Kevin's Watch

I've bought In The Court of the Crimson King twice, the second time because they re-issued it in 2005, after finding the original master tapes. I doubt I can tell the difference, though. Oh well, my geek is satisfied.

Bought Dark Side of the Moon twice, when the SACD version came out in 2003. Same with The Final Cut, when they re-issued it in 2004 with "When the Tigers Broke Free".

Also bought The White Album twice. I, um, lost the first one (it was my dad's, okay! I wasn't a huge Beatle fan then). Funny thing is, after buying the second album, the misplaced one suddenly appeared. *grumble* On the bright side, I gave the first one to my friend, whose culturally-deprived life had no Beatles albums.

Heck, I'll probably buy all The Beatles albums again, if and when they're given a proper re-master.

I've lost count how many times I've done that.

When Outrider (Jimmy Page) came out I bought the CD, the cassette, and the LP.

I just bought the reissue of AMLoR, I've had at least two copies of all the Judas Priest CDs since they were masterfully remastered (not to mention all the old vinyl I had), ditto with BOC.

You really don't want to know what album I played so much I had to buy a second copy of as a teen.

:::and I do currently have a CD of it as well:::

Menolly: Julie recently bought the Plan. she was a major fan back in the day. saw them thrice in concert. met them at a movie premiere. great album.

anyway. I've had to buy stuff more than once due to breaking up with two gf's and losing most of my stuff. I have bought stuff that has been remastered. (Dumptruck, Syd Barrett)

sgtnull wrote:I've had to buy stuff more than once due to breaking up with two gf's and losing most of my stuff.

They kept your music? Seems unfair.

Yes, I'm a repeat offender...always on the lookout for remastered versions of my favorite albums. It's not just marketing: there really is an improvement in the sound. CDs today sound better than they ever have, as the format has matured over the years.

Have bought The Police's Synchronicity more times than any other album: first on chrome cassette (remember those?) in 1983 -- twice -- because I wore the first one out...then years later on CD...then the Mobile Fidelity Labs gold CD (that was funky)...then as part of the 1993 Message In A Box package...then yet another newly remastered 2003 edition...and finally the SACD version.

Bought Dark Side of the Moon twice. Couldn't resist getting the SACD, but for me it was mainly to listen to the remastered stereo mix. I don't have the proper setup to listen to the SACD surround mix. Oh, and I've been listening only to the CD layer of my SACD's, because for some reason the SACD output sounds a lot weaker than the CD output on my system. Either I'm not using the correct settings, or my receiver is a piece of junk. Probably both. At least I'm very happy with the CD audio.

Right now in the process of getting the Talking Heads reissues. They're in the curious DualDisc format: one side is the CD layer containing the remastered stereo, the other side is a DVD layer containing a 5.1 Dolby Digital mix, so I'm able to enjoy the surround sound here at least.

I have owned '2112' on 8-track, vinyl, casette, and cd.

Matrixman wrote:

sgtnull wrote:I've had to buy stuff more than once due to breaking up with two gf's and losing most of my stuff.

They kept your music? Seems unfair.

Yeah, that's messed up. I'd go slash their tires or something.

Matrixman wrote: Right now in the process of getting the Talking Heads reissues. They're in the curious DualDisc format: one side is the CD layer containing the remastered stereo, the other side is a DVD layer containing a 5.1 Dolby Digital mix, so I'm able to enjoy the surround sound here at least.

The only Heads album I have is "Remain in Light," but I really want to get "Fear of Music." Would've bought the DualDisc a long time ago, but it's 20 bucks at Barnes & Noble. Damn overpriced-Starbucks-"I gotta go buy an identity"-do you have a membership card-piece of crap store.

our son or his friends stole some of my cds that we found at a local pawnshop. so i had to buy my albums back.

Yep, they're charging a premium for DualDiscs all right. Hard to say if that's justified. At least DualDiscs aren't as pricey as Super Audio CD's or DVD-Audio discs.

I love the Talking Heads DualDiscs I've got so far...but there is one irksome thing about them: they don't have the song lyrics! Yet the old CDs have them. Strange. So I'll be keeping the originals. (I normally don't care about lyrics, but I do when it comes to Talking Heads.)

I've done the LP/cassette/CD upgrade on.. too many to list here. (Does that count?)

My main annoyance is when a favorite CD is re-released with one or two extra tracks, or you discover (after buying a standard copy) that it was released in Japan or Germany with bonus tracks.

The only Tapes I've upgraded to CD is my Blue Roeo collection.

Other than that, I'll just listen to the tapes (or download the songs that I like)

I did however Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness; the double album by Smashing pumkins three times...the first coy on tape wore out; so I bought them again on tape, and theose one's wore out, so then I bought them on CD (ironically, now I hardly ever listen to them)

Matrixman wrote:...always on the lookout for remastered versions of my favorite albums. It's not just marketing: there really is an improvement in the sound. CDs today sound better than they ever have, as the format has matured over the years.

This is only partially correct. True, there is the potential for CD to sound better than it ever did. However, in practice this is rarely the case due to CD mastering. There has been a push in the last 5 years or so to master CDs louder and louder, because no one wants to be the quieter disc in the CD changer, or on the radio. But there is an upper limit on how loud you can make them. So in order to to increase overall volume, everything is mixed louder, even the quieter bits. So one of the main benefits of of CD over cassettes--increased dynamic range--is lost. When everything is mixed loud, IT'S LIKE READING EVERY WORD IN CAPITAL LETTERS. IT GETS VERY TIRESOME AND ANNOYING AFTER A WHILE. IN ADDITION, THERE IS A LOSS OF SUBTLE CUES THAT ALLOW THE LISTENER TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN DIFFERENT PARTS.

Also, the sound wave itself is limited at the top range so that spikes don't go beyond a certain level (and damage your equipment, create distortion, etc.). This "clipping" of the spikes creates a loss of musical information, and in your speakers it creates a new kind of distortion: digital distortion. It makes a bass drum sound like a cardboard box, and cymbals sound like breaking glass. Horrible. Check out Rush's Vapor Trails for an example of some of the worst clipping I've ever heard. It's such a classic example, there's an infamous web article which explains the debacle in detail (including graphs!). article where I stole my capital letter example

Matrixman wrote:...then the Mobile Fidelity Labs gold CD (that was funky)...then as part of the 1993 Message In A Box package...then yet another newly remastered 2003 edition...and finally the SACD version.

The Mobile Fidelity Labs CDs are usually top notch. And SACD has the potential to be even better (again, taking into account the strengths/weaknesses of the mastering engineer).

Matrixman wrote:Bought Dark Side of the Moon twice. Couldn't resist getting the SACD, but for me it was mainly to listen to the remastered stereo mix. I don't have the proper setup to listen to the SACD surround mix. Oh, and I've been listening only to the CD layer of my SACD's, because for some reason the SACD output sounds a lot weaker than the CD output on my system. Either I'm not using the correct settings, or my receiver is a piece of junk. Probably both. At least I'm very happy with the CD audio.

I'm not exactly sure why the SACD output sounds weaker, unless it is due to the above rant about CD volume. However, since the CDs are paired with SACDs in this case, I can't imagine the engineer making such a mistake, because this product is marketed to audiophiles. It may have something to do with bass management--redirecting the bass signal from the multichannels to the subwoofer for systems with small satellite speakers (most systems, in other words). SACD players are notoriously problematic in their handling of bass management. But since you're not listening to multichannel, this is unlikely too.

In order to get TRUE high resolution sound from a SACD or DVD-A, you must use six wires to connect your player to your receiver, passing each of the 5.1 channels separately. It CANNOT be passed via the digital coax cable which carries the Dolby Digital signals with regular (video) DVDs. If you have a very old receiver, it may not even have the six analog connecters required for this. But even relatively cheap ones (sub $300) have been carrying these connects for at least 5 years.

Note: if you want to spend some serious cash, I think there is finally a single cable solution to this issue. I haven't kept up with the latest because I'm not going to spend $2000 on a receiver and then another $2000 on a CD/DVD player.

For more info on audiophile geekdom, visit: Home Theater Forum and Steve Hoffman Forum. Steve Hoffman is considered to be one of the most careful, artful mastering engineers in the business. Audiophiles revere him.

I have several Radiohead albums on multiple formats or import CDs or special editions etc. But that's just because of collectionism.

Don't think I have that with any other bands.

I love the remastered stuff when it adds extra songs. so I have replaced all my Dumptruck and Uncle Tupelo. I would love it if someone would remaster the Syd Barret and Husker Du catalogs.

As I've said in other threads, I love the remastered Judas Priest catalog. Jon Astley did a brilliant job cleaning up the masters, and the new discs literally leap out of the speakers.

The only remaster I've really been disappointed with was Pink Floyd's A Momentary Lapse of Reason. I didn't think the original disc was bad at all, and the remaster isn't appreciably better.

With Cinnamon Girl, Everybody Knows This is Nowhere, Down By The River and Cowgirl in the Sand this CD has been a must have since '72 LPs 3times, CDs twice.

I agree with Malik that remastering has it's down side-I recently bought C, S, N & Y's double 4 Way Street-though it is a series of live recordings the famous Stills/Young guitar duel on Southern Man is massively improved, however the medley of Neil's three songs at the end makes his voice sound even tinnier, which as Menolly would agree-is not a good thing I've yet to find Yessongs remastered and it really needs to be-again I assume it's even tougher to remaster live 70s concert series-while the idea of the music is outstanding the quality on the original 3 albums sounds like steel clanging and glass shattering in many places.

Thank you for the in-depth reply, Malik! Your advice is appreciated. I will definitely check out the sites you mentioned.

There has been a push in the last 5 years or so to master CDs louder and louder, because no one wants to be the quieter disc in the CD changer, or on the radio. But there is an upper limit on how loud you can make them. So in order to to increase overall volume, everything is mixed louder, even the quieter bits. So one of the main benefits of of CD over cassettes--increased dynamic range--is lost. When everything is mixed loud, IT'S LIKE READING EVERY WORD IN CAPITAL LETTERS. IT GETS VERY TIRESOME AND ANNOYING AFTER A WHILE. IN ADDITION, THERE IS A LOSS OF SUBTLE CUES THAT ALLOW THE LISTENER TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN DIFFERENT PARTS.

That does explain a lot. I have three different Alan Parsons Project "best of" compilations, but the newest remasters seem to present little more than "louder" versions of the songs.

I'm not exactly sure why the SACD output sounds weaker, unless it is due to the above rant about CD volume. However, since the CDs are paired with SACDs in this case, I can't imagine the engineer making such a mistake, because this product is marketed to audiophiles. It may have something to do with bass management--redirecting the bass signal from the multichannels to the subwoofer for systems with small satellite speakers (most systems, in other words). SACD players are notoriously problematic in their handling of bass management. But since you're not listening to multichannel, this is unlikely too.

I've read about this bass management problem, but yeah, since I don't listen to the multichannel mix, I didn't think this would be an issue for me. But I can't deny that the bass (and everything else) from my SACD sounds underwhelming. It does sound a little "better" if I turn up the volume, but the CD audio layer still sounds more "natural" to my ears - strange as that may seem. My unit is a Pioneer DV-578A universal format player, a model that was praised as a good budget SACD peformer. Well, I'm happy with everything else about the Pioneer, but I'm still disappointed by the SACD output. I haven't yet tried any DVD-Audio discs, but as they're even more expensive than SACD's, I figure I've got better things to spend my limited funds on.

In order to get TRUE high resolution sound from a SACD or DVD-A, you must use six wires to connect your player to your receiver, passing each of the 5.1 channels separately. It CANNOT be passed via the digital coax cable which carries the Dolby Digital signals with regular (video) DVDs. If you have a very old receiver, it may not even have the six analog connecters required for this. But even relatively cheap ones (sub $300) have been carrying these connects for at least 5 years.

Nope, I don't have the six analog connectors on my old receiver. I just use the basic L/R CD inputs. I just thought I'd be able to enjoy stereo SACD first, and upgrade to a new receiver later. (Er, a lot later.)

Note: if you want to spend some serious cash, I think there is finally a single cable solution to this issue. I haven't kept up with the latest because I'm not going to spend $2000 on a receiver and then another $2000 on a CD/DVD player.

Heh, I read about that sort of high-end equipment and I either drool or my eyes glaze over. Just waaay beyond my means to acquire.

I re-bought a lot of the casettes I had when I first started buying music, when I switched to CD. Every now and then I remember another one and seek it out on eBay.

sheesh! I bought almost my entire collection on CD from vinyl when CDs became THE format.
Not th least of which was my entire King Crimson collection, Yes, half Genesis stuff, Saga (still a guilty pleasure) ... ah, man, the list goes on....!

I still have several shoeboxes' worth of cassettes, as well as a small bunch of vinyl LP's. They have strong sentimental value, so I doubt I'll thrown them away. They are physical reminders of my era of "innocence" from the late '70s to early '80s, when I was a kid who listened to almost any music that came my way.

Too bad my old Aiwa walkman (a very capable model for its time) plays cassettes wobbly now. And I haven't had a turntable in years to play my LP's. I don't have the willpower yet, but some day I'm going to get a tape deck and turntable to save all that old stuff onto my PC harddrive, and then burn them onto CD.