Kevin's Watch

”But in the old lore-legend, the children of the Creator had hope He put rainbows in ur sky after cleansing rains, as a promise to the stars that somehow, someday, he would find a day to bring them home.” –Saltheart Foamfollower in LFB

As I re-read the Chronicles, we are given a number of clues that point to the ending. Like oracles, they say much but make little clear (as Mhoram pointed out).

There is wild magic graven in every rock,
contained for white gold to unleash or control—
gold, rare metal, not born of the Land,
nor ruled, limited, subdued
by the Law with which the Land was created
(for the Land is beautiful,
as if it were a strong dream of peace and harmony,
and Beauty is not possible without discipline—
and the Law which gave birth to Time
is the Land’s Creator’s self-control)—
by keystone, rather, pivot, crux,
for the anarchy out of which Time was made,
and with Time Earth,
and with Earth those who people it:
wild magic restrained in every particle of life,
and unleashed or controlled by gold
(not born of the Land)
because that power is the anchor of the arch of life
that spans and masters Time:
and white—white gold,
not ebon, ichor, incarnadine, viridian—
because white is the hue of bone:
structure of flesh,
discipline of life.
This power is a paradox,
because Power does not exist without Law,]
and wild magic has no Law;
and white gold is a paradox,
because it speaks for the bone of life,
but has no part of the Land.
And he who wields white magic, wild gold
is a paradox—
for he is everything and nothing,
hero and fool,
potent, helpless—
and with one word of truth or treachery,
he will save or damn the Earth
because he is mad and sane,
cold and passionate,
lost and found.

The Lords' Song decrees the importance of Covenant (who is the white gold) to the arch and to the Creator's plan. Wild magic will have to come into play. Again:

”This the elder legends tell us: into the infinity before Time was made came the Creator like a worker into his workshop. And since it is the nature of creating to desire perfection, the Creator devoted all himself to the task. First he built the arch of Time, so that his creation would have a place in which to be—and for the keystone of that arch he forged the wild magic, so that Time would be able to resist chaos and endure.Then within the arch he formed the Earth." Tamarantha in LFB

I still haven't given up yet on the idea that the Creator could be Covenant. I was struck by the paragraph at the beginning of LFB that speaks of Covenant writing his novel as creating a beautiful land. "the Law which gave birth to Time is the Land’s Creator’s self-control." I'm not attached to the idea either, it has a lot of flaws (as in, how does he get back to the earth from the Earth, seeing as he's dead there). If TC is learning anything in the Land, it is self-control (along with many other things).

I will continue to post clues as I come across them. Not that I think I can figure things out, but because I trust SRD to elegantly resolve what needs to be resolved.

I think some conclusions are safe:
1. The end will not be complete darkness. There is too much promise implied for redemption of some kind. Not for humans, not for individual beings, but for the stars, for the Land.
2. The losses will be staggering. SRD is not afraid to sacrifice precious things to make the story move forward, or to maximize its impact.
3. The Creator has to show up in some form or another.
4. Both Linden and Covenant are necessary to its resolution, since both wild magic and Law are said to be crucial.

Nice analysis.

I was considering this the other day along with the notion of SRD's claim that clues to the Last Chronicles were left in the Second. Was the issue of the Sun Sage and Ring Weilder not being the same person, as per the Elohim, cleared up in the Second Chronicles? Did Linden serve this purpose at the end of the Second. Or will that come back up again?

SkurjMaster wrote:I was considering this the other day along with the notion of SRD's claim that clues to the Last Chronicles were left in the Second. Was the issue of the Sun Sage and Ring Weilder not being the same person, as per the Elohim, cleared up in the Second Chronicles? Did Linden serve this purpose at the end of the Second. Or will that come back up again?

Covenant and Linden both have WGR now but Covenant is apparently the only true wild magic wielder in the Land. The only way the two can become united is if Jeremiah uses his powers to unite them into one Mega Parent, the Lindenant.

Lindenant. Excellent! Got a good chuckle there. And the left over gloop from their union, all that self hatred and murder and rape, travels back in time to be lord foul.

Nice.

I'll be posting more on the Creator and his role in it. He is the source of both Law and Despite (so it is said, but not conclusively) so neither can continue without him. He is also the one that caused forces from outside the Land to come into play, to have an "in" and influence in the Earth. But even now I have moved away from the "TC is the Creator" idea, after all the Creator cannot himself enter the arch of Time, and sending himself as a younger man would kind of be cheating. But I do hope we will find out more about him.

If we assume that in the last book the current Creation will end and a new one will take its place, we should ask what qualifies someone to the status of Creator or better still a good and competent Creator?

Covenant has a lot of the required qualities. He is a deep thinker who created both fictional worlds and ethical systems. He has the pathos required for the job and the ability to love even nations and abstracts.

Linden on the other hand might have the necessary scientific background to make tenable Laws.

Jeremiah of course has the magical power to construct things.

So which of those qualities is the most important? I suspect Donaldson will choose none of these options. Instead, it will be a team effort. The current Creation also seems to have been the product of a team effort between the Creator, Foul and She (as the inspiration?) Maybe a similar scenario will happen this time as well, though of course this time it will not end in discord and utopia will finally be achieved.

Our three heroes will take over the roles of the previous three eternals. Could Foul, the Creator and She become mortals and live a happy life at last? I imagine them living out their lives in the 'real' world. Foul as a revived sheriff Lytton, She as the nanny that got dragged to the Banefire careter and the Creator as a normal Jeremiah.

shadowbinding shoe wrote: Instead, it will be a team effort. The current Creation also seems to have been the product of a team effort between the Creator, Foul and She (as the inspiration?) Maybe a similar scenario will happen this time as well, though of course this time it will not end in discord and utopia will finally be achieved.

Our three heroes will take over the roles of the previous three eternals. Could Foul, the Creator and She become mortals and live a happy life at last? I imagine them living out their lives in the 'real' world. Foul as a revived sheriff Lytton, She as the nanny that got dragged to the Banefire careter and the Creator as a normal Jeremiah.

On the first, yea, though utopia might be a bit too much for a world of mortals...they'll likely still have evil, but not Evil, wrong but not Wrong. What I think makes the difference [besides NOT having true Immortals like LF and SHE inside the box with them] is that the "next generation" Creators are not Pure, Ideal, as the first were. They are, recognize, and own their flaws, shortcomings, pains, and evils. [paradox and alloy embodied].

On the second...I think I'm going to spend a couple days having little snippets of their life stories popping into my head and cracking me up at random moments. Very nice. I'm giggling right now.

Vraith wrote:
Deer: I've moved away from TC/Creater as one as well...but sometimes I think TC is/always was Creator Apprentice. He's in the midst of his Masterwork. If it succeeds, he's a Creator in his own right.

Pretty much the direction I've been heading as well. I speculate that the Creator is mortal, and it was his plan to place Linden and Covenant in the Land to take over when he passes away on earth.

"Of course the Creator lives," she repeated. "How else? Opposites require each other. Otherwise the difference is lost, and only chaos remains. No, there can be no Despite without Creation." -Tamarantha in LFB

The Creator's death would bring about chaos. Which is what's happening, isn't it? Perhaps Linden, Covenant, and Jeremiah were his last throw at either salvaging his creation, or at renewing it in some way by having one or more of them be the new Creator. Maybe Linden and Covenant together form a new arch of Time, while Jeremiah returns to earth to don ochre robes...

"The Law requires that no act may be undone. Desecration may not be undone-- defilement may not be recanted. It may be survived or healed, but not denied." -Tamarantha

Survival and healing are still on the table. Add time travel to the mix and the possibilities for redemption, renewal, and restoration of the Land are unimaginable.

In LFB Manethrall Lithe expresses this surprising belief of the Ramen:

That is life, and it is good-- we ask for nothing else until the end, when all Earth is Andelain, and man and Ranyhyn live together in peace without wolves or hunger.

SRD has a way of honoring his characters' prophecies/visions, not always in the expected form, but this certainly gives hope.

deer of the dawn wrote:In LFB Manethrall Lithe expresses this surprising belief of the Ramen:

That is life, and it is good-- we ask for nothing else until the end, when all Earth is Andelain, and man and Ranyhyn live together in peace without wolves or hunger.

SRD has a way of honoring his characters' prophecies/visions, not always in the expected form, but this certainly gives hope.

Didn't this sort of come to pass? After the Sunbane happened the Ramen and Ranyhyn left the Land and made the whole world their homeland, (or Andelain) and it appeared that though the locals usually weren't too friendly, they weren't too hostile either so there were no slavering wolves after them and the food wasn't too scarce either.

shadowbinding shoe wrote:... the Lindenant.

Mighara Sovmadhi wrote:

shadowbinding shoe wrote:... the Lindenant.

The Covery?

shadowbinding shoe wrote:Didn't this sort of come to pass? After the Sunbane happened the Ramen and Ranyhyn left the Land and made the whole world their homeland, (or Andelain) and it appeared that though the locals usually weren't too friendly, they weren't too hostile either so there were no slavering wolves after them and the food wasn't too scarce either.

Good point, although was Andelain ever their homeland, or anybody's (except the Unfettered One who fought the ur-viles)? I always loved that it almost seemed to sacred for the setting up of housekeeping.

Now that TC has fused all the cracks in his psyche, he should be able to endure Hurtloam without losing himself anymore and get his Land Percipience back. Would that suffice to bring Sun sage and WG together?

SoulBiter wrote:Now that TC has fused all the cracks in his psyche, he should be able to endure Hurtloam without losing himself anymore and get his Land Percipience back. Would that suffice to bring Sun sage and WG together?

I bet by the time he gets back to the land the Worm will have devoured enough Earthpower from the Earth to have made Hurtloam impossible to find.
I expect it will recede deeper into the earth as the overflow disappears.
Wasn't it only on the surface like that because the Land is practically bubbling over with Earthpower?

Hurtloam seems like an easy fix. Just like Covenant's fractured mind wasn't fixed by a simple Staff healing I don't believe his body will be healed by a simple smearing of hurtloam.

There's a very clear parallel between Covenant's ailments and the Land's. His refusal to be healed suggests that he wants to keep it that way (or at least wanted when he still knew what his plan was). His mind was healed when the anti-causal Caesures problem was dealt with. His budding blindness will be healed when the sun and stars will return to the skies, his imminent death will be prevented when the Worm is circumvented and his leprosy induced lack of health sense will be healed when She and her Dirt will be resolved.

You're analysis is fascinating. It brought me back to the moments I first ready Lord Foul's Bane. It is an amazing story. Does anyone know why the Wild Magic poem is not used as an epigraph in every book? It brings you back to the heart of the story, just as the Lord of the Ring's poem does for that series.

deer of the dawn wrote:

”But in the old lore-legend, the children of the Creator had hope He put rainbows in ur sky after cleansing rains, as a promise to the stars that somehow, someday, he would find a day to bring them home.” –Saltheart Foamfollower in LFB

As I re-read the Chronicles, we are given a number of clues that point to the ending. Like oracles, they say much but make little clear (as Mhoram pointed out).

There is wild magic graven in every rock,
contained for white gold to unleash or control—
gold, rare metal, not born of the Land,
nor ruled, limited, subdued
by the Law with which the Land was created
(for the Land is beautiful,
as if it were a strong dream of peace and harmony,
and Beauty is not possible without discipline—
and the Law which gave birth to Time
is the Land’s Creator’s self-control)—
by keystone, rather, pivot, crux,
for the anarchy out of which Time was made,
and with Time Earth,
and with Earth those who people it:
wild magic restrained in every particle of life,
and unleashed or controlled by gold
(not born of the Land)
because that power is the anchor of the arch of life
that spans and masters Time:
and white—white gold,
not ebon, ichor, incarnadine, viridian—
because white is the hue of bone:
structure of flesh,
discipline of life.
This power is a paradox,
because Power does not exist without Law,]
and wild magic has no Law;
and white gold is a paradox,
because it speaks for the bone of life,
but has no part of the Land.
And he who wields white magic, wild gold
is a paradox—
for he is everything and nothing,
hero and fool,
potent, helpless—
and with one word of truth or treachery,
he will save or damn the Earth
because he is mad and sane,
cold and passionate,
lost and found.

The Lords' Song decrees the importance of Covenant (who is the white gold) to the arch and to the Creator's plan. Wild magic will have to come into play. Again:

”This the elder legends tell us: into the infinity before Time was made came the Creator like a worker into his workshop. And since it is the nature of creating to desire perfection, the Creator devoted all himself to the task. First he built the arch of Time, so that his creation would have a place in which to be—and for the keystone of that arch he forged the wild magic, so that Time would be able to resist chaos and endure.Then within the arch he formed the Earth." Tamarantha in LFB

I still haven't given up yet on the idea that the Creator could be Covenant. I was struck by the paragraph at the beginning of LFB that speaks of Covenant writing his novel as creating a beautiful land. "the Law which gave birth to Time is the Land’s Creator’s self-control." I'm not attached to the idea either, it has a lot of flaws (as in, how does he get back to the earth from the Earth, seeing as he's dead there). If TC is learning anything in the Land, it is self-control (along with many other things).

I will continue to post clues as I come across them. Not that I think I can figure things out, but because I trust SRD to elegantly resolve what needs to be resolved.

I think some conclusions are safe:
1. The end will not be complete darkness. There is too much promise implied for redemption of some kind. Not for humans, not for individual beings, but for the stars, for the Land.
2. The losses will be staggering. SRD is not afraid to sacrifice precious things to make the story move forward, or to maximize its impact.
3. The Creator has to show up in some form or another.
4. Both Linden and Covenant are necessary to its resolution, since both wild magic and Law are said to be crucial.

Excellent idea, Shinnok, and it's kind of surprising that SRD doesn't, in a way.

Yesterday I found something I had forgotten about-- High Lord Elena's theory (in TIW) that the dead of the Land are living in Covenant's earth; that perhaps Kevin Landwaster was even there walking around... I'll have to get the verbatim quote later, but there is another tantalizing idea about the Creator.

deer of the dawn wrote:Excellent idea, Shinnok, and it's kind of surprising that SRD doesn't, in a way.

Yesterday I found something I had forgotten about-- High Lord Elena's theory (in TIW) that the dead of the Land are living in Covenant's earth; that perhaps Kevin Landwaster was even there walking around... I'll have to get the verbatim quote later, but there is another tantalizing idea about the Creator.

Where does she say this? I don't remember it. I've always been fooled (or was I?) by the singer who calls Covenant Berek. The idea of Berek as the wandering bar-singer has struck with me.