First read: Gardens of the Moon: Book One of The Malazan

[Fist and Faith]

You want me to just copy & paste the whole book?

You may as well keep in mind what happened to Lorn.

[Avatar]

Spoiler

Also, Paran was a little clueless of what was going on in the prologue of the book...

Spoiler

I mean, he was like 12 years old...

Yeah, anyway, I see Fist answered the Rake question...a lot of questions tend to end up answered in the books by subsequent (or sometimes earlier) books.

--A

[SoulBiter]

Thanks all. I'm trying to navigate things I missed without spoling further books. I know that's a bitch when you have read them all.

[Fist and Faith]

I'm sure you're doing fine. I've only read 5-10 once. I'm such a slow reader, and these are really big.

[Avatar]

I meant to mention that the end of GoTM gives us our first indication that Erikson struggles with the difference between "flail" and "flay." (Always annoys me when I see him get it wrong, although he doesn't always. Maybe it was his editor.

--A

[Fist and Faith]

Reminds me of SRD misusing "sojourn" all the time. I think he said somebody gave him crap about it.

[Holsety]

I was rereading Gardens of the Moon, thinking about how I might have very loosely imitated Hairlock-as-a-puppet during some minor events at work, years ago, without realizing it. Then I got to the part where Crone is flying through the sky and another Great Raven reports to her question as to what's going on as "Confusion!" (to which Crone replies, "I Love a Good Joke!"). I can't remember if hours passed, but within a day or two, I was at work taking my first call. I don't remember exactly what happened, but there was some kind of issue (maybe I had to ask someone something, maybe I had to apologize that someone wasn't available to talk), and I told someone "sorry for the confusion."

What can I say, I hear Jesus said he values one penitent sinner over ten righteous men.

EDIT-Also, I think Erikson made a pretty creative reference to Donaldson with the word "Seer." There are two seers mentioned in the book. How much of a connection can you make of them?

[Holsety]

One more observation. Towards the end of GOTM, there's a poem at the start of one of the chapters about the Azath. It mentions fruit and parched earth. I realized that that's probably a reference to Tantalus from Greek Myth, who was sent to hell and found himself unable to reach the fruits above him or drink the water beneath him, because they always moved out of reach.

[Fist and Faith]

Nice

[Holsety]

Oh, it looks like discussion of this book is basically over, but I still want to ask if anyone has a hold on one particular thing. The luck that pushes (Lord's I believe) and the luck that pulls (Lady's?)...what exactly does that mean? If anything, I'd say Crokus's luck is a bit more of a light touch at points (making him duck his head and miss the crossbow quarrel, and hitting Vorcan with bricks), not to mention that Crokus avows he doesn't believe in luck. Paran does (he named his sword), he's explicitly told he's in danger from Oponn's whimsical/fickle while I'm not sure anyone gave Crokus the same warning.

To say a bit more...I know Oponn are supposed to be kind of mercurial and just playing around, but I wish there was a little more to describing their motives in this book. I mean, considering all Paran had to do to damage their independence was give up his sword by surviving the turn in his luck, you'd think the lord would have been a bit more careful with him? They're not particularly new ascendants...

[Fist and Faith]

Oponn never seemed like a solid character to me. They seemed more like a sign to others that you were somehow special. Someone to keep your eye on, because something was likely to happen. But the pushing and pulling didn't seem to accomplish much.

[Avatar]

The luck that pushes (Lord's I believe) and the luck that pulls (Lady's?)...what exactly does that mean?

It's the difference between the luck that "pulls" you from the path of a speeding car, and the luck that "pushes" you into the way. Literally just "Lady is good luck, Lord is bad luck."

Corabb for example, beloved of the Lady, all his luck is good.

--A

[Holsety]

The luck that pushes (Lord's I believe) and the luck that pulls (Lady's?)...what exactly does that mean?

It's the difference between the luck that "pulls" you from the path of a speeding car, and the luck that "pushes" you into the way. Literally just "Lady is good luck, Lord is bad luck."

Corabb for example, beloved of the Lady, all his luck is good.

--A

Except the lord's luck

Spoiler

also gets Paran out of trouble, particularly through his sword Chance. Tattersail and Paran would be dead and Hairlock might have gotten the hound of shadow's soul.

It's more like pushing him into new things I think. If Paran is being pushed into new things - like he was in the opening

Spoiler

when he got handpicked by Lorn. Which is bad luck in terms of dangerous assignment, but was probably good luck for his career at the time. Even later than that, it's implied that his personality is being affected by Oponn. But shortly after contemplating that he's putting a certain someone into harms way, he dismisses that, then that person gets tossed.

Also regarding Crokus and Vorcan at the end.

Spoiler

Some genius on reddit realized (I didn't) that the bricks Crokus through at Vorcan were specifically bricks that had been handled by Whiskeyjack's squad when they were mining the city. I can believe I missed that!

[Avatar]

Except the lord's luck

Maybe that's just for him. Multiple people told him once his luck turned to get rid of it, if he survived.

(And I am not surprised at all that I missed that...but...to the other thread for something else I missed...)

--A