The Black Covenant Fan Challenge

Post by **Worm of Despite** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:39 pm

Since we are in the post-racial era, thanks to Barrack Obama, I was wondering if any of you knew (just out of curiosity) whether or not there were African-American (or African-descending) fans of the Thomas Covenant Chronicles. No, Avatar, you don't count; I'm referring to the skin color. In fact, I dare any of you to find a non-white fantasy fan. I will be surprised.

I will be surprised.

Moreover, this prompts the question: why are there no black fantasy fans? Do blacks need no fantasies, since their constant use of bass music and ho-slapping has made all their dreams come true

Spoiler

(mother-fucker).

<admin edit-watch your frigging language pal!

Post by **High Lord Tolkien** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:31 pm

Post by **matrixman** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:33 pm

Post by **AjK** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:18 pm

There is a KW Forum thread somewhere in which multiple people said that they had envisioned Hile Troy as being Black when they read the Chronicles. I thought that was pretty cool.

YouTube · Post by **Menolly** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:32 pm

AjK wrote:There is a KW Forum thread somewhere in which multiple people said that they had envisioned Hile Troy as being Black when they read the Chronicles. I thought that was pretty cool.

*nodding*

But that is not what LF is asking.
And it is something to consider.
I've attended and was on the committees for several cons, although never a major one,
(I don't think Omnicon in Miami was considered a major con)
and I do not recall seeing a single African-american at any of them.

I also do not see a single African-american in the Watch's album.
Although I admit I haven't gone back through all of the pages.

I am separating Science Fiction from Fantasy fans, as I know several African-american fans of Star Trek. Hey, it is a start.

I've seen Asian fans of Fantasy.
I've seen Latino Fantasy fans.
I've mostly seen Caucasion Fans...

I'm sure African-american Fantasy fans are out there.
But I have yet to see any myself.

YouTube · Post by **Menolly** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:08 pm

Wow.
I just realized something.
I take that back.
If you allow Harry Potter to be considered Fantasy.

If you do, I think there may be a lot of up and coming African-american Fantasy fans. I've seen many kids of all races into Harry Potter. And they have moved on to Artemis Fowl and other YA Fantasy.

The challenge will be to retain them, as society puts whatever pressure it is they have put on them that has discouraged them from being Fantasy fans in the past.

And I did see some African-american kids (no families; no adults) at the recent Hoggetowne Medieval Faire. Perhaps the trend is already starting.

Let us have hope.
*soft smile*

Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:28 pm

So really, the more apt question is why isn't their better African-American fantasy writers out there that will create stories and characters that AAs can relate too?

YouTube · Post by **Menolly** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:06 am

jacob Raver, sinTempter wrote:So really, the more apt question is why isn't their better African-American fantasy writers out there that will create stories and characters that AAs can relate too?

They are out there. Getting the African-american audience to discover them seems to be more the challenge...

National Public Radio: Black SF and Fantasy

Post by **Seven Words** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:53 am

There's an African-American in my gaming group. Also, at Owlcon (at Rice University here in Houston), at the D&D game being run there, one of the DM's and 2 of the 8 players were African American.

On a related note, check youtube for the Chocolate News skit, "Blomicon"

Post by **Waddley** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:57 am

Two of my friends who are black are also into fantasy, although I don't think either of them has read Donaldson.

Do I win a prize?

Post by **Worm of Despite** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:01 am

Waddley wrote:Two of my friends who are black are also into fantasy, although I don't think either of them has read Donaldson.

Do I win a prize?

You do. Meet me behind the wood shed. You know the one.

Post by **variol son** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 6:22 am

I'm non-white (half assorted European, half assorted Pacific Island). Does that count?

Post by **Ur Dead** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 6:31 am

You might be suprised how many people are fantasy fans.
From all around the world.
Then there are people who are not. All around the world.
My point is:

Does it matter?

/Puts makeup on green and orange pokadots lining face.

Post by **lorin** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 1:01 pm

a very close friend of mine, 48 year old African American female is a big fan of the TC trilogies. other than that I dont know anyone.

Did you realize there is not one black actor in the LOTR movies? Perhaps the reason they are not involved in Fantasy is that they are not really included in Fantasy writing.

just a little theory of mine.

Post by **deer of the dawn** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 4:10 pm

I know some African-American kids who love Fantasy. They are siblings in a family. And I know some AFRICAN (not African-American) people who love the Lord of the Rings films. Because education is so abysmal here, however, reading the books would be a real mountain climb for most of them.

Ur Dead wrote:Does it matter?

In the grand scheme of the universe, no. But it does signify. It is thought-provoking, to me. How many black/colored/mixed race fantasy heroes or heroines are there? Not many. And I can't name a single black fantasy writer, I am sorry to say.

Post by **Rocksister** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:04 pm

Hmm, interesting question and thought-provoking posts here. I never considered it. But now that it has been brought up, I can only guess. Don't know about the rest of you, but I'm a huge geek. Love messing with computers and programming machines and what not. But I don't know any AA's that like doing any of that. Geekness is not cool, or not suave, or not macho, or whatever. They have superior physical abilities, as is evident if you have ever watched NFL footballs games or pro basketball, and yes, even baseball nowadays. I think AA's tend to gravitate towards more physical activities, rather than reading or playing sedentary games and such, because they are naturals and better at those things than Caucasians, for instance. Just an opinion. As far as Lord of the Rings actors, I never thought of that either, and it's been many years since I read the books, but does JRRT ever SAY what anyone's skin color is? I mean, how do we know they aren't all black? Or purple? Or green? The Orcs and Uruk-Hai have dark skin. On the movies, that is. But they are not human. Geekness tends to lend itself to sitting around a lot. Messing with computer stuff, reading books, playing RPG games on TV or PSP or X-Box or what have you. The African Americans that I know are out going places and doing stuff where they move around a lot. I don't notice race when I go to these movies. I will start paying attention now just out of curiosity. Actually I don't know anyone else in my own life who reads SRD at all. Of ANY race. Only the folks at the Watch.

Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:08 pm

Rocksister wrote:Hmm, interesting question and thought-provoking posts here. I never considered it. But now that it has been brought up, I can only guess. Don't know about the rest of you, but I'm a huge geek. Love messing with computers and programming machines and what not. But I don't know any AA's that like doing any of that. Geekness is not cool, or not suave, or not macho, or whatever. They have superior physical abilities, as is evident if you have ever watched NFL footballs games or pro basketball, and yes, even baseball nowadays. I think AA's tend to gravitate towards more physical activities, rather than reading or playing sedentary games and such, because they are naturals and better at those things than Caucasians, for instance.

Are AA's good at tap-dancing too?

Post by **danlo** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 6:43 pm

That could be construed as a controversial question, but I assume you're joking.

I wonder what an AA would say about LeGuin's Earthsea books? Any depiction of a charater on any of the covers renders them white, but many people in the Inner Islands are described as brown or dark. I guess we just have to assume that Ged is a white guy with a really good tan.

Funny how the Sci-Fi channel's Earthsea "effort" had Ged played by a white actor and Ogion by an AA actor, yet they both came from the same island.

Fri Feb 13, 2009 6:57 pm

Blacks, dey be good at dem sports, 'cept swimmin, but white boyz cain't jump.

Funny how my brief question is taken as either controversial or joking, but her long comment on exactly the same topic was not called on.

I've nailed someone before on that very same double-standard. And it still makes me laugh.

Post by **Seven Words** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 7:13 pm

Rocksister wrote: As far as Lord of the Rings actors, I never thought of that either, and it's been many years since I read the books, but does JRRT ever SAY what anyone's skin color is? I mean, how do we know they aren't all black? Or purple? Or green? The Orcs and Uruk-Hai have dark skin. On the movies, that is. But they are not human.

Actually, the Dunlendings who menace Rohan at Saruman's behest are described as "swarthy"...and the folk of Harador, to the South of Gondor, are called dark-skinned.

Kevin's Watch

Kevin's Watch

The Black Covenant Fan Challenge

The Black Covenant Fan Challenge