Kevin's Watch

This is going to sound a little nuts, but since I am (still) an adamant member of THOOLAH, it shouldn't be surprising.

The First Chronicles deals exclusively with TC's experiences in the Land, which I love (The Power That Preserves is my favorite). Thomas Covenant's transformation, as it were, from bitter, depressed, egocentric leper into caring, responsible, (still bitter) leper is amazing to watch and feel--and in Donaldson's books, (at least for me) you can't help but feel it.

The Second Chronicles is about 1/3 TC, and 2/3 Linden Avery, at least perspective-wise--and thanks to Donaldson's ability to provoke a reaction out of a stone-cold heart without trying, this was OK. My reasons for hating or at least disliking Linden (at least as opposed to TC) could probably fill a book in themselves, so I'll let them go and just say that I *still* wanted more Thomas Covenant, especially since we have to deal with losing him (at least in the 'real' world) at the end.

The Third Chronicles. . .don't worry, I'm spoilering everything:

Spoiler

RoTE is completely from Linden's perspective. *Completely*. The brief glimpses we get of Covenant through Anele--and the very last sentence on the very last page--are all that got me through it. Caesures and Demondim are interesting enough, but it is *The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant*, NOT *The Chronicles of Linden Avery.*

And the very last sentence on the very last page is a cheat--as those who have read Fatal Revenant know. It isn't really Thomas Covenant, and it's painful to watch his terrible son portray him--to digress: another reason I don't like Linden Avery is because I think she should have figured out sooner that Roger was behind it all. End digression. What was I saying?

Ah, yes. It is *painful* to watch this falsified, horrifying TC through the first part of FR--it breaks my heart. The only Thomas Covenant we get in FR is again through some channeling through Anele and the very, very end--and I hope Donaldson won't pull a fast one on us again and say that *this* isn't really TC either (I don't really think he will). The ending is--well--not exactly comforting.

So I miss him. I miss Thomas Covenant's perspective on things. I want to get inside his head again, and I hope SRD will let us in "Against All Things Ending."

Am I entirely nuts?

Turiya wrote:Am I entirely nuts?

*didn't read your spoiler, as I suspect it will be awhile before I read FR and I didn't want to chance it was FR spoilers and not RotE spoilers*

No, you're not entirely nuts. At least from my perspective prior to reading FR. I much preferred TC's POV. But, I'll take any POV that gets me to the Land.

I have missed TC ever since The One Tree. You're not alone in missing the character that first turned you on to the series. If it wasn't for all the other cool characters in the second chronicles & beyond, I would have likely dismissed the books because of Linden.

I miss him too. I must admit though that

[serious spoiler, if you havent read FR, dont read this. I mean it. ]

Spoiler

reading FR has given me a lot more respect for Linden Avery, she kicked some serious ass under Melenkurion Skyweir, and I have high hopes now that Covenant is really back, AATE will be mostly from his POV.

Thanks iQ. I'll come back to it once I get ahold of FR and have read it.

iQuestor wrote:I miss him too. I must admit though that

[serious spoiler, if you havent read FR, dont read this. I mean it. ]

Didn't include your spoiler.. but to it.

Spoiler

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! <Wheeze> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA <cough>
Right on!

I'm glad people agree

And Ur-Dead, you just made my day. . .I spent the last minute an a half laughing on the floor

Oh man...

Talk about now wanting to read the spoiler...

Turiya wrote:So I miss him. I miss Thomas Covenant's perspective on things. I want to get inside his head again, and I hope SRD will let us in "Against All Things Ending."

Am I entirely nuts?

No, I agree. Big time. Unfortunately, I don't see how SRD can put us back in TC's head. I mean, he's been the Arch of Time for... quite a while. He probably knows way too much about, well, everything to be an appropriate POV character. Or maybe not. SRD may find a way to work it out. I hope so, but I've painstakingly prepared myself to endure four whole books of… undiluted Linden.

stormrider wrote:

Turiya wrote:So I miss him. I miss Thomas Covenant's perspective on things. I want to get inside his head again, and I hope SRD will let us in "Against All Things Ending."

Am I entirely nuts?

No, I agree. Big time. Unfortunately, I don't see how SRD can put us back in TC's head. I mean, he's been the Arch of Time for... quite a while. He probably knows way too much about, well, everything to be an appropriate POV character. Or maybe not. SRD may find a way to work it out. I hope so, but I've painstakingly prepared myself to endure four whole books of… undiluted Linden.

I want to shoot it right into my carotid. I want to grind up RotE and FR and turn them into a concentrated liquid and shoot it right into the pleasure center of my brain!

Your masochistic impulses are terrible to behold.

Guys, just a reminder to try to avoid any discussion of FR in this forum. Try to keep it in the FR Forum. Thanks.-jay

kevinswatch wrote:Guys, just a reminder to try to avoid any discussion of FR in this forum. Try to keep it in the FR Forum. Thanks.-jay

Yes please...TC is now the arch of time?...damn...

Yup. I miss him. I miss him a lot. I don't know why SRD prefers Linden so damned much. Check out the Q&A from the first Elohimfest. stephenrdonaldson.com/fromtheauthor/page.php?Page=4 The last one is Kudos for Covenant. It's not a question; it's caam, basically, thanking SRD for Covenant. While saying what she feels, at about 56 seconds in, she says, "I adore him." I've never heard anyone say that about Linden. She has done monumental things, but she is... lacking. She just doesn't have it. The rest of the characters have to carry the story for me. If Infelice silenced her right now, and Covenant found a way to bring her out of it at the end of AATE, how many of us would cheer out loud the way we did when she brought Covenant out of it in TOT? Yes, she's done important things; things that were necessary for the story. But she's the protagonist; Covenant is our hero. I just wish SRD felt the same way.

Ah well, if you want a book written the way you want it, you have to write it yourself.

I'm of the opinion that Linden is SRD's dream woman.

Notice how Thomas Covenant was "Covenant" throughout the series, Hile Troy was "Troy", but Linden was never "Avery" (You know, I wish if SRD had known that Roger was going to be a bad guy in the Third Chronicles he had given him a different name: the dread Roger stalking the Land just doesn't do it for me.)

But I digress ...

SRD never really gives us much of a physical description of Covenant: we know he's gaunt and graying by the Second Chronicles, but I don't think we ever had his hair color mentioned, and there was maybe one mention of his eye color. Yet Linden is definitely noted as being a lovely woman ...

For some reason, SRD finds Linden especially compelling.

Unfortunately, for me at least, she comes across as being a Mary Sue or a Wesley Crusher.

For some reason, SRD finds Linden especially compelling.

I totally agree. SRD is completely fascinated by Linden.

the dread Roger

Well, the Dread Pirate Roberts was already taken.

Oh yeah. I forgot about this thread.

To whomever launched it in the Runes forum:

( I eventually got over it. )

Kaos Arcanna wrote: Notice how Thomas Covenant was "Covenant" throughout the series, Hile Troy was "Troy", but Linden was never "Avery"

I think in Covenant's case, it's just because the last name "Covenant" is much more inspiring than "Thomas" -- and the very definition of the word is significant and symbolic. But I agree with you that SRD has a Linden fetish -- not as bad as EL's, maybe, but a fetish nonetheless.

dlbpharmd wrote:

For some reason, SRD finds Linden especially compelling.

I totally agree. SRD is completely fascinated by Linden.

I used to be fascinated with Charles Manson. It passed.

(Note to the Linden-lovers: no, I am not equating Linden with Manson; I just felt like sharing.)

Kaos Arcanna wrote: SRD never really gives us much of a physical description of Covenant: we know he's gaunt and graying by the Second Chronicles, but I don't think we ever had his hair color mentioned, and there was maybe one mention of his eye color. Yet Linden is definitely noted as being a lovely woman ...

Yet SRD managed to go an entire book without mentioning her "wheaten tresses"! I was duly impressed.

dlbpharmd wrote:

the dread Roger

Well, the Dread Pirate Roberts was already taken.

Yeah, the name "Roger" doesn't exactly strike fear into my heart. Then again, the name "Jeffrey" isn't exactly chilling, but look what Dahmer accomplished. I think SRD mentions in LFB that Covenant doesn't even like the name. Wasn't it Joan's father's name, or something?

I wish if SRD had known that Roger was going to be a bad guy in the Third Chronicles he had given him a different name: the dread Roger stalking the Land just doesn't do it for me

Just think of Roger as a replacement for one of the Three Stooges.

Unfortunately, for me at least, she comes across as being a Mary Sue or a Wesley Crusher.

Wil Wheaton has his own site and he doesn't sound that bad.