Kevin's Watch

Since I had trouble finding the other thread, here is a new one.



diy.despair.com/

But Aniken did bring balance to the Force.
By killing the Emperor.

Yes, but at what price?

$7.50 for the movie, and another $9.75 for the popcorn, Coke and Twizzlers.

High Lord Tolkien wrote:But Aniken did bring balance to the Force.
By killing the Emperor.

No, he brought balance by being evil. The Old Republic had ruled for what...a thousand generations? Dominated by the light side. It was out of balance indeed. Vader (and the Emperor) swung the balance back towards the dark side, after it had tipped too far toward the light.

Balance isn't the victory of light over dark. Balance is an equilibrium between the two.

--A

I didn't make this one. I just think it's awesome. I hope it inspires some.

wayfriend wrote:I didn't make this one. I just think it's awesome. I hope it inspires some.

I forgot about those toys! Me and my brother had some.

Me too.

--A

Avatar wrote:
Balance isn't the victory of light over dark. Balance is an equilibrium between the two.

--A

Balance is when light and dark are balanced, not by there being light and then there being dark. If dark was to balance light, then there would have to be thousand of years of the dark side. It should be light countering dark (or vice versa) at the same time.

Can't believe I'm discussing Star War's spiritual system . . .

A prophecy . . . that misread could have been.

Loremaster wrote:Balance is when light and dark are balanced, not by there being light and then there being dark. If dark was to balance light, then there would have to be thousand of years of the dark side. It should be light countering dark (or vice versa) at the same time.

Right. And at the time of the prophecy, dark wasn't countering light, right? They needed a bit of dark happening to recalibrate the balance.

But the jedi all talked about it as though the "balance" that was supposed to come was an end to the dark side.

--A

Avatar wrote:

Loremaster wrote:Balance is when light and dark are balanced, not by there being light and then there being dark. If dark was to balance light, then there would have to be thousand of years of the dark side. It should be light countering dark (or vice versa) at the same time.

Right. And at the time of the prophecy, dark wasn't countering light, right? They needed a bit of dark happening to recalibrate the balance.

But the jedi all talked about it as though the "balance" that was supposed to come was an end to the dark side.

--A

Your theory is still flawed, sorry to say. At the end of Return of the Jedi, the dark side has been overthrown and the New Republic is on its way. That means more Jedi. So we're back to what it was like in 1-3. However, your theory also doesn't account for there being the dark during the Old Republic, so technically it was balanced then. Besides, it's not 'the balance' that Lucas wanted to address, it was the fact that the Jedi had become, like the Republic, too comfortable and sure of themselves.

Loremaster wrote:Your theory is still flawed, sorry to say. At the end of Return of the Jedi, the dark side has been overthrown and the New Republic is on its way. That means more Jedi. So we're back to what it was like in 1-3. However, your theory also doesn't account for there being the dark during the Old Republic, so technically it was balanced then. Besides, it's not 'the balance' that Lucas wanted to address, it was the fact that the Jedi had become, like the Republic, too comfortable and sure of themselves.

Well, I'm not saying he succeeded in bringing balance...you're right, the evil empire would have had to last for thousands of years to even it out.

Not however, that RotJ meant that things were back the way they were in 1-3 either. (In fact, if you take the subsequent novels as forming a legitimate part of the universe, more dark was around afterwards than ever before really.)

As for the dark that was around in the Old Republic, didn't the Jedi in 1-3 believe that the Sith had been out of it for thousands of years?

In terms of your last point though, I agree...the Jedi had become too complacent. That's the balance Vader imposed...the destruction of that complacency.

--A

In the book, during his fight with Palpatine, Yoda realized he could not win. The Jedi had become stagnant. The Sith would win because they had evolved. They were fighting in different ways, while the Jedi were fighting the same way they had a thousand years ago. Qui-gon knew this better than anyone, and his ghost was going to teach Obi-wan and Yoda between the trilogies. And they would have taught Luke. Not specifics, I'm sure, but they would have taught him how to not think in rigid ways. So the complacency would stay away even after the Jedi returned.

For a little while anyway...

--A

Yeah. Heh.

Of course, we're only talking about how the Jedi use the Force. The Force is what it is. Always. It is never out of balance. It is never dark or light. Dark and light are only how the Force-users access it, and the kinds of things they use it for.

Haha, I love that I provoked Star Wars discussion in General Discussion. I too find the "balance" thing a little vague and confusing.