Kevin's Watch

I am finally ready to abandon my fence straddling, having read the ARC. I come down just barely on the side of THOOLAH. Not that Linden doesn't continue to do the jaw dropping things that managed to convert HLT to LA. It's just for me, other than bringing Jeremiah in to the picture, and that may have happened without Linden and due to the bonfire his natural mother brought him to rather than through Linden's influence, Linden isn't necessary. And thus her angst and whining isn't either. TC remains the one and only protagonist, as TOM so eloquently states.

Mostly, I could remain OPAL, if there was a way to make OPAL mean I could take or leave the character. For as much attention as she is given in the second and third chrons, I couldn't care less about her.

Spoiler

Her one saving grace, and I am hoping this is not considered a spoiler, is that between TC, Linden, and Jeremiah, they fulfill SRD's theme of family relations within the third chrons.

But, that's my opinion.

[mod edit - spoiler tag added, just in case.]

Really, Menolly?

I am so disappointed in that choice from you.

Much as I'd like to discuss it further, ARC knowledge does not belong in this thread. You know what I know, but that is not for others to see yet. I will take it up with you in person.

Menolly, we welcome you into THOOLAH with open arms. It's good to see your eyes are now open.

Now, about your favorite football team.....

dlbpharmd wrote:Now, about your favorite football team.....

GO GATORS!!!

As a long time member of THOOLAH, I just want to say "none of the above" to the poll choices.

And this choice is the worst one of all:
"Jay will delete every thread that has THOOLAH in it."

A highly unlikely option since Jay was the one who started THOOLAH.

Linky.



I have to say, that's still a pretty darn funny post.

This thread is awesome.

To those saying Linden is unnecessary. Yes, Thomas Covenant is the protagonist. But damn, he needs Linden as much as the story does, and if the Land had had just TC in the Second Chrons, they all would have been screwed. Allow to lift a quote out of Half Life 2:

You have destroyed so much. What is it exactly that you have created? Can you name even one thing? I thought not.

All of Covenants actions, in the entire series, have been reducible to one of two basic abilities: destroy and endure. All of his actions, negative or positive, have either involved him destroying something or enduring terrible suffering. The best ones have been a combination of both: the caamora for the souls of the Giants in TWL, his own caamora in the Banefire in WGW, his self-sacrifice to Foul. But, really that's all he can do. He can't create. He's a leper. Flesh rots and nerves don't regenerate. He can't heal; he re-enacts the destruction of his own life and body, first on the Land, then on the Land's enemies. And, he's the wild magic. The crux, the pivot to the arch of time. Pivots don't choose what is balanced upon them. His is to bear what must be borne.

Goddamit, he needs Linden. Linden is the healer. Linden is the one with the ability to create...at least so far. It seems that responsibility has been passed to Jeremiah for these Last Chronicles. On that, I'll have to RAFO. I have no doubt that all three of them will play crucial parts in the conclusion. I also have no doubt that, as in the Second Chrons, the conclusion would not be complete without both Covenant and Linden.

Second time in the space of a week that I have said this about a Cambo post:

Spoiler

Wary as I am of imparting unearned knowledge, your last paragraph is spot on.

THOOLAH: RAFO.

[mod edit - spoiler tag added.]

Savor Dam wrote:Second time in the space of a week that I have said this about a Cambo post:

Wary as I am of imparting unearned knowledge, your last paragraph is spot on.

THOOLAH: RAFO.

Why thanks, SD!

No need to be wary of such a minor spoiler, I would think. We should all be familiar enough with SRD's writing to know that he writes for his endings, and very little occurs that is not necessary for his planned conclusions. Certainly not the roles of major characters .

Cambo wrote:
Goddamit, he needs Linden. Linden is the healer. Linden is the one with the ability to create...at least so far. It seems that responsibility has been passed to Jeremiah for these Last Chronicles. On that, I'll have to RAFO. I have no doubt that all three of them will play crucial parts in the conclusion. I also have no doubt that, as in the Second Chrons, the conclusion would not be complete without both Covenant and Linden.

Well of course Covenant needs Linden. I've never felt otherwise. However I'm just not interested in a Linden-centric story.
I've said it before. The last season or so of the X-files was pretty flat when Fox Mulder appeared in the show by name only. The remainder of the characters couldn't shoulder the burden of interest without him and the Last Chrons effects me the same way. When TC is a disembodied voice or locked down because he's trapped in his own memories I find the story less interesting and I guess I tend to take it out on Linden because she's left to carry the load and generally fails with regard to my personal tastes.

Nothing at all wrong with other people preferring Linden over TC or at least being entertained with her character in the absence of TC because that's just human nature and its an honest reaction which I respect.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

aTOMic wrote:We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Well that's no fun

Seriously though, I sympathise with your position. I personally like Linden, I enjoy reading about her actions and her development as a character. But I have missed TC like hell through these Last Chronicles. If it was my choice there'd be more of him.

And my post wasn't explicitly aimed at anyone in particular, just a couple of posts upthread that implied/outright stated Linden wasn't just an annoyance, but an unnecessary annoyance. My point was just that, love her or hate her, we're stuck with her, and we'd be screwed without her.

aTOMiC wrote:

Cambo wrote:
Goddamit, he needs Linden. Linden is the healer. Linden is the one with the ability to create...at least so far. It seems that responsibility has been passed to Jeremiah for these Last Chronicles. On that, I'll have to RAFO. I have no doubt that all three of them will play crucial parts in the conclusion. I also have no doubt that, as in the Second Chrons, the conclusion would not be complete without both Covenant and Linden.

Well of course Covenant needs Linden. I've never felt otherwise. However I'm just not interested in a Linden-centric story.
I've said it before. The last season or so of the X-files was pretty flat when Fox Mulder appeared in the show by name only. The remainder of the characters couldn't shoulder the burden of interest without him and the Last Chrons effects me the same way. When TC is a disembodied voice or locked down because he's trapped in his own memories I find the story less interesting and I guess I tend to take it out on Linden because she's left to carry the load and generally fails with regard to my personal tastes.

Nothing at all wrong with other people preferring Linden over TC or at least being entertained with her character in the absence of TC because that's just human nature and its an honest reaction which I respect.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Well said, aTOMIC.

Well 5 years have past ..
Anybody change or switch sides?

Ur Dead wrote:Well 5 years have past ..
Anybody change or switch sides?

Well, wayfriend has managed to convince me to leave OPAL to join Linden's Army...when I was admiring Linden for her services to Berek's army and commenting about it in the Last Chronicles Group Readings, he caught me in a weak moment and got me to enlist, you see.

I'm pesky that way.

Ur Dead wrote:Well 5 years have past ..
Anybody change or switch sides?

HELL NO

F that B

she be all "ESMER NO!"

SHADDUP

You can call me an a associate of Linden's army. I rooted for her at the beginning
when wayfriend was hotly defending her. I got a few shots in also.
SRD created Linden as the foil to complement Covenant.
I mean Thomas Covenant isn't the superman hero. He lacks the few
dynamics that people desire to see for a hero to beat up the bad guy.
Well more than a few.. A whole lot.
He stumbled, bumbled, talked to himself way through the first book.
It happened that he had strong supporting cast.
And they supported him in the next two.

Then comes the second set and that cast really won't be around to lift him out. So, here comes Linden. A straight shoooting, doctor
who's past is crowded with some deep skeletons and who is naive
of the world and of the Land.
TC is her mentor and she figures out how to break her cycle of timidly at the end. They both have a less supporting cast.

Now the third, Linden is the key, Without her there is no Thomas Covenant. She has a direction but she does not know the Land when
TC first visited. But she isn't wonder woman, she has issues that contraint
her. Like her adopted son. She knew the Land under the Sunbane and under
Kevin Dirt. She becomes one PO'ed woman
and now has a crusade. She does what she feels she has to and ends up winning.
Like a take from the chorus from an old song.
"You don't step on Superman's cape."
"You don't spit into the wind."
"You don't pull the mask of the ole Loneranger"
"and you don't mess around with Linden"

Ur Dead wrote:Well 5 years have past ..
Anybody change or switch sides?

Not on your life.

THOOLAH! THOOLAH! THOOLAH!

THOOLAH forever!