Kevin's Watch

I'm not sure where to place this general kind of topic, but it has come up here and there in the Chronicles including the first and second. It's not a question I haven't solved myself, but it puzzled me for the longest time and I wondered if anybody else had a question about it.

The question concerns certain parts of the Chronicles where a character does something a little extra in order to "trust himself later." For example,

"Then, so that she would be able to trust herself later, she unbent his spine, restructured the bones in a way that allowed him to stand straight, breathe normally."

It finally occurred to me that this trusting herself is not something very conceptual or philosophical, and that looking too deep I had missed the forest for the trees.

Does anybody else here have the same question about its meaning that I did? What does it mean to you?

In this specific case, it may have something to do with the fact that Linden will leave the Staff with Pitchwife and the First, all by themselves in the middle of a mountain full of cavewights and ur-viles. Linden needs to know that leaving the Staff with them isn't dooming it to be lost again. But healing pitchwife is about the only thing she could do to help ensure that they escape with the Staff. So it means, "so that she would be able to trust that she is doing the right thing later on when she gives the Staff to the two Giants".

I always took it as her "practicing" her healing with the Staff...to make sure she could do with it what she wanted, before heading out to meet the Sunbane.

So now we have two different opinions, three counting my own.

Why is this line such a mystery?

rdhopeca wrote:I always took it as her "practicing" her healing with the Staff...to make sure she could do with it what she wanted, before heading out to meet the Sunbane.

That's what I always assumed it meant. Though it always seemed a little odd to me that she'd "practise" on someone she cared about.

"Then, so that she would be able to trust herself later, she unbent his spine, restructured the bones in a way that allowed him to stand straight, breathe normally."

I took it this way... She had decided already that she was going to heal Pitchwife. So she went ahead and healed him so that she could trust herself to push her limits while healing the land and wouldnt be holding back in hopes of healing him later.

Well I don't know about that, but one thing I do know: we all think we're right.

TheWormoftheWorld'sEnd wrote:Well I don't know about that, but one thing I do know: we all think we're right.

Ha! I could be glaringly wrong...I suppose we should ask the author to find out who is right...if it's that important.

rdhopeca wrote:I always took it as her "practicing" her healing with the Staff...to make sure she could do with it what she wanted, before heading out to meet the Sunbane.

So you think that "later" means right after she finishes healing Pitchwife.

I'll mention that Linden already knew she could heal with her percipience and the white gold. It doesn't ring true that she'd need to double-check.

She also healed The First. Pitchwife was more injured, and crippled besides, but she healed them both completely. So Pitchwife's healing is more pronounced.

In fact,

In [u]White Gold Weilder[/u] was wrote:With the Staff of Law and the white ring. Linden caressed the fatigue out of the First's limbs, restored her Giantish strength. The rupture in Pitchwife's lungs Linden effaced, healing his respiration. Then, so that she would be able to trust herself later, she unbent his spine, restructured the bones in a way that allowed him to stand straight, breathe normally.

Note the highlighted "then". She had already healed the two Giants. But she still needed to do one more thing to "trust herself". So the healing alone wasn't quite enough for her to "trust herself", as far as I can tell.

"Later" certainly means after she defeats the Sunbane though. Possibly even after she leaves the Land. (She knew that was coming. The wind between the worlds keened constantly across the background of her thoughts, calling her away. )

Linden wrote:So she went ahead and healed him so that she could trust herself to push her limits while healing the land and wouldnt be holding back in hopes of healing him later.

I don't think Linden would have traded healing the Sunbane for fixing Pitchwife's posture. Not after everything it took to trust Covenant, not possess him, and let him give the ring to Foul.

wayfriend wrote:I'll mention that Linden already knew she could heal with her percipience and the white gold. It doesn't ring true that she'd need to double-check.

She also healed The First. Pitchwife was more injured, and crippled besides, but she healed them both completely. So Pitchwife's healing is more pronounced.

In fact,

In [u]White Gold Weilder[/u] was wrote:With the Staff of Law and the white ring. Linden caressed the fatigue out of the First's limbs, restored her Giantish strength. The rupture in Pitchwife's lungs Linden effaced, healing his respiration. Then, so that she would be able to trust herself later, she unbent his spine, restructured the bones in a way that allowed him to stand straight, breathe normally.

Note the highlighted "then". She had already healed the two Giants. But she still needed to do one more thing to "trust herself". So the healing alone wasn't quite enough for her to "trust herself", as far as I can tell.

"Later" certainly means after she defeats the Sunbane though. Possibly even after she leaves the Land. (She knew that was coming. The wind between the worlds keened constantly across the background of her thoughts, calling her away. )

Linden wrote:So she went ahead and healed him so that she could trust herself to push her limits while healing the land and wouldnt be holding back in hopes of healing him later.

I don't think Linden would have traded healing the Sunbane for fixing Pitchwife's posture. Not after everything it took to trust Covenant, not possess him, and let him give the ring to Foul.

"Later" to my mind means "after an indeterminate time has passed." I take it to mean when her task is finished and she has a chance to pause and reflect on what she has accomplished.

I won't say any more about that for right now.

The restructuring of Pitchwife's skeleton is much more of a fundamental change than a simple "healing". It was taking him as he was born, and remaking him in an image that *she* believed was right.

I feel this was indeed needed as a prerequisite for addressing the Sunbane. The Sunbane was a fundamental corruption of Earthpower and the natural order of life. Not a disease, or a fracture. In essence, the Land was like Pitchwife - warped in structure, though pure of heart.

In the Land's healing process, Linden discovered she couldn't "attack" the Sunbane any more than she could attack Pitchwife's bones. In the end, she absorbed the phazes of the Sunbane and set them in a new order, rebuilding the Land in her own image.

The ramifications of this remain to be seen.

IrrationalSanity wrote:The restructuring of Pitchwife's skeleton is much more of a fundamental change than a simple "healing". It was taking him as he was born, and remaking him in an image that *she* believed was right.

I feel this was indeed needed as a prerequisite for addressing the Sunbane. The Sunbane was a fundamental corruption of Earthpower and the natural order of life. Not a disease, or a fracture. In essence, the Land was like Pitchwife - warped in structure, though pure of heart.

In the Land's healing process, Linden discovered she couldn't "attack" the Sunbane any more than she could attack Pitchwife's bones. In the end, she absorbed the phazes of the Sunbane and set them in a new order, rebuilding the Land in her own image.

The ramifications of this remain to be seen.

I see thread drift in progress here. Your analogy is apt. But you seem to be suggesting that LA's process of healing here was subjective and personal, when in fact she is supposed to be a doctor and objective about healing. I couldn't tell you where she learned so much about Giant anatomy. However, Pitchwife's basic anatomy was fundamentally sound and so she knew from this how to correct the warping of the structure.

Then there is LA's healing of earthpower which controls the natural order of things in the Land. This foundation of the Land was still intact (otherwise the Sunbane would have spread outside the Land), it was only warped, so in this case also she had a sound basic structure to work from.

In [u]White Gold Weilder[/u] was wrote:With the Staff of Law and the white ring. Linden caressed the fatigue out of the First's limbs, restored her Giantish strength. The rupture in Pitchwife's lungs Linden effaced, healing his respiration. Then, so that she would be able to trust herself later, she unbent his spine, restructured the bones in a way that allowed him to stand straight, breathe normally.

Another possible idea (one that I think has always been in the back of my mind when I've read that passage) is that by 'later' she means back in her own world. She wants to be able to trust herself that she did everything she could to help her friends survive getting out of Mount Thunder.

Also, she was very close to Pitchwife thoughout the last two books. With her new capacity for healing, I don't think she could have left him as he was without feeling regret 'later'.

Maybe.

Mysteweave, as I was writing my original post, I almost said the same thing, and then I scratched it.

I was going to say, that line meant that Linden wanted to be able later to reflect on what she had done, and find at least one unambiguously good thing she can rest her conscience on and think, I did good.

But then I thought, wouldn't the line have been, "so that she could feel good about herself later", or something like that. How does "trust" fit here.

It's been remarked in another thread that Linden was a bit of a jerk for decrippling Pitchwife without asking for permission.

And his deformation is certainly natural, not the result of evil. And it was part of Pitchwife's essential nature by that time. Pitchwife didn't need to be decrippled. Nor, I suspect, was there any reason to believe he'd be unhappy if left the way he was. Pitchwife, if anything, is the model of a well-integrated and healthy personality.

The only thing left to believe is that it is Linden who needed that done. Not as a gesture to Pitchwife, but for something critical to herself and the Land.

And "trust herself" ... if a person doesn't trust themself, that means that they think they'll make mistakes, or that they'll act for selfish reasons. So doing something so that you can trust yourself later means that you're either trying to ensure you're not making a mistake later, or that you're not acting selfishly later.

What selfish act could Linden be trying to avoid, that she forsees after healing the Land? One that decrippling a Giant prevents?

I can't think of anything.

So I think, it's a matter of not making mistakes. She wants to ensure that something she does afterwards isn't a dumb mistake.

The only thing that she does afterward is leave the Land. But that act implies that she'll be leaving the Staff behind, inside Mount Thunder, surrpounded by cavewights, some still-bad ur-viles, Ravers, and Creator knows what else. If the Staff falls into bad hands, all will be wasted. It MUST reach Sunder and Hollian.

The First knew it, too.

In [u]White Gold Weilder[/u] was wrote:"This must not fall to ill hands," she murmured. Her voice was as solid as granite: it nearly surpassed Linden's hearing. "I will ward it in the name of the future which Earthfriend and Chosen have procured with their lives. If Sunder or Hollian yet live, they will have need of it."

Perhaps Linden could have brought the Staff to Andelain. Or somewhere else. But that would take time, time she didn't want to spend. (In the story, once she is done quenching the Sunbane, she has almost no time left.) Time she didn't want to trade off against healing the Sunbane as best as she can. (In the story, even she at the end notes that "she could not do everything.")

So there's my reasoning. Linden decrippled Pitchwife because it was the most she could do to ensure that the Staff was kept safe after the keening winds carried her out of the Land. Her plan was to simply leave the Staff with the Giants so that she could concentrate on healing the Land to the utmost limit of her time left. And she didn't want that to be a mistake that she would regret.

wayfriend wrote:But then I thought, wouldn't the line have been, "so that she could feel good about herself later", or something like that. How does "trust" fit here.

That's the problem I'm having with the idea.

wayfriend wrote:And his deformation is certainly natural, not the result of evil. And it was part of Pitchwife's essential nature by that time. Pitchwife didn't need to be decrippled. Nor, I suspect, was there any reason to believe he'd be unhappy if left the way he was. Pitchwife, if anything, is the model of a well-integrated and healthy personality.

True, but then there's this from The One Tree, when Pitchwife describes to Linden how the Elohim 'tested' him by showing him himself if he were not crippled -

"He was myself. Yet not myself as you behold me, but rather myself as I might be in dreams."

then

"There was woe in that sight. In my life I have been taught many things, but until that moment I had not been taught to look upon myself and descry that I was ugly. At my birth, a jest had been brought upon me - a jest the cruelty of which Starkin displayed before me."

Faced with that, I believe I would've done the same.

Mysteweave wrote:

In [u]White Gold Weilder[/u] was wrote:With the Staff of Law and the white ring. Linden caressed the fatigue out of the First's limbs, restored her Giantish strength. The rupture in Pitchwife's lungs Linden effaced, healing his respiration. Then, so that she would be able to trust herself later, she unbent his spine, restructured the bones in a way that allowed him to stand straight, breathe normally.

Another possible idea (one that I think has always been in the back of my mind when I've read that passage) is that by 'later' she means back in her own world. She wants to be able to trust herself that she did everything she could to help her friends survive getting out of Mount Thunder.

Exactly. She helps the Giants before taking on the more arduous task of healing the Land, in that way she can be absolutely sure of herself. Later on she might second-guess her actions at that critical juncture, and this way she won't have to because she did everything humanly possible.

Mysteweave wrote:Also, she was very close to Pitchwife thoughout the last two books. With her new capacity for healing, I don't think she could have left him as he was without feeling regret 'later'.

Maybe.

Not maybe... precisely.

Mysteweave wrote: Also, she was very close to Pitchwife thoughout the last two books. With her new capacity for healing, I don't think she could have left him as he was without feeling regret 'later'.

There is some question about what "trust" means in this context. But it is nothing more than having confidence in herself; if she did not feel she did everything in her power while she had the power she would lose confidence in herself. She might never trust her own powers again.

That moment set the stage for LA's confidence in FR. LA shows great trust in her ability to wield power, and she does so without hesitation when she is certain it is the right thing to do. She isn't always certain when to use it, however, she learned under Mt. Thunder not to fear it or her ability. She doesn't always know what to do with this power, things aren't as cut and dried as they were beneath Mt. Thunder. But she is definitely not afraid of power or her ability to wield it anymore, not after confronting the immense evil of the Sunbane.

Im with WF on this.

Remember that among the Elohim, Pitchwife was shown himself as he would have been had he been born normal; this was his test. The First also was shown this image. They both passed, because she loved him for who he was, and Pitchwife himself knew that he was larger than his unfortunate deformity. This is an important point to remember -- he showed no regret, nor did the First, when shown just how perfect he would have been.

Pitchwife would have been fine without his deformity being corrected. Healing of wounds is one thing, and we take it for granted most of the time people want to be healed. However PitchWife's deformity was something normal to himself, he had lived with it all his life, and it was not a measure by which he, or his loved ones judged him. SO Linden's correction of his bent spine without his consent was done at least as much for her purposes, as it was for his own good, whether he would have chosen it if offered. Perhaps Linden was making sure the SOL was brought out by the Giants, or she was just giving a gift she now had the power to bestow, one that couldnt be protested.

In any case, I do think there is a connection of symbolism between the Sunbane's warping of Earthpower, and PitchWife's deformity. She corrected them both, to her own purposes, as she felt they should be, by her own moral guidelines.

therefore, the line, "So that she could trust herself later" -- I do think she wanted to heal his deformity first, then expend the remainder of her time in the Land correcting the sunbane. She knew time was short and that once she started, she couldnt stop. So she corrected PitchWife first, then focused on the Sunbane until her return was complete.

wayfriend wrote: It's been remarked in another thread that Linden was a bit of a jerk for decrippling Pitchwife without asking for permission.

He obviously wasn't upset about it.