Kevin's Watch

___ wrote:

Horrim Carabal wrote:Isn't it funny that two of Keaton's best performances were Burton films? Beetlejuice and Batman.

I felt Keaton worked too hard in Beetlejuice at something he did effortlessly in Night Shift. As for his best performance, it was probably Clean and Sober.

Ditto.
Plus, the entire plot of the film would have been drawn out and pointless in a 30 minute sitcom, much less a feature length movie. The plot is something better suited to "Gilligan's Island."
I will continue to stand by my loathing for this gratuitous, self indulgent crap-fest.
Even as an impressionable youth, I could not be suckered by this piece of raw garbage!

Batman: one other point, let's not forget how surprised everyone was to see Michael Keaton, thought to be a zany comic actor, surpass himself as a dark twisted vigilante in a serious role!
This stunned everyone!

Didn't anyone even notice the penguin rockets at the end of Batman Returns? Surely they were campy almost to the level of the rubber shark in the 1960's Batman movie. When I saw how stupid it was presented I almost laughed outloud in the theater. I think it was that stupidity that gave Joel Schumacher permission to put nipples on Batman's chestplate. Maybe no one else really cared but I'll never forget it.

Lord Zombiac wrote:Batman: one other point, let's not forget how surprised everyone was to see Michael Keaton, thought to be a zany comic actor, surpass himself as a dark twisted vigilante in a serious role!
This stunned everyone!

Definitely. Initially, I was very impressed with the movie, and continued to be quite some time. Really I still like it a lot; I think that somewhere back in the '90's I quit thinking of it as an individual film, and started thing of it as 'part 1 of 4', and the other 3 drag it down somewhat. That being said, I preferred part 3 over part 2, and while I disliked part 4 a lot, I still like Uma Thurman's Poison Ivy as much as Michelle Pfeiffer's Catwoman, and Arnold's Schwartzenegger's Mr. Freeze, while campy, wasn't as bad as the Penguin, even though I think Danny DeVito is a fine actor. Also, that "I took off my mask, you take off your's" bit at the end of part 2 was unbearable. All that being said, I have Batman & Batman Returns in my dvd collection, but not the other 2.

CovenantJr wrote:Tim Burton's problem is that he can't keep hold of his balls?

laughing uncontrollably at that one. (I meant to say Batman not B-2) Agreed Clean & Sober in one of Keaton's best, loved Nightshift too, but my fav is still Pacific Heights (I think I've had housemates like that before! )

Watched Alice in Wonderland on the telly last night, and it was quite interesting, until...Tim Burton made the Jabberwocky a gigantic killer dragon. Why does everyone assume it's harmful? The Jabberwocky is a timid creature afraid of humans. Not the other way round.

Disappointing!

I switched off the box long before the movie was finished.

Hmm. The Jabberwock is only ever described as having "jaws that bite, claws that catch" and "eyes of flame", and the entire poem is about a man sent out to slay it. That little evidence doesn't really suggest it's harmless.

Terry Gilliam's "Jabberwocky" was the best treatment of the Jabberwock I've seen so far, along with Jack Palance's stage presentation of the creature.

I agree that "Batman Returns" was campy with the rockets and all, but I am not a loyal devotee of the comic books-- in fact I loved the campy TV series.

I grew up with it.

Adam West is my yardstick by which I measure all other Batmans.

Well, I grew up with West's Batman too, and aside from Arthur, Romeo's Joker, Newmar's Catwoman, Premminger's Mr. Freeze and Gorshin's Riddler I couldn't wait until we all grew up and somebody found better actors to replace everybody else...especially Chief O'Hara. The problem with Premminger, however, was every time he talked you thought it was this guy:

"No, Mr. Bond. I expect you to die..."

Edward G. Robinson too!

Cagliostro wrote: Sorry, I worded that badly. What I meant was sometimes literally at the last minute (before the credits roll) is where he blows it. I was enjoying Big Fish up until the last few minutes

Spoiler

when I realized it was all a lie, and felt cheated. I didn't want reality with that movie, dammit

.

How could it be anything else?

Look at the movie this way... you've got a guy who's just trying to get to know his dad. All he has are the zany stories his dad has always told him, and he's trying to get through that to find something real.

One of my all-time favorite films.

Cagliostro wrote:

CovenantJr wrote:

Cagliostro wrote:he nudges right up against something that I'd really get excited about, and drops the ball at the last minute, often literally so.

Literally? Really? Tim Burton's problem is that he can't keep hold of his balls?

Sorry, I worded that badly. What I meant was sometimes literally at the last minute (before the credits roll) is where he blows it. I was enjoying Big Fish up until the last few minutes

Spoiler

when I realized it was all a lie, and felt cheated. I didn't want reality with that movie, dammit

.

Nah, I'm just picky.

Albert Finney is awesome. He's also memorable as Kilgore Trout in "Breakfast of Champions."

I agree about the ending to Big Fish. Really diminished an interesting movie.

If a similar ending had been tacked on to Scott Pilgrim, for example, it would have had the same effect.

Or if at the end of TLD Covenant were to wake up in a hospital and the entire 10 books were a dream.

I hate those kind of "Bobby in the shower" resolutions. What's the point?

Rigel wrote: How could it be anything else?

Look at the movie this way... you've got a guy who's just trying to get to know his dad. All he has are the zany stories his dad has always told him, and he's trying to get through that to find something real.

One of my all-time favorite films.

It's probably just all about my expectation, and I'm probably being naive, but I felt very let down at the end.

Murrin wrote:Hmm. The Jabberwock is only ever described as having "jaws that bite, claws that catch" and "eyes of flame", and the entire poem is about a man sent out to slay it. That little evidence doesn't really suggest it's harmless.

The quotation marks could make the statement true, or false. Maybe the person making the statement has only heard that the creature is dangerous, and, passes on this information to his son. The sins of the father.

John Tenniel's drawings contain a wealth of evidence to show how some can see things from the wrong viewpoint.

Of course, this is just my opinion. I went to school with someone who was so badly bullied that he never reached his twentieth birthday. He sat down one day to catch his breath, fell asleep, and never woke up. I think he died of a brain tumour. But then, that's only my opinion.

Drifting off topic now, tara!

Krazy Kat wrote:

Murrin wrote:Hmm. The Jabberwock is only ever described as having "jaws that bite, claws that catch" and "eyes of flame", and the entire poem is about a man sent out to slay it. That little evidence doesn't really suggest it's harmless.

The quotation marks could make the statement true, or false. Maybe the person making the statement has only heard that the creature is dangerous, and, passes on this information to his son. The sins of the father.

John Tenniel's drawings contain a wealth of evidence to show how some can see things from the wrong viewpoint.

Of course, this is just my opinion. I went to school with someone who was so badly bullied that he never reached his twentieth birthday. He sat down one day to catch his breath, fell asleep, and never woke up. I think he died of a brain tumour. But then, that's only my opinion.

Drifting off topic now, tara!

The jaws and claws are mentioned by the father and could conceivably be exaggeration or simply misinformation, but the Jabberwock has "eyes of flame" when the guy encounters it, which suggests to me that the rest of the father's description is equally accurate, but even if not, having eyes of flame is fairly intimidating. Regardless, there is certainly more indication of it being a frightening and/or dangerous creature than there is of it being timid and afraid of humans, which isn't suggested anywhere as far as I know.

Krazy Kat wrote:I went to school with someone who was so badly bullied that he never reached his twentieth birthday. He sat down one day to catch his breath, fell asleep, and never woke up. I think he died of a brain tumour. But then, that's only my opinion.

That makes no sense. Being bullied doesn't cause brain tumors. If it did, I'd have died by the time I was fifteen.

___ wrote:

Krazy Kat wrote:I went to school with someone who was so badly bullied that he never reached his twentieth birthday. He sat down one day to catch his breath, fell asleep, and never woke up. I think he died of a brain tumour. But then, that's only my opinion.

That makes no sense. Being bullied doesn't cause brain tumors. If it did, I'd have died by the time I was fifteen.

Oh. I didn't even register the 'killed by bullying' bit. If he'd just been exerting himself and he was bullied a lot (stress), surely something heart-related would make more sense than a sudden tumour.

OK, I just watched Burton's PotA again. It's not as horrible as I remember it, but the ending is still ridiculous.