Moderators: sgt.null, dANdeLION
Why do we need it?The Dreaming wrote:The pirate comic is going to be on the DVD as an animated feature. (Probably extended to be intercut with the movie) You gotta fit this into 3 hours. This is an example of something being moved to the side. It's not like it didnt happen in the movie, we just didn't see it.
I don't understand...what revelation? We had already seen flashback cuts that showed him as a kid with his mom about to bone someone, asumably for money...we know he a sociopath by how he acts...What disturbed me more actually were the cuts made With Rorschach in prison. Having the entire revelation about who he is come so soon after meeting the psychiatrist took a lot of the impact our of it. (And we didn't hear enough about who he was when he was still Kovacs).
Amen.On the other hand, I think EVERYTHING with Jon was handled beautifully. (Of COURSE his schlong is more detailed, it's a freaking movie. Made with FILM projected on a 40 foot screen! It isn't a 4 inch drawn panel.) I always thought his story was the most poignant.
No, I don't...the film was far to inconsistant...but yah, Comedian was hard to take, but put the film in perspective and made it real and moving...balls...Not to mention the fact that they cut absolutely no corners with the Comedian. That took balls. (You think Snyder could do Thomas Covenant now?)
But we don't know why, then we realize in one of the best scenes from the novel (as Fist quoted). It almost saps you of as much energy as it must have Rorschach, the way his origin is finally revealed and its pace and delivery.jacob Raver, sinTempter wrote:I don't understand...what revelation? We had already seen flashback cuts that showed him as a kid with his mom about to bone someone, asumably for money...we know he a sociopath by how he acts...What disturbed me more actually were the cuts made With Rorschach in prison. Having the entire revelation about who he is come so soon after meeting the psychiatrist took a lot of the impact our of it. (And we didn't hear enough about who he was when he was still Kovacs).
Spoiler
enormous blue penis
If your take on the film is that it can make a strong departure from the original graphic novel, then we really don't need the pirate comic.Why do we need it?
Maybe it was new/unpredictable in '85, maybe super heroes were so "super" that something like this was really new and shocking, original...but it didn't suprise, two nights ago, didn't make any impact at all...his character's previous actions told me all I needed to know - the violence, his views on people...it would all have to come from something like that scene...it wasn't shocking...Silence of the Lambs, Saw, Covenant...it deffinatley might put him over the edge as a person, but it didn't make me feel anything or realize him differantly...Lord Foul wrote:But we don't know why, then we realize in one of the best scenes from the novel (as Fist quoted). It almost saps you of as much energy as it must have Rorschach, the way his origin is finally revealed and its pace and delivery.jacob Raver, sinTempter wrote:I don't understand...what revelation? We had already seen flashback cuts that showed him as a kid with his mom about to bone someone, asumably for money...we know he a sociopath by how he acts...What disturbed me more actually were the cuts made With Rorschach in prison. Having the entire revelation about who he is come so soon after meeting the psychiatrist took a lot of the impact our of it. (And we didn't hear enough about who he was when he was still Kovacs).
I see what you mean, that would have been moving, but would have taken at least another ten minutes of screen time to develop the Dr. a little more so you identify and care what he goes through and realizes...The Dreaming wrote:All I could think of was how much MORE impact it had in the GN, when the Psychiatrist, changed by his experience with Rorschach, sees two people fighting, and runs off to try and stop them. (at the expense of his marriage) He just can't ignore injustice anymore. He is CHANGED.
Like I said, 3 hours. There simply wasn't time to get inside the sub-stories. The only way to make the ending make sense was to keep it as is. Hell, the squid in the GN doesn't really make sense to anyone who hasn't read a crapload of comic books anyway.
Nah, I just thought it was a device to let you know it was the psychiatrist, because if it was a symbol, it is pretty blunt and unimaginative. Anyway, read the graphic novel and you'll see the power--a lot of it philosophical--in Rorschach's origin. It's not meant to shock you, in the way a slasher like Saw (whose deaths are Rube Goldberg machines) but rather, it makes you think and feel how he felt about not just the scene itself but morality and existence in general. It's well done and one of the emotional centers of the book. Axing on the head and the lack of that monologue tore all that away, as well as the quick shuffling through the entire scene itself.jacob Raver, sinTempter wrote:Maybe it was new/unpredictable in '85, maybe super heroes were so "super" that something like this was really new and shocking, original...but it didn't suprise, two nights ago, didn't make any impact at all...his character's previous actions told me all I needed to know - the violence, his views on people...it would all have to come from something like that scene...it wasn't shocking...Silence of the Lambs, Saw, Covenant...it deffinatley might put him over the edge as a person, but it didn't make me feel anything or realize him differantly...Lord Foul wrote:But we don't know why, then we realize in one of the best scenes from the novel (as Fist quoted). It almost saps you of as much energy as it must have Rorschach, the way his origin is finally revealed and its pace and delivery.jacob Raver, sinTempter wrote: I don't understand...what revelation? We had already seen flashback cuts that showed him as a kid with his mom about to bone someone, asumably for money...we know he a sociopath by how he acts...
I went to see the film with a friend of mine...and one of my favorite symbolic shots didn't resonate with her...and I'm just wondering if you guys felt that this symbolism was intentional:Spoiler
Near the end, when the psychiatrist is watching the blue energy bomb go off, and his suit case falls open, psychological cards falling to the ground
He didn't name himself Rorschach because it represents sociopathy, or violence, or shock. Without his story - much of which is, I gather, missing from the movie - you cannot know why he calls himself Rorschach. The passage I quoted in my previous post is the culmination of his story. But even that, brilliantly written as it is, is not enough. I'll see the movie this weekend, and likely enjoy it a whole lot. But it sounds as though the best part is treated very superficially. "Mom was a whore. I got beat up. A guy killed a little girl. I'm gonna hurt people now." As though his mind snapped from all he went through and saw. As though he did not come to a very real enlightenment. It is a great loss.jacob Raver, sinTempter wrote:Maybe it was new/unpredictable in '85, maybe super heroes were so "super" that something like this was really new and shocking, original...but it didn't suprise, two nights ago, didn't make any impact at all...his character's previous actions told me all I needed to know - the violence, his views on people...it would all have to come from something like that scene...it wasn't shocking...Silence of the Lambs, Saw, Covenant...it deffinatley might put him over the edge as a person, but it didn't make me feel anything or realize him differantly...Lord Foul wrote:But we don't know why, then we realize in one of the best scenes from the novel (as Fist quoted). It almost saps you of as much energy as it must have Rorschach, the way his origin is finally revealed and its pace and delivery.jacob Raver, sinTempter wrote: I don't understand...what revelation? We had already seen flashback cuts that showed him as a kid with his mom about to bone someone, asumably for money...we know he a sociopath by how he acts...
It's raking in the bucks, though, already up to $56 Million. Plus, for those of us who have no knowledge of the Graphic Novel(s) we have nothing to compare it to, and it seems the biggest complaints I've seen are comparisons to the source material.Cail wrote:It really does look cool, and I really want to see it since I've thoroughly enjoyed the vast majority of the comic book movies I've seen in the past few years.
But between the tepid reviews, the director, and the run time, I'm seriously considering holding off until it comes out on Blu-Ray.
Although I'm California born and bred, and of British mother, French Canadian Father, for some reason most people who meet me get the impression I'm from Kansas or Montana, so I might fit inCail wrote:I'd say we could meet somewhere in the middle like Kansas, but I don't think either of us would fit in very well there!
