Runes Part 2, Chapter 2 - Dangerous Choices

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Runes Part 2, Chapter 2 - Dangerous Choices

Post by Relayer »

Those who don't like Runes because there isn't much action must really dislike this chapter :-) ... And in sooth, nothing really happens. We pretty much already know what Linden is going to do -- from her just-ended conversation w/ Esmer, it seems apparent. So in this chapter, all we really have is her trying to convince the rest of her companions. And the chapter ends mid-scene! (of course, to a reader this is not a problem -- but for the dissection it leaves us hanging. SRD should really consider this when writing :-)

Or is there more? This chapter also strikes me as another "setup" chapter, like Hints and others, where there's more going on than seems at first glance. With that said...

As the chapter begins, Esmer has just left Linden, before he presumably goes nutso again. Linden has been left with some answers, and more questions. The Cords return w/ Sahah, who is healing nicely, and a supply of hurtloam, which Linden immediately takes to use to heal Stave's wounds.
"No world where such healing was possible merited the Despiser's malice."
Is there more to this statement than a simple reflection on the beauty of the Land? No such healing exists in Linden's "real" world. Is this a foreshadowing of things to come? Does the "real" world merit such Despite?

Regardless, the hurtloam heals many of Stave's most grievous injuries. Stave awakens and says "you have surpassed me." What is he really saying about her ability to convince him to accept healing?

As Linden goes to meet w/ the rest of her companions, she notices the beauty of the Land's sensations, and then immediately notices how filthy she and her clothes are. It's like every time she starts to fully allow the Land into her senses, into her heart, she closes it down, by noticing something negative. But she will not spare the time to care for herself, or even eat ...
"her purpose was clear."
An hour to cleanse yourself and have a good meal would probably do a whole lot of good. Take care of yourself or you won't be able to help anyone else.

She finds that the Ramen have now fully accepted her. They do not question the acceptance of the Ranyhyn. Yet, this also implies that they must accept Stave; this is part of why they have accepted Esmer. But after last nights' battle it seems they have begun to question this. Though they do not like the 'sleepless ones' they are honorable and distrust Esmer's unprovoked attack upon Stave, a guest under their care and hospitality. How far does the Ramen loyalty to the horses extend? Is there ever a time when they would go against their will?

Linden meets two of the other Manethralls, Dohn and Mahrtiir, who seems to be a very interesting character for a Ramen. Unlike the others, it appeared that
his life was not arduous enough to suit him; that he hungered for struggle and bloodshed, yearned to give battle more often than his circumstances allowed.
He tells Linden that
Esmer "wields a storm among the mountains, power and lightning visible across all this vale."
But Linden has not seen it? Even now, she doesn't notice anything. Again it seems the Ramen have more abilities than they're letting on (I've commented on this in previous chapters). Or that Linden's missing something. And what the heck is Esmer doing now? It's interesting that she doesn't even wonder about it, nor give it another thought.

The Manethralls appear awestruck that the Ranyhyn bowed to her. I wonder at the paradox or contradiction of how the Ramen respect and honor those who have been chosen, who the horses will carry, yet also bear animosity towards them (mostly the Haruchai, but to a lesser extent the Lords). They especially respect Covenant, for he chose to not ride. Here though, they don't seem to feel any negativity, except fear for the Ranyhyn.
If we acted of our own will, we would rather turn our backs on our ancient home than submit any Ranyhyn to Fangthane's cruelty." Then she shrugged slightly. "However, we are ruled by the Ranyhyn." Her tone conveyed no taint of bitterness, although she plainly loathed any threat to the great horses. "And it is likewise certain that you have been accepted. Nor can your wish to oppose the Render be mistaken." In spite of its firmness, her voice held an almost subliminal tremor; a hint of dread. "Thus we are made to understand that the Ranyhyn also will give battle, in your service."
But the Ranyhyn have always chosen to give battle, when they could assist the Bloodguard and Lords. I wonder if they would have preferred to remain in or near the Land for all these millennia, but as I said in an earlier dissection they could have simply led the Ramen back to the Land at any time if they'd chosen to. Perhaps their abilities with time also enabled them to know that they wouldn't be needed until this time, when Linden returned? Esmer has told Linden this is the case with the ur-viles.

So why didn't the Ramen return to the Land during the centuries after the Sunbane? The Land was healing, and I doubt there was any sign that Fangthane was a threat. Did they somehow know that he had not been ultimately vanquished? Or did the Ranyhyn know this? Otherwise, they have not truly explained why they did not return.


Before Linden can explain her plan, Stave limps to the circle, then hammers his hip back into place. OUCH!! I could feel that one. One might ask why he didn't do this before hobbling over... (but then we wouldn't have seen him do it :-) ) Could it have been a comment to Linden? Do not shame me with your healing. Pain is irrelevant. I can take care of myself.

Mahrtiir watched her like a man who had glimpsed the struggle for which his spirit hungered.
One part of me understands... he wants to strike blows in the name of his devotion. Unlike the rest of the Ramen, he is not content to abandon the Land and do nothing but hope for a time when they can return Home. Yet another part keeps wondering, is there more to Mahrtiir than just another Raman?

Linden begins to explain what she learned from Esmer - about Anele, falls, the ur-viles.
The more she said, however, the more her intentions appalled her. Soon her companions would respond with indignation and dismay. They would certainly oppose her.
She was not Thomas Covenant: she lacked the personal extremity for such risks.
Again we see her putting TC on a pedestal, while dissing her own abilities.

Step into your Truth. Be who you truly Are.
But she knew better. She was Linden Avery the Chosen, named Ringthane and Wildwielder. Jeremiah was her son. There was no one else to whom she could offer her burdens. In spite of her trepidation, she raised her eyes to gaze at each of her companions: ... <snip>... Then she pronounced distinctly, "We need the Staff of Law. I intend to go get it."
Yes!! This is a woman who acts in spite of her fear and doubt. Even though she doesn't know how to go back in time... as far as she knows, the falls only run forward. But she's going to do it. As the rest of her companions fire protests at her, Mahrtiir speaks up:
"Are you adept at Time? Are such journeys common in your world? How will you find the time you seek?"
This man is a Raman? I've always loved them but they've never shown themselves to be lorewise or much interested in such things. Yet Mahrtiir asks another question that on the surface doesn't seem out of place, yet implies a much deeper knowledge.

Linden explains her reasons for feeling that it will be safe to get the Staff - Time isn't that fragile, the Staff hasn't been used (how can she be sure of this?), and
And she had one reason to believe that her extravagant proposal might succeed. The Staff was no longer where Anele had left it. Obsessed by grief and recrimination, he had confirmed that fact over and over again.
Which apparently implied--that she had been able, or would be able, to retrieve it.
Hmmm... here's that tunnel-vision again. Linden seems to only see the one possibility - it's not in the cave, therefore she succeeded. No other possibility enters her mind. Just like "the Creator must not care about the Land because he didn't speak to me" and too many other times where she prejudges the meaning of events.

She tells the Manethralls what Esmer said: "Look to the Ranyhyn." Though they're afraid of what this implies, they acknowledge the right of the Ranyhyn to choose their course. Hami shares what she knows of their ability to transcend time.
Then Dohn said softly, "The Ranyhyn will choose. They must. It is not our place. This matter is beyond us."
Mahrtiir nodded reluctantly, as if he were being asked to set aside a secret desire.
I didn't understand Mahrtiir's reaction... Surely the Ramen know or assume that the Ranyhyn will choose to make the attempt. And I would assume that this man, who appears to hunger for a chance to make a difference, would want the Ranyhyn to choose to help. Then, what secret desire does he set aside?

Stave, understandably, is somewhat less than enthused by this information. He makes a very valid counterargument: that Linden will threaten the Land and Law in many ways. And he is correct. But I had to laugh at this line:
Yet I must prevent you. And if I cannot, even your puissance will not avail you against the combined force of the Masters."
Dude! She has white gold! The entire Haruchai race couldn't stop her.

Or have they developed some new form of power?

She cries at him "you don't understand!" and then goes off about how the Haruchai are like the Ramen, judging without information - how they weren't there to witness Covenant and Linden's struggles and successes in Mt. Thunder, don't know about the summoning and the bonfire, how they won't forgive. It appears that her arguments have no effect on Stave. He has a great reply:
"You have not answered. Your words explain nothing. You make plain that you disdain the necessary choices of the Haruchai. You see it as a fault in us that we will never again hazard being made to serve Corruption. You also pass judgment, yet you reveal nothing."
Indeed, she has not. While not passionate in the way Covenant is, Linden can get very intense when she's flustered and under pressure. This doesn't bode well for the Land or the Arch. Linden thinks "he had missed the point completely." But, Stave is right. How could he know what she's about to tell him, what her true driving motivation is? Is expecting other people to read her mind also going to become an issue? And why would she think that this knowledge would sway a Master? Because Mhoram once let Covenant go, to save a little girl? From what we know of the Masters and the way they express their committment to the Land, it's very doubtful.

"Lord Foul has my son."
"History is a myth men have agreed upon." - Napoleon

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Post by Avatar »

Nice dissection Relayer. :D

Some interesting hints as you metioned.

Paticularly the ones about Mahrtiir, which I must say I never noticed.

He does seem different from the Ramen...although, I suppose Liand is different from the Stonedownors too.

And of course, I certainly agree about Linden's tunnel-vision. She's blinded by her own obsession to rescue her child. Understandable, certainly, but oh so dangerous, especially with an enemy who will play against that blindness for all he's worth.

Problems coming folks, problems coming.

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Post by dlbpharmd »

Great dissection, Relayer!
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Post by SoulBiter »

Great job Relayer!!!

Hami answers a question for us... Earlier we talked of the Ranyhyn and time and now the Ramen try to explain it.
"Understand Ringthane, that I do not speak of distance.The Ranyhyn do not transcend the difficulties of their journey. Rather their power to answer is a power over days and seasons.
So they cant go around the difficulties of their journey which would answer the question of whether they move through time or not.
"the Ranyhyn do not spurn distance, " Hami breathed as though the knowledge dismayed her. "they spurn time. They do not merely respond when they are summoned. Rather they hear that they will be summoned, and they respond. If the distance is great, and the obstacles also, the Ranyhyn will depart moons or seasons before they are summoned, that they may arrive when they are needed."
Again she is saying that they dont move through time but instead they seem to 'know' when they will be called and leave with enough time to get there.

We also find out that the falls or caesures only go forward through time.
"Esmer didnt say this," (snip) " but I think the Falls only run forward. From the past to the present. Otherwise Foul could send someone into the past".....
But then a contradiction from Linden about time
"Apparently the caesures first started the haunt the land maybe a hundred years ago. They're comparatively recent.
"If Esmer is right, Anele really is the sun of Sunder and Hollian. Three thousand and some years ago, he left the Staff of Law behind when he went to investigate a wrongness that turned out to be a Fall. He had no defense when the Fall snatched him out of his life
But is it really a contradiction.. Apparently the Fall itself goes from the present into the past since it started about 100 years ago and the reach is 1000's of years into the past. But the effect is one way.. if one gets you.. you are snatched from the past into the present...not the other way around. Question: Then what would happen if you were snatched away by a Fall in the present??
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Post by I'm Murrin »

You'd arrive in a later present, presumably.
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Post by Ramen »

A good dissection, Relayer.
(another good dissection. I feel enthusiastic about all these dissections you made, as there is a lot to find out and to discuss, another great point why I love Kevin´s Watch :wink: )
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Post by Usivius »

Very good dissection, Relayer.
But one point you made I wish to discuss:
Quote:
"You have not answered. Your words explain nothing. You make plain that you disdain the necessary choices of the Haruchai. You see it as a fault in us that we will never again hazard being made to serve Corruption. You also pass judgment, yet you reveal nothing."

But, Stave is right. How could he know what she's about to tell him, what her true driving motivation is? Is expecting other people to read her mind also going to become an issue? And why would she think that this knowledge would sway a Master? Because Mhoram once let Covenant go, to save a little girl?
Actually Stave is not "right". Linden made her point quite well, that the Masters have basically taken away the Land's defence by taking away the knowledge by which its people may make a choice to defend it. It is just that the Masters are so hard-headed that Stave misses the point completely, or choose not to accept this reasoning.
Granted, explaining Covanant's choice about the snake-bitten girl may have given him pause, but it likely would not have been a point to tip the scales in her favour.

I can't fault Linden in this regard. I like that her character tries to reason rather than just go stubbronly and blindly forward. Her doctor character is really facinating in this regard. I am enjoying it alot.


:2c:
Yes!! This is a woman who acts in spite of her fear and doubt.
:) yep, I love this woman ....
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Post by Relayer »

Usivius wrote:Very good dissection, Relayer.
But one point you made I wish to discuss:
Quote:
"You have not answered. Your words explain nothing. You make plain that you disdain the necessary choices of the Haruchai. You see it as a fault in us that we will never again hazard being made to serve Corruption. You also pass judgment, yet you reveal nothing."

But, Stave is right. How could he know what she's about to tell him, what her true driving motivation is? Is expecting other people to read her mind also going to become an issue? And why would she think that this knowledge would sway a Master? Because Mhoram once let Covenant go, to save a little girl?
Actually Stave is not "right". Linden made her point quite well, that the Masters have basically taken away the Land's defence by taking away the knowledge by which its people may make a choice to defend it. It is just that the Masters are so hard-headed that Stave misses the point completely, or choose not to accept this reasoning.
Granted, explaining Covanant's choice about the snake-bitten girl may have given him pause, but it likely would not have been a point to tip the scales in her favour.

I can't fault Linden in this regard. I like that her character tries to reason rather than just go stubbronly and blindly forward. Her doctor character is really facinating in this regard. I am enjoying it alot.
Thanks everyone!

Us, I agree with you that Linden made her point very well, and I agree with what she (and you) said about the Haruchai. They have crippled the ability of the people to defend the Land. Her viewpoint is so different from that of the Masters that she might as well be speaking a foreign language.

My point was just that I also think that Stave is right, in that the question was "why are you willing to take such a huge risk by using white gold in a fall?" ... this question she had not yet answered, yet she expects him to somehow know what she's talking about.

And I agree that explaining the little girl wouldn't have made a difference... I mentioned it mostly because earlier in the book Linden thinks about that a number of times in reference to how she would sacrifice the Land if it came to a choice between it and Jeremiah, and I assumed that it was in the back of her mind somewhere.
Spoiler
In the next chapter, Stave confirms this by saying something to the effect of "our children are valued beyond words but no Haruchai would forfeit the greater communal good for the sake of one child."
I also find it ironic that Stave says "You see it as a fault in us that we will never again hazard being made to serve Corruption. " ... but earlier Foul has told Linden: "in their arrogance the Masters serve me yet know it not." The thing they fear has manifested by their attempt to avoid it.
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Post by Usivius »

:goodpost:
absolutely true. Well said. I guess my 'problem' (if it can be worded so) is that Stave assumes that there has to be another reason other than a person's utter love of The Land and it's beauty and opposition to what Foul is trying to do.
Regardless if he is correct (that Linden also and primarily is trying to save her son), he was a hard-headed prick to demand another reason.
Spoiler
of course he redeems himself so beautifully in Revelstone...!
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Post by wayfriend »

Hi all. Sorry I'm late, I wanted to wait until I re-read the chapter.

Very nice dissection, Relayer.
Relayer wrote:I wonder at the paradox or contradiction of how the Ramen respect and honor those who have been chosen, who the horses will carry, yet also bear animosity towards them (mostly the Haruchai, but to a lesser extent the Lords).
The Ramen do indeed struggle with this, but I believe that they have found the answer. The respect the Ranyhyn's choice to offer to go into danger, but disrespect the rider who takes them up on it.

This, incidently, leads to one of Donaldson's best quotations about "service", a topic on which he is keen:
In [u]The Runes of the Earth[/u] was wrote:"We are the Ramen, Ringthane. It is not our place to speak of them. We are their servants, and in no way their tenders, as some have named us. They are the meaning and purpose of our lives, and while one Ranyhyn remains to gallop among the glories of the world, no Raman will withdraw from their service.

"Indeed, our service itself empowers and sustains our service. We are who we are, and have remained so across the millennia, because the worth of what we serve preserves the worth of our service."
Remember, the Ramen are in every way foils of the Haruchai. So Donaldson is speaking of them here, too. Obliquely.
Relayer wrote:So why didn't the Ramen return to the Land during the centuries after the Sunbane?
I agree, this has never been explained, but it might not ever be explained. All we have is that they knew (somehow) that Fangthane was not defeated, and would not return until he was.

Uh oh. Doesn't that have implications for a Final Chronicles?
Relayer wrote:Before Linden can explain her plan, Stave limps to the circle, then hammers his hip back into place. OUCH!!
Stave is very dramatic for a Haruchai. :roll:
Relayer wrote:Yet another part keeps wondering, is there more to Mahrtiir than just another Raman?
Yes, Mahrtiir is indeed an interesting Ramen, and I bet you anything that he will have an interesting part to play. Now's a good time to mention something that was recently in the GI, which I will abbreviate here:
In the Gradual Interview was wrote:Ed from Phoenix: [...] If I remember right, Mahrtiir is a character who seeks to find meaning in his life through battle/conflict/adventure. The fact that a character with this direction in life has a name that sounds a lot like martyr seems like too good a fit to be a coincidence. [...]
  • When a Donaldson name sounds like a real word, it's never an accident. [...] (12/20/2006)
Such a tantalizing clue!
Avatar wrote:And of course, I certainly agree about Linden's tunnel-vision. She's blinded by her own obsession to rescue her child.
Oh, I don't think she is THAT blind. All along she has been talking about ALSO saving the Land, preventing the ceasures, healing Anele, defeating Foul. There is no way, after dissecting this much, that there is any doubt that Linden is trying to do more than save Jeremiah. True, maybe she would set aside these other goals if they did not also lead to Jeremiah. But so far she hasn't had to. But she has widened her vision to include other things that need doing, to be responsible.
SoulBiter wrote:But is it really a contradiction.. Apparently the Fall itself goes from the present into the past since it started about 100 years ago and the reach is 1000's of years into the past.
No one understands the rules of these ceasures except Donaldson. All we know is that they behave consistently, albeit unpredictably. But you can't use our concepts of physics to explain what they do. There's some good wordage in the GI about all this.

In the end, the ceasures do seem to have a now, although they can access other times than their now.

And as for them naturally moving forward ... well, that's the way Time naturally flows, is it not? It makes sense that they go with the flow if they are not compelled to resist it.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - -

One thing I want to talk about in this chapter is risk. This is the point where Linden confesses that she is going to do something risky, putting the Land and even the Arch in danger.

Is this wrong?

Let me ask it a different way ... can the Land be saved if nothing is risked?

The Creator himself risked much. He risked choosing Covenant. He risked speaking to Covenant after he chose him.

And Covenant himself endanged everything. When he raped Lena, he almost caused another Ritual of Dessicration, which only Mhoram could prevent. He almost made the Ranyhyn extinct with his bargain. He destroyed the Staff of Law, helped Elena break the Law of Death. He walked around envenomed and refused to give up his ring. He FREAKING gave Lord Foul his ring!!!!!!

And he put the Land aside to save a child in his own world.

Donaldson has always said, and his stories have always said, that it's not about whether or not you can win, it's about whether or not you stand up for what you believe in and try. If you do that, you can live with yourself if you lose. But if you talk yourself out of trying, you've lost something that can't be lost unless you choose to let it go.

So here's Linden. She's standing up for what she believes in. She knows she may not be successful. She's gambling, and taking a great risk.

Personally, I don't see any other way she can play it without letting herself, the readers, and the people of the Land down.
Relayer wrote:Linden seems to only see the one possibility - it's not in the cave, therefore she succeeded. No other possibility enters her mind.
I think this is the most unfair of judgements.

There's a philosophy when you gamble. If you absolutely need an exact card at an exact time, or else you lose ... then you play the game assuming you're going to get that exact card at that exact time. Regardless of the odds.

Because sometimes the only way you can win is to be ready for the miracle so that you don't blow it when it comes.

And isn't this EXACTLY the same thing as standing up for what you believe in regardless of whether or not you can win? I think so. I think that this is also being ready for the miracle. It's sure as peaches that if you don't stand up and fight, you won't be ready for the miracle when it comes.
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Post by Avatar »

Great post WayFriend.

I dunno, I'd like to hope that you're right. But for now, the feeling I have is that Linden will give up all those other plans if she thinks it will give her a chance to help Jeremiah.

Good point about the gambling though. But a little acknowledgement that she'd realised that one fact, (it wasn't in the cave), did not automatically mean that she had found it would have been nice.

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Post by Usivius »

Oh, I don't think she is THAT blind. All along she has been talking about ALSO saving the Land, preventing the ceasures, healing Anele, defeating Foul. There is no way, after dissecting this much, that there is any doubt that Linden is trying to do more than save Jeremiah. True, maybe she would set aside these other goals if they did not also lead to Jeremiah. But so far she hasn't had to. But she has widened her vision to include other things that need doing, to be responsible.
<wiping away tear of joy>
Very well said. In fact you deserve one of these from me... :Hail:

and this:
One thing I want to talk about in this chapter is risk. This is the point where Linden confesses that she is going to do something risky, putting the Land and even the Arch in danger.

Is this wrong?

Let me ask it a different way ... can the Land be saved if nothing is risked?
dammit, why hadn't I worded it this way. I think I danced around this point all the while trying to 'defend' Linden ... and you nailed it. (b@stard ;) )

excellent post.
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Post by Relayer »

Wayfriend wrote:The Ramen do indeed struggle with this, but I believe that they have found the answer. The respect the Ranyhyn's choice to offer to go into danger, but disrespect the rider who takes them up on it.
I agree, but that's the paradox. If the Ranyhyn want to carry someone, regardless of the danger of wherever that person wants to go, then if that person were to refuse, aren't they refusing the will of the Ranyhyn, which the Ramen respect above all things?
Wayfriend wrote:
Avatar wrote:And of course, I certainly agree about Linden's tunnel-vision. She's blinded by her own obsession to rescue her child.
Oh, I don't think she is THAT blind. All along she has been talking about ALSO saving the Land, preventing the ceasures, healing Anele, defeating Foul. There is no way, after dissecting this much, that there is any doubt that Linden is trying to do more than save Jeremiah. True, maybe she would set aside these other goals if they did not also lead to Jeremiah. But so far she hasn't had to. But she has widened her vision to include other things that need doing, to be responsible.
Ah, but we're still just in the set-up part of the story. She definitely wants to save the Land, if at all possible. But unless she changes her stated (to herself) decision that "Jeremiah is more important than worlds," I'm very afraid she will be forced to that choice. And just like TC was forced to give up the ring, Linden will (hopefully) find a way to turn it to the advantage of the Land, as well as Jeremiah.
Wayfriend wrote:Personally, I don't see any other way she can play it without letting herself, the readers, and the people of the Land down.
WF, you made many great points here. I totally understand why Linden chooses to go after the Staff, why the risk is worth it. Heck, in my own life I watch how sometimes I won't go for something I want because I'm afraid of it not working out, or I'll second-guess myself, and later regret not having tried. And the gambling analogy is a good one. My only disagreement is the same thing that Avatar said. It's one thing to take the risk as if it's the only possibility. It's another thing to not even realize there could be others.
Spoiler
And as we find out, something else did happen, and only thanks to the ur-viles and Esmer does she find the Staff. I wonder how she would've reacted if the ur-viles weren't there; if she had no other course of action when they found Anele's cave empty.
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Relayer wrote:She definitely wants to save the Land, if at all possible. But unless she changes her stated (to herself) decision that "Jeremiah is more important than worlds," I'm very afraid she will be forced to that choice.
Ah. You forget. Jeremiah doesn't need rescuing because he fell into a well. He needs rescuing because Foul kidnapped him, and with considerable machination at that. And Foul kidnapped him to manipulate Linden. And he wants to manipulate Linden to destroy the Earth.

So -- saving Jeremiah is inextricably linked with saving the Earth. Linden literally cannot ever find the one thing excludes the other thing. Foul rigged it that way. Life and Death and Snares and all that.

So I have no worries that she'll be forced to choose in this way.
Relayer wrote:It's one thing to take the risk as if it's the only possibility. It's another thing to not even realize there could be others.
Ah, but that's an interpretation pretty well removed from anything that was actually said in the story.

- - - - - - - - - -
Usivius wrote:I think I danced around this point all the while trying to 'defend' Linden ... and you nailed it. (b@stard )

I appreciate the "bastard". :)

I thought of something further after I wrote this.

If you think about the end of the Second Chronicles as a set-up for the Final Chronicles, then one might consider that Covenant's example - risking everything he loved by giving Foul the ring - would be something that Linden would take to heart, something she would learn from, and perhaps one day emulate.

So you can view Linden's risk-taking as being something that Covenant taught her in his final sacrifice (as Hamako and Caer Caveral taught Covenant in turn).
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Tulizar
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Post by Tulizar »

Great posts and points from everyone.


What I love most about this chapter is the introduction of Mahrtiir. It is refreshing to finally meet a Ramen who stands apart from the herd. The Ramen as a whole are intriguing, well-conceived characters. Their devotion to the Ranyhyn, stoic lifestyle, land skills and prowess with a cord seem to be the general character make-up of this group. It works well--I know I enjoy reading about them. It's just that every individual Ramen is pretty much indistinguishable. Mahrtiir's desire to confront his enemy/demons breaks the mold. He is everything Ramen, yet something more. Hopefully he'll pan out to be a memorable character.
Proverbs for Paranoids #3.

If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers.
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Wayfriend wrote:Jeremiah doesn't need rescuing because he fell into a well. He needs rescuing because Foul kidnapped him, and with considerable machination at that. And Foul kidnapped him to manipulate Linden. And he wants to manipulate Linden to destroy the Earth.

So -- saving Jeremiah is inextricably linked with saving the Earth. Linden literally cannot ever find the one thing excludes the other thing. Foul rigged it that way. Life and Death and Snares and all that.
I dunno WayFriend. Perhaps the way to save the Land or to defeat Foul is to give up Jeremiah.

--A
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Avatar wrote:Perhaps the way to save the Land or to defeat Foul is to give up Jeremiah.
Or perhaps Jeremiah wouldn't want to be saved. We've seen how Linden doesn't honor Stave... What if Jeremiah knew that the solution was for Linden to *not* rescue him?
Tulizar wrote:Mahrtiir's desire to confront his enemy/demons breaks the mold. He is everything Ramen, yet something more. Hopefully he'll pan out to be a memorable character.
Agreed! :yeehaa:
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What if Jeremiah wanted the Land to be destroyed?

--A
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