Kevin's Watch

I could get behind nixing DRP sharing. It implies that DRP is some sort of capital to spend, that we have some sort of power beyond our domains (well, probably more than implies, since there is manifesting, divine battles, and other such common abilities). I think gods could still work together on actions; it would just mean they each had to lend their unique strengths to the project.

However, I think domain only actions would require a slight boost in efficiency or efficacy. Otherwise, you pretty much ensure that a lone wolf type of player couldn't make it.

Artifacts, unless specifically attuned should be usable by anyone who picks them up and knows how to work it. When I created Ferax's hammer, Mjaellar, last game, I was sure to state that it would be unweildable by anyone who couldn't name it. Perhaps one of the reasons Xar let the name of it slip out was because I didn't put extra DRP into it for that. (it was only the first turn, afterall)

Yes, the more I think about it, I too see the wisdom of this idea.

I balked at it at first, thinking it would be too restrictive. On the other hand, it would force us to be more creative and that is the best thing about this game. It would make me think outside the box.

I could get behind this idea as well.

Slowly, the tide turns. Heh. There are any number of small examples of how things would have had to have been done in ways other than they were. Hell, I've allocated DRPs to others in all 3 games. But for big examples, there's Argothoth's massive raising. A 30-DRP spell couldn't happen. Or at least it would take some serious thought and imagination to come up with a legitimate way of having several deities join together to cast a combined spell to accomplish the goal.

Yeah...almost a third of the players have shown support for the idea, Fist. And there are probably more who haven't voiced an opinion yet...

*slowly shaking head*

Well, I disagree. Our power is not "domain power". We gain strength from the worship of mortals, and that strength is a universal thing that applies to al the gods whateer their domain: it is not specified. The domain is not the type of power the god is capable of using, it is the type of power the god does use. It's a matter of attitude and behaviour, not specific type of strength. In my mind, anyway.
When my (Bel's) worshippers give strength to me (him) through their faith, it is the raw power of worship, not "peace power". I should be able to put this raw strength to what purpose I choose, within the game's system--ie, within Bel's domain, should he shape the power's expression himself; or in the domain of another, should he allow that other to shape the use of it.

Well, I see your point. And, of course, it's as legitimate a viewpoint as what I'm suggesting, and well-expressed. And I've been happy playing under that system for three games now. Heh. I'm just suggesting a different one. One where the power the worshipers supply IS usable only for the domain their worship is directed toward. One where the power of the embodiment of the Forests can't be used in non-Forest ways.

(I hope I'm quoting in context)

Back on Page one of this thread Xar wrote:

A deity who has a Major and a Minor domain will have about 75% efficacy when using the Major domain, and 25% when using the Minor domain... if he has two Minor domains, he'll have 50% efficacy with the Major domain, and 25% each with the two Minor domains.

For example, a sea deity wants to start a tidal wave. If he only has the Major domain "Sea", he'll spend, let's say, 4 DRPs in order to start the tidal wave. But if he has the Major domain "Sea" and another, minor domain, he'll have to expend 5 DRPs to do the same (because he has 75% efficacy), and if he has two minor domains, he'll have to expend 6 DRPs to do the same thing. In exchange, however, he has more flexibility because of additional domains.

The above would suggest to me that using your DRP outside your domain would already make it much less effective than using it within your domain. Which is why, I'm sure, most of us do use our power predominantly within our domains. A rule absolutely forbidding outside domain use would maybe increase creativity, but it would also increase ludicrous justifications in storylines/turns.

As for giving power to another diety to use within their domain for you: my problem with changing this system and having to barter favours within our own domains, is that even with the current system, it can be exceptionally difficult to have enough meaningful communications with another player to make a deal. The proposed system would mean more wheeling and dealing. That's fine if I want to make a deal with Menolly or Fist and Faith, because I know they'll be on KW regularly enough to do so, but with the less frequently online players, it'll be nearly impossible.

So I'm against a change.

Extremely good point about not having enough time to negotiate with some. My idea would make plans go slower anyway, since even if I didn't have a problem with whatever somebody was asking of me, I might not be able to put my own plans on hold for a while. Add the time it would take for some to come to an agreement merely because of what you brought up, Stone, and... Whereas just giving me your DRP to do it could be done right away. IF Xar was going to consider what I've been saying in the first place, that might nix the idea.

I think we should focus on playing rather than changing the rules! [I KNOW, I KNOW ... you are all bored waiting for the results or cryptic hints!]

Also, as a god that was jumped by at least five deities and almost pounded into dust ... I LIKE being able to use donated DRP. I think such a rule only works when the Patheon is close to the same strength. I think it would prevent late arrivals. AK in P2 would have been woefully underpowered had he not been able to leverage borrowed DRP.

So ... for what its worth I vote against!

And as for boredom; there is always World of Warcraft!

Personally, I dont see how wheeling and dealing is that big a deal. I dunno it could just be the way I play, but Im yet to find a need to turn to another god to get something I wanted done that would require barter. Ive always managed to justify it one way or another in oblivion.

The two cases where I have shared actions with other gods, it was always in all of our best interest to do so.

I hear of some gods who are constantly trading DRP or who are constantly using their own drp for actions that often have nothing to do with their domain at all. I fail to see the need for this personally.

At first, upon choosing oblivion, I thought i would be stunted, what could I possibly do with something that results in nothing? Xar said "Obliterate" and I started getting ideas.

So far Ive found several different ways to use it to gain followers, help studies in science, help with travel, aid in the building of a city and in the defences of my lands, help create the ultimate warrior and the list goes on.

as it is, im happy with the rules as they are now, as i choose to play this way. I just think it would be a far more interesting game if that was the case. Would lead to less taking advantage of the fact that we're all powerful gods and more to the inner workings of a pantheon like the greeks or vikings had

Murrin wrote: When my (Bel's) worshippers give strength to me (him) through their faith, it is the raw power of worship, not "peace power". I should be able to put this raw strength to what purpose I choose, within the game's system--ie, within Bel's domain, should he shape the power's expression himself; or in the domain of another, should he allow that other to shape the use of it.

Well, perhaps it's not so much that your followers are iving you 'peace power', and more to do with the fact that Bel can only use peace in some fashion to capitalise on the power he has been gifted. That's how I see it. Likewise, if every living thing in the world worshipped Eztlicoatl, I don't think that would mean he could do literally anything he wanted.

Of course, this is all academic, as no-one is suggesting any P3 change.

Look at it this way:

Your followers worship you and you get generic power from it. The abilities you have allow you to use that power to influence the world according to your domain.

There's no special thing about the power which makes it part of your domain until you use it, so you can pass it to whoever you like to use their way.

Zephyr wrote:Hey, let's kick this idea around. I think it would be very cool. Xar mentioned it when we were pming about an idea I have, but he wasn't suggesting it. I'm suggesting it. I think it would be good if we could all use our DRPs only within our domains. I mean, each of our DRPs could only be used by us for our own domains. No giving somebody DRPs for the turn.

I'm taking it in, but it's against my concept of DRP. DRP, to me, is the energy behind actions. As I'm thinking about it, I'm comparing it in my mind to electricity. Electricity is used for different end uses: to run a microwave, or a radio, or a flashlight. So it is with DRP.

Now, I can see how loaning out too much DRP out could irritate followers; taking the electricity example, by loaning power to have the neighbor's light shining in your window at night. But I don't think that should forbid one from doing so.

Since this is my first RPG I haven't any experience to draw on but I agree with Damelon. I was thinking of it as raw power as well. Power that you can use or gift or whatever without any specific hinderences. If your diety uses it then it has to relate to their specific domain but if your diety gifts it then the recieving diety can use it however they wish within their domain. That is how I see drp.

Ya'll gotta realise im a jazz musician. Ive been trained to think forced improvisation is a good thing

First of all, we're talking about magic and deities. So there's no right or wrong way/rules in my mind. Any number of systems are valid. And what Damelon and Jenn just said is perfectly logical. I'm not trying to change anybody's mind. I guess I'm just coming up with a different system for the fun of it. Maybe I'll write a book, eh?

I'm thinking of a God of Forests as though he can't do anything with his divine power except Forest things. Maybe the power derived from the worship of his followers is of a different type than the power other deities derive from their worshipers. It's directed at him, by those who revere the Forests. It could be it's of a different "flavor" than the power the God of the Sun derives from his worshipers. The worshipers are certainly thinking and feeling different things when they worship the God of Forests than the worshipers of other deities are thinking and feeling. It could have bearing on what the deity can do with that power.

And, it's possible that, in addition or instead, the God of Forest's very being is made of Forest... stuff. Maybe the power from the worshipers fills it with whatever amount of energy his current level allows, but that energy is Forest energy. Basically, their worship is water and nutrients, and his body is the Divine Tree. And this being made of Forest stuff, this Tree, cannot do anything with the energy within it except Forest things.

Like I said, I'm just yapping. When results come in, I'll stop thinking about this entirely.

Ok, folks. We still have probably close to two weeks to wait. We need some chatter. Jenn did a great job for a while. Then I started that discussion. Somebody else's turn!!

alright, lets talk about prophets.

i need one.

You can have mine. He's such a stick in the mud!

LOL. I need a prophet too!!!

Hmmm ... Perhaps T'esta would do ...