Kevin's Watch

Damm, ouch!~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You know, I've seen spots all over the net and in the "what are you watching now?" and other flix threads...but wow! Damm killer, merciless movie, I have, eh, been a charter member of the Christian Bale Fan Club, yes: even through A Reign of Dragons, since American Psycho but if I'd seen this movie before Batman Begins I'd be living on another plane atp (at this point ). I've seen CTHD and the others that follow (with the exception of the Kill Bills) but wow and Damm-this sucker was one intense mo, mo., mo...no don't curse.

(I can't believe that this movie doesn't already have it's own thread...sorry mods-if it does please feel free to merge-I did do a search...)

Loved this movie, loved the futuristic cultural desensitivity( not really that futuristic), loved the actors, ecstatic about the hero not getting the girl (sometimes what you lose is the point, and not what you gained), self contained mythology, whats not to like about that? Most of all I like it because it was such a sleeper, and that makes me feel like one of the privledged few.[/spoiler]

Very interesting international cast with Sean Bean, Angus McFayden, Emily Waton and I thought Sean Pertwee

Spoiler

Father

was very slimy and convincing--for some weird reason this film sort of reminded me of The Prisoner. I knew Pertwee seemed familiar--haven't seen him in much, I guess he does a lot of English TV--when I found out he played Smith in Event Horizon I said AHA! Taye Diggs was ultracool too and William Fitchner (Blackhawk Down) nailed what he needed to.

I didn't really like ExzistenZ and, for some reason, couldn't hang with Gattaca so I lumped Equilibrium in with these films--I'm very glad I unlumped it. (yes spellchecker I realize unlumped isn't a word )

I like any plot where the main character believes themself to be the hero, and comes to the realization that they are the villain. Perhaps someday someone will write a story where that character decides to embrace their newly discovered Dark Side.

Mr. Broken wrote:I like any plot where the main character believes themself to be the hero, and comes to the realization that they are the villain. Perhaps someday someone will write a story where that character decides to embrace their newly discovered Dark Side.

Wasn't that the point of Star Wars?

<ducks>

Mr. Broken wrote:Most of all I like it because it was such a sleeper, and that makes me feel like one of the privledged few.

Not exactly a selling point for me. I've never understood the allure of the "cult" status thing. In fact, I feel downright frustrated when something I love doesn't get the universal respect I feel it deserves (like Donaldson's work).

But if you guys say it's good, I'll be sure to check it out . . . and hopefully I won't diminish your privileged status by joining this small club.

In reply to Rigel, no. In reply to malik 23 Im not elitist, I just enjoy feeling elite, please watch the film.

Rigel wrote:

Mr. Broken wrote:I like any plot where the main character believes themself to be the hero, and comes to the realization that they are the villain. Perhaps someday someone will write a story where that character decides to embrace their newly discovered Dark Side.

Wasn't that the point of Star Wars?

<ducks>

Mr Broken wrote:In reply to Rigel, no.

Well, to be fair to Rigel, it was the plot of the Prequel Trilogy, though that trilogy is not a complete story.

Without the redemption of Anakin in ROTJ, the prequel story would have little value. It would basically be Sauron's tale, or Lord Foul's tale. Plenty of bad guys embrace their Dark Side. That's easy. What's difficult is resisting the "easy" path, and doing the right thing despite the short-term benefits of being evil.

Stories aren't told simply to break with established norms. Story-telling isn't simply an exercise in bucking trends and conventions. I think this is what annoys me about your enjoyment in feeling "privileged" simply because you're in a minority audience. A story where the main character embraces his Dark Side (i.e. takes the easy way out) has absolutely no value as a story. You might as well talk about a main character who sleeps all day and lives off food stamps. While such a story might seem to break away from established story-telling conventions of the Hero's Tale--and thus be superficially "thrilling" for people who find pleasure in such empty rebellion--it's actually quite contradictory, because the true trend breaker IS the hero who embraces his Good Side. That's the whole point of the Hero Tale: the hero does the hard thing, the task that few accomplish. We revere the Hero not simply because his task is rare and trend-breaking (which is merely a juvenile thrill). His task is rare and trend breaking because it is difficult, and few of us succeed in living up to this ideal example.

I couldnt disagree with you more, well I could but what would be the point. You obviously have an established opinion on the matter. I would like to say however that the mere fact that you are annoyed by my " minority" stance on the film says alot more about you than it doe's about me. If it makes you feel any better, Im a really bad person.

Mr. Broken wrote:In reply to Rigel, no.

Actually, it was - at least according to George Lucas.

The whole point of Star Wars was basically, "What if Jesus Christ decided not to be perfect?" He then worked out a plot and setting, from his fall through his redemption, decided it would be way too much for a movie, and did a small portion of it instead.

Of course, the movie was succcessful, he made his famous comment about a "Trilogy of Trilogies", and proceeded to make the sequels, finishing the story with two more movies instead of five, and dashing the hopes of Star Wars enthusiasts everywhere.

Im not saying that was'nt the point of Star Wars, Im saying that it was'nt my point. Perhaps I was unclear. Lets break it down, main character= good (most of the time), MC discovers that he prefers to be bad , and stays that way. Anakin Skywalker was misled into thinking that turning to the Darkside was the only way to save Padme. (noble intentions )So Im not arguing your point, or Lucas's point, only my own opinion of something that would be fresh, and original (maybe), to see in a plot line. Thats all.

Mr. Broken wrote:Im not elitist, I just enjoy feeling elite

I thought that was the point of the Tank


<ducks>

I hope Loremaster drags his butt into the conversation before the fight breaks out...

Malik23 wrote:
A story where the main character embraces his Dark Side (i.e. takes the easy way out) has absolutely no value as a story. You might as well talk about a main character who sleeps all day and lives off food stamps.

Can't agree. Many great tales have been about a man/woman who completely succumbs to their less than noble leanings. Too many to list here, but one of the most famous is Macbeth - a tale about a man who unrepentantly becomes evil.

The food stamps story could very well work, actually. Depends how it was written, and what else it was about.

danlo wrote:I've seen CTHD and the others that follow (with the exception of the Kill Bills) but wow and Damm-this sucker was one intense mo, mo., mo...no don't curse.

What??? You haven't seen the Kill Bills??? Oh man, those are the best freakin' movies!!!!



Anyway, I guess I'll check out Equilibrium.

There is a special trailer for Kill Bill and I think it's the only preview on the DVD...

Do I feel vindicated ? No. Do I feel ashamed ? Never. Do I enjoy playing devils advocate ? Every F'n time. The fact that I have annoyed someone by stating my opinion is just bringing me too much amusement to let it go.

I didn't like this film at all, it had some great ideas but almost all of them were poorly executed. The writers didn't give any kind of thought to how people with suppressed emotions would really behave, they seemed to make a point of it whenever the plot required it, but the rest of the time the actors were clearly being emotive to one degree or another and we were just supposed to not notice. Shallow conceptual thinking from the writers, poor actor coaching by the director.

The only thing I felt they got right was the 'gun kata' aspect and the idea that the flow of combat can be predicted mathematically, however they didn't go into nearly as much detail as they should've and just kind of stuck it out there at the beginning to let us know that Bale will kick ass all film. The visual styling was also rather bland, unoriginal and laid on rather thick.

I hate films like this, films that could've been really special but end up being remembered as "an okay Christian Bale movie" because it was all so half-assed.

Meh. *1/2 out of ****.

BUT. That last fight, between Robert the Bruce and Bruce Wayne (there can be only one), was freaking awesome!

Good review from Nav! Sorry I didn't read it til now.

Yeah, take away Christian Bale and there's not much left, besides the gun fetish.