Two arguments against the priority of happiness

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Mighara Sovmadhi
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Two arguments against the priority of happiness

Post by Mighara Sovmadhi »

1. An abstract reason
First off, what am I even talking about? Happiness is going to be defined ostensively for a second, but by "the priority" thereof I mean the intention of setting as one's first priority being happy. It is often remarked, I've seen, that the only reasonable course of action is to (try to) be happy. That is, "There's no rational reason to aspire to anything else," goes the claim.

On a very high level of description, Immanuel Kant defines morality in terms of principles with unconditional priority over others. (This is a simple translation of the frequently convoluted phrase "categorical imperative.") Likewise, John Rawls writes:
A further condition is that a conception of right must impose an ordering on conflicting claims... The fifth and last condition is that of finality. The parties [to the transcendental election in the original position] are to assess the system of principles as the final court of appeal in practical reasoning." [A Theory of Justice, sec. 23]
The entire question of "morality over happiness" is just the question as to whether anything has priority over happiness, even. This is where the confusion arises for some over whether the absence of divine retribution in the world would license the loss of moral concepts. The truth that should be evident enough is that this is not the case, for it is not even the case that the goal of being happy is logically structured so as to allow it to have unconditional primacy in one's decision-making.

As Kant elsewhere writes:
The commonest intelligence can easily and without hesitation see what, on the principle of the will's autonomy, requires to be done... the moral law demands the most punctual obedience by everyone; it must, therefore, not be so difficult to judge what it requires to be done.

... If only it were equally easy [compared to technical decision procedures] to give a definite conception of happiness... [such a conception] is not an ideal of reason but of imagination, resting solely on empirical grounds, and it is vain to expect that these should define an action by which one could attain the totality of consequences which is really endless.
Kant, Rawls, and Bernard Williams have all remarked that the concept of being happy is just the concept of having achieved all of one's goals, more or less (I think Williams puts it in terms of "projects" or something). Considered in this light, it is clear that becoming happy is not able to directly pertain to one's choices as a reason to act one way or another, for it is only acting on a prior reason (a prior goal) that one can attain the state of having a goal fulfilled. That is, something else has to be elected to the role of one's first priority (one's ultimate goal) in order for one to be happy in having fulfilled this goal.

2. A concrete reason
Here's a thought experiment designed to show that it is logically possible for something to divest happiness of its priority over at least one other thing. Suppose you had a disease whereby every time you were happy, you suffered an extreme migraine. If you were in this situation, would it remain true that you would have a reason to try to be happy? Note that even setting yourself to abandoning your goals as a means to avoid being happy would, as a goal, even if otherwise achieved, cause you acute suffering. It seems likely that you might end up with chronic, if fairly dull, pain.

You might object that in this case, it is not that being happy is no longer one's goal in the sense that you would be happy if you could, but since you no longer can, you make no effort to achieve your priority in this case. I think this objection mistakes the nature of prioritizing. In a system that is even partly deterministic, as even libertarian free will would have to be (I am an indeterminist about this topic, but only in recognizing some small pockets of reality in which free choice exists), there must be some functional structure to that system. Practical reasoning, inasmuch as we execute our planning by its output, is realized in how we act. Akratic we may be, yet this is only in falsifying our priorities in the context of what provokes our incontinence. What we give priority to just is how we immediately determine ourselves to act; it's the mechanical form of the shove we give ourselves in our directions. The simple fact is that what we do is give avoiding pain preference over high or low pleasures when we reject the latter for the former in the sum of our choices. That is our character in this case.

The negation of agony may be passive or aggressive. In a sense, Buddhist thought involves a theory of emotional passivity as the solution to the problem of rational priority. Nirvana is attained not by forcing our desires to disappear but by falling somehow into the transcendental mists behind them and ceasing to will the energy that strains them. Now there is something complex about the antinomy between inaction as free will and action as the same, and Buddhism arguably resolves it somehow, but I'm not competent to say whether it does. I'm just making a suggestive remark about the issues, here.

Happiness is an emotional state, though the abstract nature of these states in general is still up for debate. David Hume seems to have thought that sympathy was the emotion superior to happiness; Kant said it was respect; I would vote for saudade not as the only one better, but nonetheless the best. It would, I think allow for an elegant solution to the problem of moral/rational decision-making for someone infected with the hypothetical sickness I described earlier.

Plus romantic love.
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Post by Vraith »

I'll have to think about that a bit.
But off the top of my head:
Emotions, including happiness, are not abstract in the slightest...they are as close to concrete as anything humans are capable of calling concrete.
They only become abstract when people start trying to turn them into goals, and/or try to prioritize/categorize/explain/rationalize or moralize/demonize them.

It is perfectly possible...in fact not all that uncommon...to be in excruciating pain AND blissfully happy at the same instant...
for, in fact, both simultaneous states to be caused by the same cause.

Happiness has no innate connection to morality. That is arbitrary and learned.
Happiness might have a tenuous connection with goals, but that also, I suspect, is primarily arbitrary and learned...and most of the learning about the goal/happiness relationship is bullshit.
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Post by Mighara Sovmadhi »

Vraith wrote:Emotions, including happiness, are not abstract in the slightest...they are as close to concrete as anything humans are capable of calling concrete.


I don't think objects can be separated as abstract and concrete; I think these are just different levels of functionality for all objects. That is, some functions of x are abstract and others are concrete, not x itself. To refer to emotional abstractions is just to refer to general facts about emotions as opposed to especially particular ones.

For that reason, I have to disagree with:

They only become abstract when people start trying to turn them into goals, and/or try to prioritize/categorize/explain/rationalize or moralize/demonize them.


... because I don't agree with:

Happiness might have a tenuous connection with goals, but that also, I suspect, is primarily arbitrary and learned...and most of the learning about the goal/happiness relationship is bullshit.


It seems clear to me that being happy is the state of having achieved a goal, but perhaps you're thinking of something different by the word "goal" than I am.

It is perfectly possible...in fact not all that uncommon...to be in excruciating pain AND blissfully happy at the same instant...
for, in fact, both simultaneous states to be caused by the same cause.


Pleasure and pain are not emotions, so pain is not the contrary of happiness, granted. Unless we're metaphorically talking about "emotional pain," for instance, though; but I also don't mean to oppose being sad to being happy. Why else would I mention saudade?

Happiness has no innate connection to morality. That is arbitrary and learned.


There's nothing to be as such learned, though. The word "morality" can be defined at one's leisure, and since people usually don't attach any really precise meaning to it, if talking about it is do anyone any good, then it has to be given a precise context in an argument. So you can't just talk about "what's right" just like that, you have to spell out some conditions of your definition of what's right. And the way many have defined it--which they have been freely justified in doing the way they have done--entails a certain meaningful relationship between the concepts of happiness and morality.
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Post by Fist and Faith »

Happiness isn't the destination. It's the road.
All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest
-Paul Simon
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Post by Mighara Sovmadhi »

There might be a deep difference between being happy, tranquility, and euphoria. They all seem of the same broad category, but there's something unique to them all as well. So, "Happiness is not the destination, it's the road," could be read as saying, "Tranquility, which is equal to happiness, is not given in the end of our actions, it is in the process of achieving that end." In that case, I'd agree with it without reservation.
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Post by Vraith »

Mighara Sovmadhi wrote:There might be a deep difference between being happy, tranquility, and euphoria. They all seem of the same broad category, but there's something unique to them all as well. So, "Happiness is not the destination, it's the road," could be read as saying, "Tranquility, which is equal to happiness, is not given in the end of our actions, it is in the process of achieving that end." In that case, I'd agree with it without reservation.
See, now I had ticky-tack semantic problems with F&F's statement, but not with what I thought was the point. Which was the point also of what I previously posted.
I had a lot to say, but deleted it.
If happiness is your goal, but you aren't happy in pursuing it you either:
Have the wrong goal.
Are following the wrong path.
[in both cases you are wasting your time and probably killing yourself]
Happy and happiness are NOT the same thing any more than
angry and angry-ness,
depressed and depression,
are the same thing.
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Post by Holsety »

To me, happiness is a bit like being easily interested, and is a lot like curiosity. Or for me...? And being able to be curious in a way that people oblige me with some sort of response that indicates that I do kind of understand, and may have the ability to understand further (but it's not really important that I do understand further, because I don't know why it's important). I think. Being unable to dismiss anything as important, because when I look over my own stuff, it seems like everything I do is important to my stuff. Things like that. Sometimes I get worried or fearful simply because it seems like someone wants to occupy my attention, and even though I DO want to pay attention to them, I feel like the way they're occupying my attention despite a protest indicates they have ill intent. Stuff like that.

So it's not necessarily self sustaining, nor do I think it's really quite so regular as you might think when I say the above, but it is, in some way, the "first response" when I can bring myself to notice at all. (?) I don't know if that's actually true though.
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Re: Two arguments against the priority of happiness

Post by Linna Heartbooger »

I will try to keep the Kant-despising monster which lives inside me from fully emerging on your thread - unless given permission to do otherwise. Well, except in the tiniest font.
Mighara wrote:Here's a thought experiment designed to show that it is logically possible for something to divest happiness of its priority over at least one other thing. Suppose you had a disease whereby every time you were happy, you suffered an extreme migraine. If you were in this situation, would it remain true that you would have a reason to try to be happy? Note that even setting yourself to abandoning your goals as a means to avoid being happy would, as a goal, even if otherwise achieved, cause you acute suffering. It seems likely that you might end up with chronic, if fairly dull, pain.
I was going to object vigorously to this counterfactual...
The fact that it's a counterfactual means that it may have no connection to the underlying nature of the world.

But actually, I think I get it... it really is like the nature of reality.
Truly connecting ourselves to another in love... even another human... (much more an invisible God) is to bare ones heart to, "Rejoice with those who rejoice, weep with those who weep."
I've heard the cynical jest, "Every relationship ends either in break-up or death."
Mighara wrote:The simple fact is that what we do is give avoiding pain preference over high or low pleasures when we reject the latter for the former in the sum of our choices. That is our character in this case.
I think that is very true of... far too many of us.
And not what we ought to be.
Mighara wrote:I would vote for saudade not as the only one better, but nonetheless the best. It would, I think, allow for an elegant solution to the problem of moral/rational decision-making for someone infected with the hypothetical sickness I described earlier.
saudade, interesting...
looked it up.
I find it ironic that you used the word in the same sentence as "an elegant solution."

So I say the practice of the thing (accepting saudade as a cost of love, and anguish as a price of great happiness) shall be very different from - and of far more value - the theoretical discussing of it.
I fail horribly in that one myself... while I claim belief that any such saudade need only be a temporary thing of some few decades.
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Post by Fist and Faith »

I don't think my first post was understood. Here's several quotes to try to help clarify. (Thanks to Av for the last, now added to my list.)
I saw Dina at the party tonight. She smiled brightly and said, "This year I decided to give up suffering."

-Hugh Prather
A fool is “happy” when his cravings are satisfied. A warrior is happy without reason.

-Dan Millman's Way of the Peaceful Warrior
There is no way to happiness - happiness is the way.

-Buddha
In the true order of things one does not do something in order to be happy - one is happy and, hence, does something. One does not do some things in order to be compassionate, one is compassionate and, hence, acts in a certain way. The soul’s decision precedes the body’s action in a highly conscious person. Only an unconscious person attempts to produce a state of the soul through something the body is doing.

-Neale Donald Walsch's Conversations With God
Pleasures conceived in the world of the senses have a beginning and an end and give birth to misery, Arjuna. The wise do not look for happiness in them. But those who overcome the impulses of lust and anger which arise in the body are made whole and live in joy. They find their joy, their rest, and their light completely within themselves.

-Sri Krishna in the Bhagavad Gita
Happiness is not a state to arrive at, but a manner of traveling.

-Margaret Lee Runbeck
Oh, ho, listen, Man, and we'll tell you everything! Do you hear the waves whispering the secret? We know you know, Man. The secret of life is just sheer joy, and joy is everywhere. Joy is what we were made for. It is in the rush of the nighttime surf and in the beach rocks and in the salt and the air and in the water we breathe and deep, deep within the blood. And the sifting ocean sands and the wriggling silverfish and the hooded greens of the shallows and the purple deeps and in the oyster's crusty shell and the pink reefs and even in the muck of the ocean's floor, joy, joy, joy!

-Neverness
An older student came to Otis and said, "I have been to see a great number of teachers and I have given up a great number of pleasures. I have fasted, been celibate and stayed awake nights seeking enlightenment. I have given up everything I was asked to give up and I have suffered, but I have not been enlightened. What should I do?" Otis replied, "Give up suffering." -- Camden Benares, "Zen Without Zen Masters"
IMO, Walsch's wording is the best. Happiness is an approach to life; a way of living. It is not something to achieve for brief moments because of having done this or that.
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Still a man hears what he wants to hear
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Post by Avatar »

I'm glad you liked the quote Fist. ;)

(I don't much like Kant either Linna, but have always wondered if he might not read better in the original instead of the translation. Unfortunately my German is not good enough to attempt it. And I've only read his Critiques anyway.)

So...happiness. :D A much misunderstood subject. See...the whole idea of happiness as a goal or objective or whatever that everybody must attain is very very new. This book on the subject looks very interesting: Happiness: A History.

Also, we can't be happy for very long at a time. (By happy I mean a euphoric or similar state.) (See the adaptation theory of well-being. This looks interesting too, but I can't get the full text. Doesn't appear to disprove the theory though, is just adapting it in a specific sense: Beyond The Hedonic Treadmill.)

Basically, the harder you try to be happy, the less likely you are to actually be happy.

Which recalls my own favourite quote on happiness.
If you have to move, even one inch, from where you are right now to be happy, you probably never will be.
Happiness shouldn't be a priority, it should just be. Stop worrying that you're not happy enough. :D

--A
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Post by Fist and Faith »

Excellent quote. Excellent post. That's what I'm saying. The premise of the thread is flawed. Not to say I have an answer for every conceivable thought experiment. And I'm not saying I expect I'd be happy while being tortured. And I'm not saying they're haven't been, and won't be, times of unhappiness in my life.

I'm saying the approach is key.
All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest
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Post by Avatar »

Perspective man. :lol: Everything is about perspective. ;)

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Post by Mighara Sovmadhi »

Fist and Faith wrote:The premise of the thread is flawed.
Which one?

I must be missing something in a lot of the responses to this thread... A lot of people are talking about happiness not being a goal, or how it ought not to be a goal, which is what I think I've agreed with from the start. The very act of "trying to be happy" as a sort of achievement to unlock in the game of life is wrong-headed, in my view. But now it seems as if this is a different conclusion than yours?
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Re: Two arguments against the priority of happiness

Post by Mighara Sovmadhi »

Linna Heartlistener wrote:I will try to keep the Kant-despising monster which lives inside me from fully emerging on your thread - unless given permission to do otherwise. Well, except in the tiniest font.
I've tried to avoid depending solely on Kant in my argument. I mentioned him for one, together with Rawls and B. Williams, as an example of someone who, perhaps unlike Aristotle (say), understands being happy in a way that makes it unworthy of being an overriding priority.
saudade, interesting...
looked it up.
I find it ironic that you used the word in the same sentence as "an elegant solution."
Well, I was thinking that if a person with my fictional sickness endeavored after saudade instead of happiness, the partial "sadness" of saudade would offset the trigger for the disease (the pure state of dopamine/serotonin/whatever release) while allowing the partial "happiness" of saudade to come in to play, too, thereby allowing the person with this disease to feel a constructive, life-encompassing feeling.

I have a deeper reason to esteem saudade so much, but that's another story for another time...
So I say the practice of the thing (accepting saudade as a cost of love, and anguish as a price of great happiness) shall be very different from - and of far more value - the theoretical discussing of it.
Granted, except that some times in our lives it's best for us to sit down and really think as hard as we can about what we ought to be or do or whatever, so in those circumstances theory is overwhelmingly appropriate.
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Post by Avatar »

Mighara Sovmadhi wrote:The very act of "trying to be happy" as a sort of achievement to unlock in the game of life is wrong-headed, in my view.
No, I think we're agreeing with you in a sense.

Not in that being "happy" is bad, but that trying to be happy is almost counter-productive.

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Post by Fist and Faith »

If something has to happen in order for you to be happy, then it's the wrong approach.
All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest
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Post by Hashi Lebwohl »

So in other words we need to begin with the phrase "I want happiness". From here, remove ego--the "I"--from the equation to be left with "want happiness" then remove desire--the "want"--to be left with "happiness".

Did I paraphrase that accurately?
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Post by aliantha »

Hashi Lebwohl wrote:So in other words we need to begin with the phrase "I want happiness". From here, remove ego--the "I"--from the equation to be left with "want happiness" then remove desire--the "want"--to be left with "happiness".

Did I paraphrase that accurately?
Isn't that the Buddhist prescription? Remove the ego and the desire, and live in the present moment, and you will be happy. Right?
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Post by Hashi Lebwohl »

I think so, yes. I was simply trying to paraphrase the previous few posts.

Of course, I highly doubt anyone can be happy in the moment when someone else is screaming in your face, throwing things at you, or trying to punch you.

Interestingly, though, even St. Paul advised a similar approach to happiness by learning how to be content in your current circumstances regardless of what might be happening around you.
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Post by Mighara Sovmadhi »

This seems pertinent (Dan Haybron, "Happiness," sec. 1.2):
Which use of ‘happiness’ corresponds to the true meaning of the term in contemporary English? Arguably, both. The well-being usage clearly dominates in the historical literature through at least the early modern era, for instance in translations of the ancient Greeks' ‘eudaimonia’ or the Latin ‘beatitudo’, though this translation has long been a source of controversy. Jefferson's famous reference to “the pursuit of happiness” probably employed the well-being sense. Even later writers such as Mill may have used the term in its well-being sense, though it is often difficult to tell since well-being itself is often taken to consist in mental states like pleasure. In ordinary usage, the abstract noun ‘happiness’ often invites a well-being reading. And the locution ‘happy life’ may not naturally take a psychological interpretation, for the simple reason that lives aren't normally regarded as psychological entities.

Contrast this with the very different meaning that seems to attach to talk of “being happy.” Here it is much less clear that we are talking about a property of a person's life; it seems rather to be a property of the person herself. To be happy, it seems, is just to be in a certain sort of psychological state or condition. Similarly when we say that so-and-so “is happy” (as opposed to saying that he is leading a happy life). This psychological usage, arguably, predominates in the current vernacular. Researchers engaged in the self-described “science of happiness” usually do not take themselves to be making value judgments when they proclaim individuals in their studies to be happy. Nor, when asserting that a life satisfaction study shows Utahans to be happier than New Yorkers, are they committing themselves to the tendentious claim that Utahans are better off. (If they are, then the psychology journals that are publishing this research may need to revise their peer-review protocols to include ethicists among their referees.) And the many recent popular books on happiness, as well as innumerable media accounts of research on happiness, nearly all appear to take it for granted that they are talking about nothing more than a psychological condition.
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