Kevin's Watch

variol son wrote:That would have to be The Ritual of Desecration and "Lord Mhoram's Victory", since they run on from one another so closely that they are like one big chapter. I love the way that even at the end of themselves, Mhoram, Amatin, Loerya, Trevor, Quaan, Borillar and Tohrm go far beyond their own abilities in serving the Land.

Sum sui generis
Vs

So far "Lord Mhoram's Victory" seems to be in the lead, and I think it's absolutely futile to resist as my first choice~!

I also love the other areas showing the strength of the Lords and how they handled everything thrown against them~!

SIGH. I was afraid this would happen. Is the entirety of the first Chronicles to be reduced to Lord Mhoram's Victory, then? It has somehow won the Oscar for Best Chapter when I didn't even know it was a race?

No Oscars here MM. It's just my fave is all. Other chapters are just as good, but while some readers love the Giants and other love the Bloodguard, I loved the Lords.

Sum sui generis
Vs

Hmm... I need to create a theory on how the fact that LMV is the greatest chapter in the first Chrons proves that the Land is the real reality and our real world is the fake one. TC just had everything flipped backwards...

Matrixman wrote:SIGH. I was afraid this would happen. Is the entirety of the first Chronicles to be reduced to Lord Mhoram's Victory, then? It has somehow won the Oscar for Best Chapter when I didn't even know it was a race?

Sorry if it seems I'm saying what I did as though there aren't any other relevant chapters or other chapters I'd consider favorites~!

It's all 100% relevant to me, and after reading the 1st and 2nd chronicles numerous times, I can only look at the entirety of the work as my favorite, and I don't see "Lord Mhoram's Victory" working out without all the previous chapters that I also love~!

"To Say Farewell" was my favorite chapter in the 2nd chronicles because I thought the ending was so well put together, and it had me pretty emotionally stirred up -- saddened about some things (like it being the end of the chronicles, and I thought the end of the entire series ) while relieved and happy about others, and it was totally cool to see how much Covenant's character had grown by that point.

But again, it couldn't have happened without all the preceding chapters shaping the characters and the outcome, and I love it all~!

I was in a curmudgeonly mood when I wrote my comments, savant. Please don't mind me. I value the opinions of my fellow Watchers.

I guess I was hoping there would be a good variety of favorite chapters discussed in this thread. I have absolutely nothing against Lord Mhoram or his victory. That is certainly a great chapter, no question about that. Hey, I picked it as one of my favorites, too! (If perhaps by default, because the rest of TPTP is so bleak, as I said before.)

I thought there were a good variety of chapters discussed in the thread. It was refreshing to see that the books were appreciated for a multitude of reasons.

Matrixman wrote:I was in a curmudgeonly mood when I wrote my comments, savant. Please don't mind me. I value the opinions of my fellow Watchers.

I guess I was hoping there would be a good variety of favorite chapters discussed in this thread. I have absolutely nothing against Lord Mhoram or his victory. That is certainly a great chapter, no question about that. Hey, I picked it as one of my favorites, too! (If perhaps by default, because the rest of TPTP is so bleak, as I said before.)

I know what you mean. I'm a guitarist and go to a musician's forum everyday where there are actually sub-forums -- some more political and/or straight-ahead trolling and others more on topic with music; I have different types of days there~! We've actually had a couple threads pop up discussing fantasy/sci-fi books, and there's at least another couple people that really like SRV over there. I'll have to see if I can recall who they were or start another thread seeing if they're already aware of such great things as the 3rd Chronicles coming out soon and this forum~!

Oh, yeah; I like what burgs66 said regarding different reasons for people liking the some of the same chapters, and I like some reasons given for liking other chapters, too. I'm going to get back into reading the whole series again (been a loooong time!) and may pull up this thread again when I'm really pulled into a particular chapter~!

Just about to embark on a re-reading of the Chronicles so re-acquainting myself with this forum...

From memory I would have to go with 'Garotting Deep' from TIW or 'Colossus' from TPTP, but would be prepared to be proved wrong by subsequent reading! Runnik's and Tull's tales are also up there, especially given the eerie other-worldly viewpoint of having bloodguard narrate the horrific tale of the Grieve and the journey there. Funny to realise that this was all a clever literary device but it works amazingly well. Having said that 'Message to Revelstone' from TPTP has just popped into my head - for sheer grimness it is difficult to beat:

You are so quick to give your life to nothing. Now you will give it to me.

In the second chronicles it would have to be 'The Banefire' from WGW. Utterly heartbreaking and yet there is so much action going on in this chapter, culminating in Covenant having the grace to

bear what must be bourne

. I have to admit a soft spot for 'Mother's Child' and 'Also Love in the World' from TOT as I really liked the developing relationship between Linden and Covenant. It is really difficult to see how this becomes strained almost beyond breaking in WGW, which is why I would also (like an earlier poster) have to include 'To Say Farewell' in here as well.


I have now named no less than nine chapters in this post so probably just need to go and read the chronicles again...

variol son wrote:That would have to be The Ritual of Desecration and "Lord Mhoram's Victory", since they run on from one another so closely that they are like one big chapter. I love the way that even at the end of themselves, Mhoram, Amatin, Loerya, Trevor, Quaan, Borillar and Tohrm go far beyond their own abilities in serving the Land.

tonyz wrote:The whole siege-of-Revelstone thread in TPTP, perhaps because I like Mhoram as a person much better than Covenant.

variol son wrote:Other chapters are just as good, but while some readers love the Giants and other love the Bloodguard, I loved the Lords.

That pretty much describes it for me. But each time I read it different parts jump out. For example, the last time thru TPTP (about 4 yrs ago), the chapter on Triock's journey to the Unfettered really struck me (is that "Message to Revelstone"?). Or there's the journey to Earthroot in TIW. Or the chapters in Revelstone in LFB, where we first meet the Lords and their way of being. But in the end, what sticks as my favorite are the two that blew me away the first time. Reading "The Ritual of Descration" is probably still the most intense experience I've ever had (while reading ) and "Lord Mhoram's Victory" was the most profound.

My favorite bit of the 1st Chrons starts when that woman pulls her kid out of TC's way when he he goes to town to pay his (telephone?) bill and runs through to his return to Haven farm from hospital after he saves the girl bitten by a snake.

I am in the middle of re-reading the first Chronicles now, and taking my time doing it so I don't miss a thing..

Chapter 8 of The Illearth War, 'Lord Kevin's Lament', is a really good chapter, IMHO. It isn't as epic as 'Lord Mhorams Victory' or Gallows Howe.. But to me it really shows the humanity of several characters..
Specifically the Bloodguard, Troy, TC and Trell. How after thousands of years the Bloodguard still haven't accepted what Kevin did, and how the people of the land fight despair by making songs about it.. Covenant & Troys discussion about the Land, leprosy, and the importance of not having hope was great, but the climax came when Trell came in, a shattered man, and took his anger out on Covenant, then the stone itself. Top that off with TC confessing to Troy that he raped Lena, and then TC pleading with the impassive Bannor, to hear him say 'the Bloodguard do not forgive'.
I suppose it is important as it shows that not everyone in the Land can so readily rise to greatness and surpass themselves.

My favorite chapter is probably the first chapter of TPTP. TC's loneliness and suffering hit me hard, and even now, months after re-reading, it was the first that came to mind. Chapter 2 of the same book is right up there. Both told stories of pain and suffereing, loneliness, hopelessness. They set the mood for the pain-fest that was to follow.

peter wrote:My favorite bit of the 1st Chrons starts when that woman pulls her kid out of TC's way when he he goes to town to pay his (telephone?) bill and runs through to his return to Haven farm from hospital after he saves the girl bitten by a snake.

Well said!

"Lord Mhoram's Victory" stands head over shoulders as the best chapter in the first series. It is breathtaking and it is the climax of a long, dreadful siege bitterly fought from the start, through many chapters. It is the ultimate defiance to desecration. It has been called one of the most important passages in fantasy literature and it is easy to see why.
One word describes it:
Glory.

While I can't dispute the majesty of LMV, two chapters that stand out for me are "Doom's Retreat," from TIW, and "The Unbeliever," from TPTP.

"Doom's Retreat" not only for the massive action, but for Verement's last stand against LF's entire army. And because the Bloodguard came close to defeating a Raver-possessed Giant - a Raver that only survived thanks to the Illearth Stone. Verement's abandon and fatal resolve rock my world every time I read it, and I nearly weep when I read about the Raver trampling the Lord and Bloodguard to pulp on the ground.

"The Unbeliever" because it's the culmination of the trilogy - and because Lord Foul is defeated by the laughter of a Giant. We get the white gold kicking ass - but we get resolution from mercy and laughter.

Just amazing stuff. I'm going to have to reread it all, now.

The blood letting scene in The Wounded Land when we saw what happened to the Land after TC's defeat of Lord Foul. It also ties in directly to what is one of my favorite all time moments when TC rsises The Krill from the bottom of Glimmermere after being there for 4000 years. Truly epic and full of so much hope to the reader after what we had to endure to what happened to The Land up to this point.

But yes, Lord Mhoram's victory was so awesome it shouldn't even be allowed to count for this discussion. lol

StarRider wrote:The blood letting scene in The Wounded Land when we saw what happened to the Land after TC's defeat of Lord Foul. It also ties in directly to what is one of my favorite all time moments when TC rsises The Krill from the bottom of Glimmermere after being there for 4000 years. Truly epic and full of so much hope to the reader after what we had to endure to what happened to The Land up to this point.

But yes, Lord Mhoram's victory was so awesome it shouldn't even be allowed to count for this discussion. lol

Good answer. "Soothtell" is an awesome chapter!

"Soothtell" and "Lord Mhoram's victory" both have strong elements of Robert E. Howard in them. Both of these chapters are excellent, and both are the strongest evidence that Donaldson reads Howard.

Yes, "The Danger in Dreams", the first Chapter of TPTP is amazingly powerful and brutal. I always loved the contrast of the sections where TC was back home!

From the 2nd Chronicles, "Coercri" (the last Chapter of TWL) was absolutely awesome with the white gold caamora redeeming the dead Unhomed.

And from the Last Chronicles (am I allowed to mention them....), I thought the first Chapter of AATE was a fantastic piece of writing.