The humble Potato.

[peter]

What follows is a basic guide to the roasting of potato's. The potato must be the King of vegetables and who would disagree that the roast potato is it's finest form.

The recipie below is one that I have developed by trial and error over many years and seems to result in a near perfect roast potato on most occasions. [two points ; I say 'near perfect' - my mother could cook a better one, but alas she took the method to the grave having died before I developed my interest in cooking. Second point - cooking as always, is a form of alchemy and sometimes it just don't play ball. Small things like variation in the potato, the oven temp, even the cooking oil all play their part and there are odd times when the dice just fall wrong. It happens in all cooking, but practicing over and over reduces these occurences to a minnimum.]

Ok - first the potato. Maris Piper white potatoes are the best. Avoid King Edward's - they have too grainy a texture inside. Choose spuds that will sit nicely in the palm of your hand [cricket-ball size?] allowing one largeish spud per person. Peel them carefully, not wasting too much and cut each potato in half. If the size is correct these two halves should make a nice portion for one person [if the size is too small they won't a) be enough and b) withstand the boiling process without falling apart.] Now wash the potatoes in cold water. Now wash them again. This removes the starch from the surface and seems to really effect the end result. Stick them in a pan of salted water with lots of space for each spud to move around [ie not crammed together] and bring to the boil. At the same time you light the gas [0r whatever] for the pan of spuds, light up the oven to gas mark 5 [about 375 f, 190 c]. Take a foil tray that is big enough for all the spuds to have plenty of room - nothing will spoil roasties quicker than cramming them in side by side - and put in about a square inch of lard for each potato [the melted fat that you put the spuds into wants to be about 0.5cm deep in the tray - too shallow or too deep will again have consequences in the final product.] Finally put a splash [half an egg-cupfull] of olive oil into the tray along with the lard and place it on the middle shelf of the heating oven.

The potatoes will take 10 or so minutes to par-boil, and you can tell when they are ready because a pointed knife will just abut slip into the surface without going in too deep; if your potatoes were cut too small they will just collapse at this point, hence the reason for keeping the spuds bigger [also they tend to absorb less fat into the deeper flesh which can make them nicer to eat {emphasis on the 'can' - there is a deeper topic here that must be reserved for the higher level potato 'adept'}]. If you wanted to, say because your foil tray was not very big, you could just put the whole peeled potato in to boil and not cut it into half at all - I've never had a problem with a potato being too large - only with them being too small. Anyway, you are happy that your potato is ready to go into the fat - and that the fat is ready to recieve the potato [it will have melted, started 'popping' and stopped again] nb the fat must be hot enough to sizzle when the spuds go in, but not smoking hot. If you think the fat is not hot enough when the spuds are par-boiled, their size will cut you some slack, so just turn them down to minimum and heat your fat a bit longer. If the fat is too hot, take it out of the oven for half a minute or so and it will soon cool down.

Now, drain your spuds fully and put them back into the saucepan. Swirl them around four or five times to fluff up the outside then add a knob of butter to the pan. Swirl again to coat with the butter and then tip them straight into the hot fat [carefull here! - armslength.] nb It's better to leave the fat in the oven untill the buttering process is done - fat looses temperature really fast out of an oven and you really want that 'sizzle' when you put the spuds into the fat. No salting of the potatoes is needed here because you have boiled them in salted water and the butter has enough salt to finish the job. Now use a spoon to coat each spud in the hot fat and position them in the tray with maximum space around each one. Into the oven on the middle shelf and leave for twenty minutes. After 20 mins take out the foil tray and turn each potato over - now back in for another twenty mins. At this stage [ie 40 mins into the roasting] take the tray out and re-turn the potatoes. You will now begin to judge how much longer your potatoes are going to need. Most likely they will take the full hour [ie another twenty mins], but some potatoes cook faster than others so be prepared to take them out after a final 10 mins - or even leave them in a bit over the hour if you think they need it. The roast potatoes will be fine for a while in a warm bowl if there is need to finish other things in the oven or whatever, but by and large you can bank on them taking about the full hour at the temps I have given. Bigger [ie uncut] potatoes may take a bit over, but rarely more than say an extra 10 minutes. And that, folks, is how it's done. All that remains now is to eat the little beauties!

[peter]

Ok - here's a really quick and lazy way to get a spud onto the table in a manner that ticks all the boxes of flavour and unctousness without sacraficing hours of preparation time. Take your spud, chop it in half, half again and [maybe] half again [depending on size]. Pur the resulting wedges into a deep bowl, douse with olive-oil, sprikle with salt, black pepper and chili flakes and give the lot a good stir. If you like garlic wedges then add a finely chopped clove also and stir in. Now place the wedges onto a flat baking tray/sheet on a piece of cooking foil [saves on washing up]. Place into an oven [pre-warmed or not; doesn't make any difference] set at gas mark 5 [375f 190c] for about 30 mins. Turn once after this time, then cook for about another 15 mins or untill you can see they are done. Serve with blue-cheese dip or along side fish, steak, whatever. These bad-boys are good!

[Vader]

May I suggest to add a few lemon wedges and a sprig of rosemary? Otherwise this is a very fine recipe and something we often have to accompany food from the grill.

[peter]

When you say lemon wedges Vader, you mean add them to the bowl of potatoes [in wedge form] and then bake them whole on the tray with the potato wedges? [ie not squeezed over the spuds in the bowl]. Sounds a good addition to me; keeps with the simplicity, and lemon and rosemary - whats not to like!

[Vader]

You bake the lemon wedges with the potatoes. Minus the chili flakes this is a very Tuscanese dish.

[Avatar]

Hey, that sounds like a good idea.

For the roasted one, if you score the tops deeply with a knife after par-cooking, they'll get an even crispier top layer.

--A

[peter]

Will try Vader - anything italian always hit's the spot for me.

Av - this might bring me in to the 'deeper levels' of spud roasting I hinted at above. Alas I've got to go to work now but like Arnold Scwartzenneggerere - "I'll be back!"

[Vraith]

May I suggest to add a few lemon wedges and a sprig of rosemary? Otherwise this is a very fine recipe and something we often have to accompany food from the grill.

Heh..not adding anything to the thread, really, and not gonna mess with the umlauts and spelling, just gonna translate:
Some of the best 'taters I ever had were made by the parents of a friend of mine at dinner at his house in Darmstadt. Had "green sauce"
Freaking YUMMY!
My understanding was that there are many many variations, theirs had 7 herbs which I no longer remember cuz it was 30 years ago now.

And slightly off-color: sweet potatoes and yams are NOT the same thing.

[peter]

Ok - now the only common way I can think of serving potatoes in a green sauce in the UK would be freshly tilled 'Jersey New Potatoes' which are served simply boiled in their skins in salted water [all new pots are served this way, buy they do make lovely little roasting potatoes if thinly peeled - I've tried it] and then served in a beautiful sweet mint sauce [as you would normally serve with lamb]. This makes GOOD eating!

Next point - In the UK a 'sweet potato' is a distinct type of vegetable - an orange fleshed root veg, somewhat potato-like in cosistency, but leaning a little in the 'beet' direction. A yam is.... what the f*** is a Yam!

Av, in my earlier post I mentioned that my mother could do a better roast potato than me. Something that she seemed able to achieve was to get an almost 'waxy' quality into the flesh, unctuous but never greasy. Your scoring of the potato would certainly increase the crispness on the outside [and has got to be good on that score alone] but may even help toward the effect I describe above. A couple of points - my mothers potatoes were always a smaller size than mine [despite all I said in my top post] and she only ever used absolutely bog standard '5lb bag of spuds' potatoes. [She also cooked them around the meat or bird on a Sunday].

[Avatar]

Yams and sweet potato are very similar.

Sweet potato

The sweet potato is a dicotyledonous plant that belongs to the family Convolvulaceae. Its large, starchy, sweet-tasting, tuberous roots are a root vegetable. The young leaves and shoots are sometimes eaten as greens

Yam

Yam is the common name for some plant species in the genus Dioscorea that form edible tubers. These are perennial herbaceous vines cultivated for the consumption of their starchy tubers in Africa, Asia, Latin America, the Caribbean and Oceania.

Ah Peter, somehow our cooking is never quite as good as our mothers, is it?

Mom's roast potatoes were great, but one thing I can never quite duplicate were her amazing Yorkshire puddings. *sigh*

We used to cook the spuds with the meat too, but I can't these days, because the GF is a vegetarian, so they have to be separate.

I usually use the extra space for 2 butternut halves and roast them too, with a sprig of rosemary and a dash of nutmeg on them.

--A

[peter]

I usually use the extra space for 2 butternut halves and roast them too, with a sprig of rosemary and a dash of nutmeg on them.

--A

Now that sounds nice!

[Vader]

There are various variations on green sauce, just not in the region where I live. Most famous is the "Frankfurter grüne Soße". Traditionally it consits of borage, chevril, cress, parsley, burnet, garden sorrel and chives. Chopped really fine the herbs get mixed with sour cream, mayonnaise, cooked egg yolks (optional), oil, vinegar, lemon juice, salt and pepper. Onions, garlic, medium hot German mustard and yoghurt are possible additions.

The people in Frankfurt are dead serious about their sauce. To be considered original only these seven herbs can be used. The percentage of each herb may not exceed 30% in the comkplete sauce and at least 70% of the herbs have to be grown in Frankfurt.

[peter]

And this green sauce is used specifically on potatoes Vader, or more generally like say a mayonaise or a ketchup?

[Vader]

Mainly potatoes, boiled eggs, Tafelspitz (beef boiled in broth) or fish. People like to mash potatoes and sauce together with their fork.

Just a few miles from Frankfurt, in Kassel, they add lemon balm and dill. And the people in Darmstadt - where Vraith ate the sauce - will have their own version.

All these cities are in the state of Hesse, so green sauce basically is a Hessian thing. In Hessian dialect "grüne Soße" is "grie Soß" (gree Zoss).

[Avatar]

Ah, the scharfes S, how it brings back my school days.

--A

[Vader]

This is what I did the other day:

- peel waxy potatoes and cut them into cubes (roughly 1 inch)
- put into a large pan in a single layer.
- season with salt, pepper, a few twigs of thyme, bay leaves and a clove of garlic (crushed with the blade of the knife)
- add enough home made chicken stock to almost cover the potatoes
- bring to the boil and let simmer until potatoes are almost copoked and stock has been absorbed/evaporated. If necessary add more stock in between.
- drain potaoes, clean pan, add olive oil and butter
- fry potato cubes until golden brown.

The best roasted potatoes I ever had.

[peter]

That sounds good vader - do you need a very heavy frying pan for this? Mine's sort of 'middle' [ie not a real lightweight, but nor a cast iron heavyweight]. I've got a hankering for one of those really heavy 'copper bottomed frying pans - they have to be the best at heat distribution which is what 'pan cooking' is largely about.

We tried to do 'hasselback potatoes' a few days ago for the first time. I'm not sure we got them right [either that or they just 'aint as good as the other types of roast potatoe I can do - I'm never sure about any method that does not involve at least some pre-boiling to soften the interior of the potatoe]. The end result just didn't seem to pay back on the effort.

[Vader]

I prefer cast iron skillets or stainless steel pans but you can certainly use a simple non stickl pan.

I'm having a déjà vu here, but I'm not sure if it was here or on facebook. Someone taked about hasselback potatoes and I answered I love mine cut in spirales, using such a device here:

www.galeria-kaufhof.de/fsi/server?type= ... eight=1043

As |'m just planning this years Hallows Eve dinner, I have to decide what will go as a side dish with the classic beef roulades:

- boiled potatoes (rather unspectacular but perfect with the gravy)
- creamy mashed potatoes (maybe with a bit of celeriac in it, most definitely not that overcomplicated recipe by Heston Blumenthal where I'd have to start preparing the mash right now in order to get it perfect on Hallows Eve)
- gratin dauphinois (I love the taste of it, but it's not that good to go with gravy and I fear the dish will get too heavy in the end)
- gratin savoyard (see above)
- pommes de terres de boulangères (not everyone at the table might agree with the onions in there - I got some guests with very sensitive bowels)
- potato dumplings - (perfect for the gravy, but lots of technique involved and a lot of things can go wrong, including ending up with a thin potato soup).

Or should I make bread dumplings? Or do something crazy and serve the roulades with polenta?

[Menolly]

Wow. You've stumped me Vader.

First, what is Hallows Eve? I know All Saints Day is preceded by All Hallows Eve, but that was over a month ago.

Second, my knowledge of French cuisine is pretty much nil. How are each of the French named potato dishes prepared?

Third, I love a good potato dumpling, but had no idea they were difficult to make, as I've only had them in German-style delicatessens in Florida. Would matzah balls work for variety?

[Vader]

Wow. You've stumped me Vader.

I hear that a lot. It's all in a day's work.

First, what is Hallows Eve? I know All Saints Day is preceded by All Hallows Eve, but that was over a month ago.

I'm not a native speaker and I just confused your holidays. It was meant to be Christmas Eve ("Holy Evening" in German). That's when Santa comes to us before going over to fill stockings elsewhere.

Second, my knowledge of French cuisine is pretty much nil. How are each of the French named potato dishes prepared?

- gratin dauphinois: The Classic. The Divine The Rolls Royce of potato dishes - thin slices of potato, salt, pepper, thyme go layered into a caserole that has been buttered and rubbed with gartlic. Mix cream, a dash of milk, salt and pepper and pour over potatoes until about covered. Cook in the oven until potatoes are soft, surface is golden brown and cream has got firm (cover if it gets too dark before potatoes are cooked. No cheese or egg needed.

- gratin savoyard: basically the same, just instead of cream and milk you use stock and put some grated cheese on top.

- pommes de terres de boulangères - caramalize onions and cook and layer them into a casserole with thinly sliced potatoes. First a layer mof potatoes, than a layer of onions, and so on. Add stock and cook in the oven until stock has been completely absorbed and potatoes ar cooked.

Third, I love a good potato dumpling, but had no idea they were difficult to make, as I've only had them in German-style delicatessens in Florida. Would matzah balls work for variety?

[fixed the end quotes for you. ~m.]