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Voldemort was right about Harry's skills as a wizard though
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:30 pm
by High Lord Tolkien
What he said about Harry always being saved by others or because mistakes were made by Voldemort himself.
It's true.
Even at the end where he defeats Voldy, it wasn't through any superior spell skill on Harry's side.
Dumbledore is a powerful spell master.
Voldemort is also a powerful spell master.
Harry Potter is just one clever lucky bastard with some friends.
Now I know it could be argued that someone utilizing whatever secret info or friends that they have to defeat an opponent is "power".
And I would agree.
But in the "pound for pound" ranking of Wizardry, Harry Potter is still a school boy.
Any "super spell" use by Harry was only through an unknown connection to Voldemort.
NOW, I say this for no reason.
Harry's not famous because he's know for being "the most powerful Wizard ever".
He's famous now for "just" the one who beat one of the most powerful evil wizards ever.
But that reputation kind of says that Harry too is a powerful wizard but he's not.
He might be later in life though.
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:54 pm
by Menolly
And he does loose the ability to speak Parseltongue once the Horcrux (I was right, yay!) is removed from him. Who knows what other powers he shared with Voldemort he lost with Voldemort's death?
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:03 pm
by Cameraman Jenn
Even Harry knows he's not one of the GREATS in the wizarding world. He blatantly admits that in book 5. However, Harry IS a competent wizard not a mediocre one, especially when it comes to DADA.
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:13 pm
by Menolly
But, is his DADA skills because of his horcrux? Or is that his own gift?
I guess if he does become head of the Auror department, it must be his own gift...
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:37 pm
by Cameraman Jenn
Didn't he teach not only himself a whole plethora of new spells from books, he also taught others and you can't teach others if you don't know the skills well yourself. He may have gotten some skills from Voldy but he worked his butt off and earned his DADA skills in my mind.
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 6:15 pm
by Menolly
*nod*
Well said.
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:29 pm
by sindatur
Certainly in his school years he wasn't the Be all and End all best wizard around, but, he is quite a ccomplished for someone of his age in school.
Patronus is a NEWT Level skill, he mastered it in 3rd year, and taught it to NEWT Level (and younger) students in his OWL (5th year).
He has held his own fairly well against Death Eaters. The only thing Harry couldn't do that he has worked at was Occlu/Legilimency and it took him until the final battle to master the Unforgivables. He is also a clever wizard.
So, I think he was every bit as good all around as anyone his own age, without having grown up Wizard. I think, even without Voldemort's Horcrux influence Harry was still in the top 10-20% of his class.
As mentioned, he was named Head Auror and Ron and He made many great changes in the Department, so I think he went on to be pretty great.
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:44 pm
by High Lord Tolkien
sindatur wrote:
As mentioned, he was named Head Auror and Ron and He made many great changes in the Department, so I think he went on to be pretty great.
Now this was only mentioned in an interview right?
Anyone have a link to it?
I'd love to read it.
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:58 pm
by Menolly
It's in the most recent interview linked in the JKR interviews thread.
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:05 pm
by sindatur
High Lord Tolkien wrote:sindatur wrote:
As mentioned, he was named Head Auror and Ron and He made many great changes in the Department, so I think he went on to be pretty great.
Now this was only mentioned in an interview right?
Anyone have a link to it?
I'd love to read it.
Been mentioned in numerous chats and interviews since the book was released, but, yea, not in the book.
This Webchat transcript has alot of this kind of stuff. This was actually my one minor complaint about the book, is the epilogue only said who married who (but didn't mention Luna and Neville) and what kids they had, but, nothing about careers (aside from Neville, which we've pretty much known since Book 4 anyways)
www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2007/7/30/j- ... transcript
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 11:40 pm
by dlbpharmd
Menolly wrote:And he does loose the ability to speak Parseltongue once the Horcrux (I was right, yay!) is removed from him. Who knows what other powers he shared with Voldemort he lost with Voldemort's death?
I must've missed this.
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 12:37 am
by High Lord Tolkien
I forget who said it but I remember it being said as well.
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 1:20 am
by Menolly
dlbpharmd wrote:Menolly wrote:And he does loose the ability to speak Parseltongue once the Horcrux (I was right, yay!) is removed from him. Who knows what other powers he shared with Voldemort he lost with Voldemort's death?
I must've missed this.
It's not in the book, it's in the live webchat interview liked in the JKR Interview thread.
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 10:00 am
by emotional leper
sindatur wrote:Certainly in his school years he wasn't the Be all and End all best wizard around, but, he is quite a ccomplished for someone of his age in school.
Patronus is a NEWT Level skill, he mastered it in 3rd year, and taught it to NEWT Level (and younger) students in his OWL (5th year).
He has held his own fairly well against Death Eaters. The only thing Harry couldn't do that he has worked at was Occlu/Legilimency and it took him until the final battle to master the Unforgivables. He is also a clever wizard.
So, I think he was every bit as good all around as anyone his own age, without having grown up Wizard. I think, even without Voldemort's Horcrux influence Harry was still in the top 10-20% of his class.
As mentioned, he was named Head Auror and Ron and He made many great changes in the Department, so I think he went on to be pretty great.
The Unforgivable curses are, argueably, an evil act. I don't think Harry ever actually had a problem casting them. HE just had a problem being evil enough to do it. Like when he first tries to Cruciate Bellatrix, and she says, "You really have to want to cause pain for the sake of pain. You're full of righteous anger. Not the same," or something to that effect. Latter, when he casts it on the Death Eater (Carrow) who spat on Prof. McG, He says, "She really was right. You really do have to mean it."
Atleast with Cruciatus, anyone can do it, as long as they REALLY want to cause pain for the sake of pain itself (which, I guess, is why it's one of the Darkest of Dark Arts.) I guess you have to have developed a sadistic streak of a certain width in your personality to be able to cast it.
Imperio, on the other hand, well, Harry seems to be able to cast it easily enough. I don't think Imperio would be what we call in DnD, a contested will save... or maybe that was Shadowrun. It's a battle of willpower. Does the victim want to be free more than the caster wants the victim to be a slave? Also, there seems to be something about experience that makes it easier to shrug off: If you've managed it once before, it seems to get easier. Atleast for being Imperius'd by that particular caster.
And with Avada Kedavra, the Killing Curse, well, that's just evil. I don't think Harry could ever cast it.
I am also glad I'm not a JKR-style wizard, as I'd have been in Azkaban for ages now.
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 12:49 pm
by Menolly
...unspoilered with OP's permission...
Emotional Leper wrote:I am also glad I'm not a JKR-style wizard, as I'd have been in Azkaban for ages now.
*wry grin*
For now, I see the potential for such in you, but like Draco, you haven't crossed the line yet...
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 1:20 pm
by emotional leper
Menolly wrote:...unspoilered with OP's permission...
Emotional Leper wrote:I am also glad I'm not a JKR-style wizard, as I'd have been in Azkaban for ages now.
*wry grin*
For now, I see the potential for such in you, but like Draco, you haven't crossed the line yet...
Oh, yes, I have.
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:03 pm
by Menolly
Hmph...
Tell me.
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:07 pm
by emotional leper
The Kindly Ones
I no longer practice any form of magic above the cantrip-like making traffic lights turn green. There are reasons for this. The best one could be described as, "Never evoke anything that kills people EVER, EVER AGAIN."
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:34 pm
by Menolly
*shaking head*
What you are implying, both here and in other threads, is beyond me. We'll discuss this one in person when you come to Gator Town.
Agreed?
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:51 pm
by emotional leper
Agreed.