did you get? I think Farscape peaked from late season 2 to mid-season 3; season 4 had a really bad start, then got better later.

Post by **ussusimiel** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:30 pm

I'm Murrin wrote:How far did you get? I think Farscape peaked from late season 2 to mid-season 3; season 4 had a really bad start, then got better later.

I got to about Episode 14 of Season 2. It may have been the 'another parasite aboard Moya' plotline that ground me to a halt!

u.

Post by **sindatur** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:09 pm

Hashi Lebwohl wrote:
Sorus wrote: I should go through and watch it all again marathon-style. Never done that. I imagine it is a different experience.
It is. As I bought the box sets of the 5 seasons a couple of years ago we watched one episode per day all the way through the end. I had forgotten--or underestimated--how moving some of the stories can be.

I do admit that JMS really dropped the ball--he set himself up to have an amazing show had he followed the adventures of G'Kar and Lyta as they traveled the galaxy. As it is, he went with Crusade--which didn't appeal as much--and the "didn't strike while the iron was hot" show which was Tales of the Rangers (or something like that).

Yea, the Adventures of G'Kar and Lyta could've been amazing visually. On the other hand, could those adventures truly be done Justice visually, or might they be more amazing left to our imaginations?

Crusade, looked like it was going to be truly awesome by the end of Season 1, had it not been sabotaged by TNT and cancelled before it even aired. Looking at the unfilmed scripts and story ideas for late Season 1 and beyond, it's almost criminal what TNT did to it.

Legend of the Rangers, the Pilot wasn't that great, but, showed a lot of Promise (And remember The Gathering, wasn't that great on it's own, without the Series proper). Ratings suffered due to 9/11 Terror attacks postponing the Superbowl, and WB wouldn't give SciFi Channel a piece of the show. If that had worked out, I think some great things could've come from it

The Lost Tales, it's a shame WB was so cheap with the Budget, we could've gotten some really cool short stories.

Babylon 5 really has been treated like the ugly Stepchild.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that JMS is indeed able to raise the investors for the reboot movie, meaning he can cut WB out it, and that all goes well with it's Box Office.

Farscape, LOL, first time I've heard the complaint that Farscape was too predictable. Farscape was anything but predictable, unless you count not doing the traditional tropes and cliches as that are typically expected as being predictable.

Kevin's Watch

Kevin's Watch

Babylon 5