Kevin's Watch

I'm around Part 1 Chapter 10 of Shall Pass Utterly, and seriously, do we really need to keep reading about the stains on Linden's jeans? How many different metaphors can they possibly represent???

-jay

kevinswatch wrote:I'm around Part 1 Chapter 10 of Shall Pass Utterly, and seriously, do we really need to keep reading about the stains on Linden's jeans? How many different metaphors can they possibly represent???

-jay

I have to admit I'm of like mind. Given the frequency with which descriptions occur within the narrative, Linden's indecipherably significant stained Levis seem to be of greater significance than the equally indecipherable runes which Caerroil Wildwood adds to her Staff of Law - do I remember rightly that one of the reasons that Caerroil didn't immediately string Linden up on Gallows Howe was somehow because of the grass-stains on her jeans?

Regardless of that, I can see potentials for a lucrative sponsorship deal here - Linden Avery, brought to you by new Ariel Bio...

Just wait, the grass stains get compared to something quite distinct later on in the book ... though, this has been yet another point of contention among fans:

Spoiler

... her self-mutilation of her legs.

I agree that these extended "mysteries" have been pushed too far. It seems that Donaldson is just withholding that message for a manufactured, contrived sense of suspense. Surely he has something definite in mind for these images, or he wouldn't bother stringing us along for three books. He'll probably whip out the meaning in a powerful scene, much like the Seven Words. But by then it will have been built up for so long, that it will seem anti-climatic. Or, he'll just drop it like:

Spoiler

... Anele being the Land's last hope, etc.

Zarathustra wrote:Just wait, the grass stains get compared to something quite distinct later on in the book ... though, this has been yet another point of contention among fans:

Spoiler

... her self-mutilation of her legs.

I agree that these extended "mysteries" have been pushed too far. It seems that Donaldson is just withholding that message for a manufactured, contrived sense of suspense. Surely he has something definite in mind for these images, or he wouldn't bother stringing us along for three books. He'll probably whip out the meaning in a powerful scene, much like the Seven Words. But by then it will have been built up for so long, that it will seem anti-climatic. Or, he'll just drop it like:

Spoiler

... Anele being the Land's last hope, etc.

You mean

Spoiler

he's not the Last Hope of the Land?

Didn't the same thing happen to TC's robe in LFB?
While going through Morinmoss? (sp?)
Did we ever find out what it meant?

High Lord Tolkien wrote:Didn't the same thing happen to TC's robe in LFB?
While going through Morinmoss? (sp?)
Did we ever find out what it meant?

Nature and her ways remain unfathomable to us. But in Covenant's case, they seemed to have been prophetic, signifying eventual honor and distinction. Weren't there marks on the shoulder areas like two epaulets? Such meaning is always very personal. But for the reader, it just added to the eeriness and mystery of the scene in Morinmoss. In Linden's case, the way I see it is that it adds an aura of mystery to her future role as either saving or damning the Land. So it's prophetic but we don't know in what way. The scene in Garroting Deep adds an element of hope to the prophecy, and Forestals aren't often wrong.

Dear God, the jeans play a BIGGER role later in the book???

To be fair, I am enjoying the book so far. Although it hasn't pulled me in like the Gap (or the first two Chronicles) did so easily.

And for the record, Stave is the coolest character in the Last Chronicles (not that he has had much competition).

-jay

TheWormoftheWorld'sEnd wrote:

High Lord Tolkien wrote:Didn't the same thing happen to TC's robe in LFB?
While going through Morinmoss? (sp?)
Did we ever find out what it meant?

Nature and her ways remain unfathomable to us. But in Covenant's case, they seemed to have been prophetic, signifying eventual honor and distinction. Weren't there marks on the shoulder areas like two epaulets? Such meaning is always very personal. But for the reader, it just added to the eeriness and mystery of the scene in Morinmoss. In Linden's case, the way I see it is that it adds an aura of mystery to her future role as either saving or damning the Land. So it's prophetic but we don't know in what way. The scene in Garroting Deep adds an element of hope to the prophecy, and Forestals aren't often wrong.

The stripes on the shoulders were on Mhoram's robe, not Covenant's.

bikebryan wrote:

TheWormoftheWorld'sEnd wrote:

High Lord Tolkien wrote:Didn't the same thing happen to TC's robe in LFB?
While going through Morinmoss? (sp?)
Did we ever find out what it meant?

Nature and her ways remain unfathomable to us. But in Covenant's case, they seemed to have been prophetic, signifying eventual honor and distinction. Weren't there marks on the shoulder areas like two epaulets? Such meaning is always very personal. But for the reader, it just added to the eeriness and mystery of the scene in Morinmoss. In Linden's case, the way I see it is that it adds an aura of mystery to her future role as either saving or damning the Land. So it's prophetic but we don't know in what way. The scene in Garroting Deep adds an element of hope to the prophecy, and Forestals aren't often wrong.

The stripes on the shoulders were on Mhoram's robe, not Covenant's.

Interesting, that adds yet another event. It was in Lord Foul's Bane. Covenant's white robe was covered in stripes, while Mhoram received a stripe on each shoulder.

TheFallen wrote:

kevinswatch wrote:I'm around Part 1 Chapter 10 of Shall Pass Utterly, and seriously, do we really need to keep reading about the stains on Linden's jeans? How many different metaphors can they possibly represent???

-jay

I have to admit I'm of like mind. Given the frequency with which descriptions occur within the narrative, Linden's indecipherably significant stained Levis seem to be of greater significance than the equally indecipherable runes which Caerroil Wildwood adds to her Staff of Law - do I remember rightly that one of the reasons that Caerroil didn't immediately string Linden up on Gallows Howe was somehow because of the grass-stains on her jeans?

Regardless of that, I can see potentials for a lucrative sponsorship deal here - Linden Avery, brought to you by new Ariel Bio...

They're Levis ? I don't think I ever noticed that...

You know what else - Jeremiah's pysamas are also covered in dirt and grime..

But I don't recall Roger's clothes being referred to as stained or marked by contact with any part of the Land..

Linden's fate is written in water, so we are told. Grass stains happen when wet grass is rubbed against fabric.

Water + Earth = Linden's fate?

Worm, yea, The Land has left its mark on her..like..when the poop hits the fan..its, hey, just a reminder here, yea, down here, remember us?,,and no, we don't make your butt look fat!

High Lord Tolkien wrote:Didn't the same thing happen to TC's robe in LFB?
While going through Morinmoss? (sp?)
Did we ever find out what it meant?

Didn't he wake up in hospital in a green hospital gown at the end of the particular book (WGW)? I thought the white robe stained green was intended to be a reference to the green hospital gown (and a continuation of the idea that it was all in TC's subconscious ie subconsciously he was aware of the green hospital gown and so it was transmuted in his dreamstate into this green stained robe in morrinmoss)?