Kevin's Watch

From ROTE; pg.179: (Lord Foul): ..."The Arch will be torn asunder, and I will reclaim my rightful place among the eternal Heavens. My Enemy will be unable to thwart me." Cunningly, the rank voice added, "THERE IS MORE, BUT OF MY DEEPER PURPOSE I WILL NOT SPEAK." WHAT deeper purpose? What in the hell does Foul have in mind this time? Previously, his biggest stated goal, was to destroy the Arch of Time, and escape his Earthly prison.("All Things Ending") Seems to me to be a direct reference as to what happens after the Arch is shattered. Foul will combat the Creator for control of the universe.("The Last Dark") Or, perhaps TC will fight Foul one last time on behalf of the Creator instead. Perhaps TC finally destroys Foul once and for all, but in the same way Brinn defeated the Guardian of the One Tree.But, all Time & Life is ended as a result of the battle. And, LA & Anele somehow put Humpty-Dumpty back together , or maybe prevent Time & Life from ending as a result of the battle. LA wields her power to preserve "survivablility", and Anele exerts his Earthpower to sustain Life. OMG.....what's Foul REALLY up to this time??? Whether it's coerced, or willful, Jeremiah serves Foul , so perhaps Jeremiah creates a "magic box" that traps the Elohim, rendering them unable to oppose Foul, or do much of anything. ...???

Who says the Arch of Time has to shatter in order for the Creator to reach the Land? He can use TC to get to LF after LF has possessed TC.

This is a teaser. We can't possibly know what his deeper purpose is.

I also think this line is a little ambiguous. (Shock! An ambiguous sentence in the Chronicles!)

It could mean that Foul won't speak more deeply of his purpose, meaning that he's not going to reveal any details.

Or it could mean that he has another purpose besides tearing the Arch asunder and reclaiming his place in the Heavens.

But it's hard to imagine a purpose that is "deeper" than that. Some have speculated that Foul seeks to get revenge on the Creator, or has plans for something else after becoming free. (Hey, maybe he wants to ask the Creator for forgiveness and live a life of service to others of his kind ... )

Donaldson has said that the Final Chronicles would explore Foul's motivations in greater depth. Although he hasn't done so yet, I dare say. But, again, this hints that there MAY be something beyond freedom that Foul seeks.

I know I'm in the minority, but I can't see Donaldson introducing something so new so late into the story. So I'm leaning towards the first explanation - Foul doesn't want to go into details.

This line goes hand-in-hand with the line from the WHGB section, something about Lord Foul having "other stratagems" in place.

Think Disney World...

Perhaps that deeper purpose concerns the "real" world. Who knows?

OMG !!! We're all gonna DIE ! Save us, TC & LA !!

If Foul and TC are in someway mentally "one" now after WGW, perhaps Foul plans on somehow usurping any kind of control or check that is currently in place.
If there was some kind of merging that we aren't aware of perhaps TC has the upperhand now in someway?
Or perhaps Foul has grown emotionally now as well as TC and now rather than just wanting to be free and a thorn in the Creator's side or an eternal enemy he has a plan to take down the Creater himself(or herself).
Perhaps Foul had a little self awareness growth too at the end of WGW.

If LF were to find a way into the "real" world, it would have to be through TC. Unfortunately for him, LF made that quite impossible.

Still, Lord Foul in real life could be Mickey Mouse...

You know how the Creator "manifested" himself in our world as an old man in an ochre-colored robe? Perhaps Lord Foul is the crazy homeless guy who lives in the alleyway behind my apartment building, arguing with himself at high volume at 4 AM....

I think Lord Foul was my organic chemistry teacher. His joy at causing despair to his students during exams and flaming green eyes seem to support this...

I think the question of what the Land is lies in Foul's deeper purpose. I think it lies within the creator's mind, whoever or whatever that might be. That means Foul is trapped within the mind of his captor. He's trying to kill his captor so that he can be released from his prison.

Whether he can do anything after the creator is dead is crux of the issue, but, that will have to wait for the arch of time to fall.

I've been thinking and thinking on this, and the scariest possibility I can come up with is LF returning to the timeless/immortal place with the Creator...but the Creator [assuming real in some way] is a creator...has or will always create more things: perhaps LF has some thought of how he could infect ALL creations, forever, without being trapped within them as he is now. The Creator can then either not create [a violation of his very nature], or continuously create things and watch them all suffer endlessly [and this time with LF always there, laughing and spitting in his face]
Mind, I don't think this is what WILL happen...but it could be LF's purpose at this point.

Vraith,

I'm not sure despoiling things is it. I think Foul does Þhat to hurt his captor and tempt him into iving Foul the tools he need to break out of his prison. If Foul really is the great enemy of Creation then he is the anthesis of creation.

That's not destruction as deatruction is part of creation. What is despair if not the ability to adapt to and accept change? Foul is inertia embodied and personified. He is stasis the true opposite of creation.

SerScot wrote:Vraith,

I'm not sure despoiling things is it. I think Foul does Þhat to hurt his captor and tempt him into iving Foul the tools he need to break out of his prison. If Foul really is the great enemy of Creation then he is the anthesis of creation.

That's not destruction as deatruction is part of creation. What is despair if not the ability to adapt to and accept change? Foul is inertia embodied and personified. He is stasis the true opposite of creation.

Well...for the purposes of THIS thread, I was picturing [trying to picture, actually] the most aweful thing possible...which isn't natural destruction/death/decay it was LF twisting, warping, corrupting everything good into things terrible, that they were not meant to be, in world after world, for time unending.
In another thread, however, I postulated something in line with what you just said ..."In the beginning" both the Creator and LF made mistakes, LF's imprisonment being the culmination. And, since he is naturally an immortal/timeless being, LF's imprisonment has made him worse...the arch isn't just a closed door for him, it's a device of torture. "In the end"...a more natural balance will be restored, immortals in the immortal realm, mortals living in mortal realms [which will contain life and death, good and bad...but not be subject to a literally unkillable, active, evil, being].

Vraith,

I think you are on to something. Everyone from our world in the Land appears to have some deree of inate power. What if Foul is simply the first person from our world to enter the Land, and as a result cannot die? Perhaps he wants to destroy the arch so that he can die?

SerScot wrote:Vraith,

I think you are on to something. Everyone from our world in the Land appears to have some deree of inate power. What if Foul is simply the first person from our world to enter the Land, and as a result cannot die? Perhaps he wants to destroy the arch so that he can die?

Ooooooh...I don't think you are right, mind you, but that is a very very cool thought.

The Creator seems able to travel from his own infinite universe into Covenant's universe. If Lord Foul escapes from the Arch and finds his way back into the Creator's universe, he may well be able to do the same thing.

Solar,

I disagree. The Creator seems to be able to facilitate other's traveling from our universe into the universe of the Land. My impression is that if he touches the Land directly it will destroy the Arch of Time.