The Gradual Interview

[wayfriend]

I don't think you need to say "oh dear" (which I find condescending).

( Eesh. It's my can't win for losing day. ) I mean't "oh dear" as in "uh oh", not "oh dear" as in "oh my loved one". Even piglet says "oh d-dea-dear-dear."

[Seareach]

I don't think you need to say "oh dear" (which I find condescending). Even you said you were "treading thin water"...

When I've had time to think, I'll try and explain what I was getting at. But, in no way was I having a go at you, or trying to implying that you thought Lena should have known better.

"Oh dear" may be an unfamiliar expression - it's something of a mea culpa. I'm sure WF isn't being condescending.

Ah, Latin! My mother used to say to me "oh dear" all the time but she would also shake her head (which was definitely *not* a mea culpa admission on her behalf). I'll just give up while I'm ahead (even though I'm already so far "behind" it doesn't matter! <sigh>)

Edit: yes, ok...shaking hands with you Wayfriend...I get it... I apologise for misunderstanding you. Hopefully the above explanation sheds some light on my reaction to that....

[dANdeLION]

Funny....when I said "Oh dear, I seem to have taken your bra off" the other day, Sea didn't call me condescending. Guess it's the all in the inflection.

[Seareach]

Funny....when I said "Oh dear, I seem to have taken your bra off" the other day, Sea didn't call me condescending. Guess it's the all in the inflection.

Ah...um...if I remember correctly I actually then said something about "intelligent conversation" did I not?

[Creator]

Funny....when I said "Oh dear, I seem to have taken your bra off" ....

dAN and Sea!!!

[Xar]

*head explodes*

[matrixman]

*dodges exploding cranial debris*

[dANdeLION]

Funny....when I said "Oh dear, I seem to have taken your bra off" the other day, Sea didn't call me condescending. Guess it's the all in the inflection.

Ah...um...if I remember correctly I actually then said something about "intelligent conversation" did I not?

Any conversation that gets you out of that bra seems intelligent enough for me.

[Seareach]

Funny....when I said "Oh dear, I seem to have taken your bra off" the other day, Sea didn't call me condescending. Guess it's the all in the inflection.

Ah...um...if I remember correctly I actually then said something about "intelligent conversation" did I not?

Any conversation that gets you out of that bra seems intelligent enough for me.

<sigh> Well...I should have seen that one coming! However, Dan, I am appauled that you have chosen to share our online affair so openly with everyone on Kevin's Watch without my permission and so, sorry buddy, but it's just got to stop! It was nice while it lasted though!

[Creator]

... Dan, ..... sorry buddy, but it's just got to stop! It was nice while it lasted though! ...

You're shut off dAN !!

[Cail]

At least you can enjoy the DVD set of the affair. It comes in a handsome boxed set and is reasonably priced.

[Holsety]

I see I've returned after some time and the debate has already blown over somewhat; still I'll post my opinions. I'm actually only quoting avatar since it's mainly where I feel my response is best thrown in, for the most part.

I think you're making a correlation between "avoidable" and "responsible" that isn't necessarily true or inevitable.

--A

I'll simply say this. By saying it was avoidable Donaldson does not absolve Covenant of any blame; however, it implies that Lena did not do all she could or should have done to stop Covenant.

Personally I see that as an unavoidable criticism of her actions. If she was capable of doing things to stop the rape and save herself, by not doing so she did less than she could have; much as Covenant could arguably have done less than he did (like, not raping her) and would have been a better person for it. And thus that blame is in fact laid on her feet as well - Covenant isn't a better or less wrong for raping her but she is a weaker and by association worse person for not doing all she could to prevent it (which donaldson believes would have succeeded in preventing it).

I should say that if what Seareach is arguing is true, than I could accept saying that Lena could've mended, without blaming her for NOT mending. However I see this as unable be argued too effectively. We get such a small amount of insight into Lena between LFB rape and TPTP reappearance that we have no idea what exactly she went through, and I don't think the book can really convince us she could have or couldn't have. Since that's the only resource we have, we have to look at Donaldson's comment to be pertaining to the rape IMO because the rest of what makes its way into Lena's personality isn't actually explained. I hope my opinion is...not so much viewed positively, as understood, because I fear that last paragraph did not manage a high level of coherency.

[wayfriend]

I'll simply say this. By saying it was avoidable Donaldson does not absolve Covenant of any blame; however, it implies that Lena did not do all she could or should have done to stop Covenant.

No, the implication there is faulty. Sometimes people don't avoid a disaster merely because it is unforseeable. People can avoid dying in an earthquake by leaving the area just before it strikes. Are they responsible for their own deaths if they do not?

[aliantha]

I'll simply say this. By saying it was avoidable Donaldson does not absolve Covenant of any blame; however, it implies that Lena did not do all she could or should have done to stop Covenant.

No, the implication there is faulty. Sometimes people don't avoid a disaster merely because it is unforseeable. People can avoid dying in an earthquake by leaving the area just before it strikes. Are they responsible for their own deaths if they do not?

No, but a better analogy in this case might be a volcano on the verge of erupting. Covenant was acting *weird*. Do you sit next to the volcano and wait to see what happens, or do you stay as far away as you possibly can?

But y'know, part of our hair-splitting is due to the fact that we're looking at the rape through the filter of our own cynical culture. Not only was Lena an innocent at 16 (and I can tell you that she was a whole lot more innocent at 16 than either of my daughters were at that age!), but the Land itself was innocent. The *Stonedown* was innocent. I'm using "innocent" not in terms of "innocence v. guilt", but in terms of "innocence v. experience with icky stuff". Lena's parents didn't object to her going off with Covenant; they expected him to be an honorable man, because they lived among honorable men who wouldn't rape a 16-year-old virgin. Can you imagine any responsible parents in our world today being so blase? I sure can't.

Sure, Lena could have made better choices. But I can envision her being *so* innocent, so naive, that she could not have conceived of the possibility that Covenant would rape her. Was she "prey"? You bet. Was she a "victim", in SRD's sense (that she chose to allow the attack to happen)? I dunno. In our culture, we recognize that children under a certain age, and adults with certain mental incapacities, should not be held responsible for their actions. I think we might well be able to put Lena in that category.

[dlbpharmd]

Jeff: Just read the great news about the 2nd draft being complete. It made me wonder at what point do you begin the 3rd book in the series...not trying to push an "old" man to hard just curious about the process. Do you jump right in or do you wait?

Thanks for sharing your time and wit with us.

I have to do one thing at a time. That's just the way I am. I won't be able to do any effective writing on Covenant 9 until "Fatal Revenant" is officially *done*. Although naturally I'm doing a fair amount of thinking/planning ahead. In fact, my stack of notes for the last two books is bigger than the stack I had for all of "The Last Chronicles" when I started work on "The Runes of the Earth".

(09/14/2006)

[dlbpharmd]

Rod Andrews: Mr. Donaldson,

As many have said before, but it is my only chance to say it personally, thanks for the entertainment. Rarely have I enjoyed storytelling told with such craft.

In an earlier posting it was inferred that the “The Last Chronicles” ends with Thomas Covenant becoming Lord Foul. The writer states that this is “no spoiler,” which makes me think that you have confirmed this. I don’t believe that would be so? So even though this is a simple question, would you mind ending my turmoil and straightening me out on point please?

By the way any chance you may grace “Down Under” (Australia) will a visit sometime?

Well, I did in fact make that statement. In public. Thinking back, I'm inclined to wish I hadn't said it. But we don't get to live our lives thinking back. <sigh>

However. Like all of the public statements I made about "The Last Chronicles" years (decades?) ago, that one was designed to both reveal and conceal my intentions. Saying that "Thomas Covenant becomes Lord Foul" barely hints at the complexity of what I have in mind.

Incidentally, a book tour is probably the only thing that would take me to Australia. (No offense. It's a very long trip, life is short, and I've already been there once.) And book tours are decided entirely by my publishers: I get to say yes or no, but I don't get to choose *where*. What my publishers may or may not want me to do in the years to come is completely unknown to me.

(09/14/2006)

[wayfriend]

Yeah, I have never taken "Covenant becomes Lord Foul" as a literal clue.

Spoiler

Then again, Donaldson did use that word "acolyte". That's stuck in my brain forever. "Except I obviously wasn't thinking of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. More like Creator, Destroyer, and Holy Ghost (wild magic). Or Creator, Destroyer, and--what shall we call Covenant as the protagonist of the drama?--Acolyte." I consider that word a much bigger spoiler.

[dlbpharmd]

Charlie: I can't believe that I've only just now found this site! I re-read the chonicles whenever my life gets confusing.

But I digress. My question is: Do the seven (six) words of power: Melenkurion abatha duroc minas mill & khabaal have English translations? Or were they simply chosen for their sound/look?

Kinslaughterer states that the Lords don't know the proper pronunciation of the words, so I assume they aren't spelled properly either. With this in mind, it is impossible to do an etymology of the words.

Since I'm no linguist <dramatic understatement>, I pretty much always choose such things for the way they sound. In general, I don't usually want them to have "literal" meanings. That can be painfully reductive. (I'm reminded of Doctor Strange's utterly unconvincing "incantations" in Marvel Comics several decades ago.) On the other hand, I wouldn't accept Kinslaughterer's "authority" on the subject. He's a Raver: why would he tell the truth?

(09/15/2006)

[Fist and Faith]

Another straightforward, precise answer from SRD. Why do we continue to ask him questions?

Although I understand his point about Ravers lying, I had hoped Kins was telling the truth. We just lost one of our only bits of information about the Words. And I wouldn't have seen reason to think he was lying. The New Lords certainly didn't have a full understanding of the Words. And every Raver worth his salt knows it's better to hurt someone with the truth than to try to think up a lie.

[matrixman]

Although I understand his point about Ravers lying, I had hoped Kins was telling the truth...every Raver worth his salt knows it's better to hurt someone with the truth than to try to think up a lie.

I was thinking exactly that, too.

What does that Donaldson guy know about Ravers, eh?