What will it take to change attitudes towards abortion?

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Ukraine's Catholic prelates condemn surrogacy as a 'moral evil' [In-Depth]
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A nurse and newborns are seen in the Hotel Venice, which is owned by BioTexCom, a surrogacy agency in Kyiv, Ukraine, May 14, 2020. Dozens of babies born to surrogate mothers are stranded in Ukraine as the COVID-19 pandemic lockdown prevents their foreign parents from collecting them. The country's Catholic bishops have called for a halt to commercial surrogacy. (Credit: Gleb Garanich/Reuters via CNS)


When the government of Ukraine ordered its borders closed in March to prevent the spread of COVID-19 coronavirus, over 100 babies were left stranded.

They were the children of surrogate mothers -- women who were paid nearly $17,000 to rent their wombs to wealthy people from outside the country.

According to the leadership of the Catholic Church in the country, surrogate motherhood allows for "international child trafficking" and they have now urged for the practice to be banned.

Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk of Kyiv-Halych, head of the Eastern-rite Ukrainian Catholic Church, and Archbishop Mieczyslaw Mokrzycki of Lviv, president of the country's Latin-rite bishops' conference, said the coronavirus pandemic has "brought to light many diseases in the life of contemporary society."

Topping the list is surrogate motherhood, they described in a pastoral letter released Friday as "treating people like merchandise which can be ordered, manufactured, and sold."

Surrogacy is legal in Ukraine, and the bishops want this "shameful phenomenon" banned and condemned by civil authorities.

The statement from Shevchuk and Mokrzycki came after BioTexCom, one of the country's largest surrogacy agencies, posted a video on YouTube on April 30 showing 46 newborns being cared for in a Kyiv hotel suite.


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Archbishop Mieczyslaw Mokrzycki of Lviv, Ukraine, is seen at the St. John Paul II National Shrine in Washington, Oct. 22, 2014. (Credit: Bob Roller/CNS)


The video was meant to reassure those who had contracted for the children that they were safe, but it also was meant to force the government's hand in speeding up the processes so that parents can pick up their babies, which is now impossible because of the ban all air travel from foreign nations.

According to a Reuters report from Ukraine, the Hotel Venice where the babies are kept is surrounded by a high fence with barbed wire. The hotel belongs to BioTexCom, and parents usually stay there while picking up their babies. The company pays around $15,000-$17,000 to surrogate mothers.

Parents arrive from all over the world including the United States, China, Britain, Sweden and Ireland to have a Ukrainian woman carry their child.

[...]

In their May 15 letter, the bishops argued that "these newborns were in modern incubators, deprived of maternal touch, parental warmth, selfless care, and much-needed love."

"They were shown as a purchased product for no-show buyers," they argued. "Such a demonstration of contempt for the dignity of the human person is difficult to contemplate. And all this is made possible by legalized surrogate motherhood."


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Ukrainian Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk, major archbishop of Kiev-Halych and head of the Ukrainian Catholic Church, speaks to reporters at the Vatican. (Credit: CNS photo/Paul Haring)


"So-called surrogate motherhood, which should not be called 'motherhood,' entails not only the horrible phenomena now manifested, but, at its core, is a moral evil and brings countless sufferings and hardships to all participants in this deal, including the child, surrogate mother, members of her family, and, finally, the people who order and 'produce' children," the bishops said.

In their letter, the prelates also condemned so-called "altruistic surrogacy," where a woman bears a child for another without payment, as morally unacceptable, "for even if the intention of the surrogate mother is good, the means and the object itself are bad."

But commercial surrogacy, "from a moral point of view, deserves an even harsher assessment because it adds the moral evil of buying and selling the functions of the body and the person of the newborn child. No circumstances or consequences can justify the practice of surrogacy."

"Every child is a gift of God that should be gratefully accepted in the marriage of a man and a woman," Shevchuk and Mokrzycki wrote. "Every child has the right to be conceived naturally, and every child has the right to be born into a family and to be brought up in an atmosphere of love by its father and its mother."

Politically, the bishops added, the legalization of commercial surrogacy "makes it impossible for Ukraine to follow the path of development, the path of a great European heritage. Such a gap in Ukrainian legislation significantly destroys European integration efforts and discredits our country in the eyes of European society," where surrogacy for pay is illegal.

As they note in the appendix to their letter, the European parliament unanimously condemened the practice of surrogate motherhood, not distingushing between its "altruistic" and "commerical" aspects, in 2011.

[...]


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Post by Skyweir »

An absolutely archaic and out of touch position ... surrogacy aids women whos anatomy cant carry viable foetus and bare a child.

If having a child is the object of a pregnancy, which it is ... and giving birth is ordained of god ... it is then logically a desirable outcome, how does that object become evil?

If all life is from god ... something is missing in this agenda driven absence of logic. 🤦‍♀️

Catholicism cant have it every which way 🙄
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Post by sgt.null »

If the left belives in science,
They should recognize the
Horror of abortion and support
Birth control over murder.
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Post by Skyweir »

We are talking surrogacy
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Post by Wosbald »

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Skyweir wrote:[...]

If having a child is the object of a pregnancy, which it is ... and giving birth is ordained of god ... it is then logically a desirable outcome, how does that object become evil?

If all life is from god ... something is missing in this agenda driven absence of logic. 🤦‍♀️
Hmm ... I can't find this particular argumentative entrainment being proposed in any of the sources I've cited.

Am I just missing it? 🤔

Regardless, it sounds like you're implying that, by the ostensible standards of Catholic moral calculus, impregnation would/should be justifiable "by any means necessary".


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Post by Skyweir »

I am indeed implying a number of the elements I note ... based on your articles claims that surrogacy is evil.

And that carry a child and bearing said child as surrogate is evil.

"So-called surrogate motherhood, which should not be called 'motherhood,' entails not only the horrible phenomena now manifested, but, at its core, is a moral evil and brings countless sufferings and hardships to all participants in this deal, including the child, surrogate mother, members of her family, and, finally, the people who order and 'produce' children," the bishops said.

In their letter, the prelates also condemned so-called "altruistic surrogacy," where a woman bears a child for another without payment, as morally unacceptable, "for even if the intention of the surrogate mother is good, the means and the object itself are bad".
My question then is how if a child is a gift from god as identified earlier in your article does it become bad or an evil?
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Post by Wosbald »

+JMJ+
Skyweir wrote:I am indeed implying a number of the elements I note ... based on your articles claims that surrogacy is evil.

And that carry a child and bearing said child as surrogate is evil.

"So-called surrogate motherhood, which should not be called 'motherhood,' entails not only the horrible phenomena now manifested, but, at its core, is a moral evil and brings countless sufferings and hardships to all participants in this deal, including the child, surrogate mother, members of her family, and, finally, the people who order and 'produce' children," the bishops said.

In their letter, the prelates also condemned so-called "altruistic surrogacy," where a woman bears a child for another without payment, as morally unacceptable, "for even if the intention of the surrogate mother is good, the means and the object itself are bad".
My question then is how if a child is a gift from god as identified earlier in your article does it become bad or an evil?
I'd recommend finding a quote identifying "a child" as being the "object itself" of the act-of-surrogacy.

Barring that, one might want to consider that the "object itself" -- which the Ukrainian bishops (and their team of ethicists) have in view -- is not the child but is, rather, something else.


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Post by Skyweir »

Oh really????

I disagree ... and perhaps you could volunteer what that something else might possibly be.

What could the OBJECT of surrogacy be if not to carry a child.

They assert that surrogacy.. which they assert can not be claimed as motherhood ... to which I would agree ... as the surrogate offers her services as an incubator .. not a mother ... but they go too far ... when positing that incubating a child IS at its core a moral evil. 🙄

How could THAT be?

Isnt all life of value? Isnt life derived of god?

Without actually expounding what constitutes the "countless sufferings" surrogacy supposedly causes.

Like providing a baron family with a child of their own???

Wow ... how on earth could THAT be morally unacceptable to the Catholic patriarchy???????? +JMJ+ 🤦‍♀️
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Skyweir wrote:Oh really????

I disagree ... and perhaps you could volunteer what that something else might possibly be.

What could the OBJECT of surrogacy be if not to carry a child.

[...]
Dunno. As I may've noted before, I'm not an Ethicist (not even an armchair one), having studied little on the subject. But if you really want to dig into the meat of it, here's somewhere you could start. ...

Natural Law, the Object of the Act, and Double Effect: Moral Methodology for Catholic Health Care Ethics [PDF]
ABSTRACT

Dissertation supervised by Dr. Gerard Magill

Pope John Paul II's Encyclical Veritatis Splendor is the first and only magisterial document that systematically articulates a moral methodology for Catholic moral theology. This dissertation makes explicit the methodological connection between Vatican teaching and the United States Bishops' Ethical and Religious Directives for Catholic Health Care Services. The thesis of the dissertation explains the systematic connection between Natural Law, the Moral Object of the Act, and the Principle of Double Effect and by extension the ethical Principle of Cooperation. Second, the thesis applies this complex moral method of official teaching to health care ethics.

Following the introduction, chapter two discusses the moral method of Natural Law and the Moral Object. Chapter 3 relates this explanation to the Principle of Double Effect. The subsequent chapters apply this moral method of official Catholic teaching to Catholic health care ethics, focusing on several emerging topics to emphasize the relevance of the theoretical approach. Chapter 4 discusses Health Care Ethics Consultations, especially engaging the Principle of Cooperation (enlightened by the Principle of Double Effect) with regard to prohibited health care services in Catholic health care. Chapter 5 considers the use of the Principle of Double Effect to justify bilateral salpingo-oophorectomies for BRCA mutation carriers and the uses of contraception for victims of sexual assault. Chapter 6 discusses the use of sex reassignment therapies for gender dysphoria and the use of contraceptive methods for non-contraceptive benefits.

[...]


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Post by Skyweir »

mmm... climbing into the Catholic mind ... seems a rather complex journey.

Its really not that difficult to assess ... and tis clear there exists a logic flaw in the presented reasoning in your article

Ukraines Catholic prelates condemn surrogacy as a 'moral evil

Its a simple one plus one equals two equation but in this instance the article supposes one plus one equals 0. 🤔

Rather problematic, no?

Youre a soul with a deeply inquiring mind ... it surely has occurred to you that somethings awry in Kansas Dorothy 😉
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Colorado initiative to end late-term abortion close to goal for signatures
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In a file photo, Kalley Yanta and Tom Wooden of Holy Family Catholic Church in St. Louis Park, Minn., demonstrate March 10, 2020, outside a Planned Parenthood building in St. Paul. (Credit: Dave Hrbacek/The Catholic Spirit via CNS)


DENVER -- Organizers of a ballot initiative to prohibit abortion in Colorado after 22 weeks, with an exception to save the life of the mother, said because support has been building in recent weeks they expected to get the 20,000 signatures needed by May 29 to get the measure on the November ballot.

Colorado is one of only seven states that allow abortion for any reason up until birth with no restrictions. Initiative 120, or Due Date Too Late, would end that in the state.

According to Denver Catholic, the online news outlet of the Archdiocese of Denver, 124,632 signatures are required to put an initiative on the ballot. Supporters delivered over 137,000 signatures to the Colorado secretary of state's office by a March 4 deadline.

"However, due to invalid and repeat signatures," 10,000 valid signatures were still needed "for the measure to qualify for the ballot," Denver Catholic reported.

A two-week "cure period" began May 15 to allow the Due Date Too Late campaign to get the additional signatures it needs. Organizers said turning in 20,000 or more signatures by May 29 "should assure that the ballot initiative will meet the statutory threshold."

On May 15 Colorado Gov. Jared Polis May 15 signed an executive order to temporarily allow signatures for ballot initiatives to be gathered by email because of current stay-at-home restrictions in place because of COVID-19. But his order has been challenged in court.

"We are excited to see the momentum build as this cure period continues. We are proud of the success we have had thus far, and are working hard with many circulators around the state to reach our 20,000 goal for signature collections," said Lauren Castillo, spokesperson for the Due Date Too Late campaign.

Under the measure, the mother is not subject to any criminal penalties, nor is a pharmacist "who unwittingly fills a prescription for an abortion beyond 22 weeks."

The abortion doctor can be charged can be charged criminally but is not subject to jail time. Performing a late term abortion is subject to a three-year suspension of a medical license.

"I urge all Catholics to get involved in this effort!" said Denver Archbishop Samuel J. Aquila said in a statement for the Jan. 11 march and rally for life in Denver. "We must not let up in our efforts to ensure that the goodness of every human life is respected in our laws, our churches and our families."

[...]


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Post by Skyweir »

mmm... the goodness of EVERY human life huh?

Like the ones resulting from surrogacies?

Oh yeah those lives are evil and are not deserving of value.

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In two Mexican states, lawmakers vote down bills to legalize abortion
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Pro-life supporters pray during a 2019 protest outside the local congress in Oaxaca, Mexico. In a May 21, 2020, vote, lawmakers in the central Mexican state of Guanajuato have shelved a pair of initiatives to decriminalize abortion, though the issue is increasingly being introduced for debate in legislatures around the country. (Credit: Jorge Luis Plata/Reuters via CNS)


MEXICO CITY -- Lawmakers in the central Mexican state of Guanajuato have shelved a pair of initiatives to legalize abortion, an issue being introduced for debate in legislatures around the country.

In a virtual session May 25, a joint health and justice committee in Guanajuato voted against the initiatives, including one that would have legalized abortion during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy.

Four days earlier, lawmakers in the neighboring state of San Luis Potosi overwhelmingly opted against legalizing abortion. Catholic leaders in both states expressed opposition to the initiatives.

People on both sides of the abortion issue rallied supporters online, with the hashtags "It will be law" and "Guanajuato is prolife" trending nationally.

The Archdiocese of Leon, which serves parts of Guanajuato, said May 26 it would file a criminal complaint after graffiti in support of legalization appeared on stone walls of the Our Lady of the Light Cathedral, a church visited by Pope Benedict XVI in 2012.

"As the Catholic Church, we express respect toward people and, what I ask of them, from those of us in favor of freedom of expression, (is) to be open and that we have a dialogue," Father Marcos Cortes Muniz, archdiocesan spokesman, said May 26 in a video statement. "Let us stay in our homes and remember that in the face of these attacks we have to respond with an attitude of peace."

That two of Mexico's more conservative and traditionally Catholic states would vote against the legalization of abortion failed to surprise most observers, some of whom expressed suspicions that the initiatives were introduced during a pandemic, when protesters would not be in the streets.

But the abortion issue has increasingly been taken up in local legislatures since the MORENA party swept to power nationally and won many local races in late 2018.

[...]


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Supreme Court decision could affect abortion debate in America [In-Depth, Interview]
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Security officers walk in front of the Supreme Court, Thursday, May 14, 2020, in Washington. (Credit: Andrew Harnik/AP)


[Editor's Note: Mary Ziegler is the Stearns Weaver Miller Professor at Florida State University College of Law. Pulitzer Prize winning historian David Garrow has called her "the premier historian of abortion in the post-Roe era." She is the author of Abortion and the Law in America: Roe v. Wade to the Present (Cambridge University Press 2020), Beyond Abortion: Roe v. Wade and the Fight for Privacy (Harvard, 2018) and After Roe: The Lost History of the Abortion Debate (Harvard, 2015), and the winner of the 2014 Harvard University Press Thomas J. Wilson Memorial Prize for best first manuscript in any discipline. She spoke to Charles Camosy about the upcoming U.S. Supreme Court decision on June Medical Services v. Russo, which is being watched for its implications on abortion laws.]

================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================

Camosy: So we are are just days away from a major Supreme Court decision on abortion. The first in awhile with what is arguably a pro-life majority. Could you briefly summarize what is at stake in this case?

Ziegler: June Medical Services v. Russo seems to be a simple case about whether Louisiana can require abortion doctors to have admitting privileges at a hospital within thirty miles. But there is much more at stake -- especially since the justices struck down an identical law just four years ago.

Everyone remembers how precedent often serves as code for what will happen to Roe v. Wade. We will see how readily this reconfigured Court will rethink its past abortion cases. Plus, the case asks who can challenge abortion regulations in the first place: does it have to be women, or can abortion doctors and clinics do it as well? Since the late 1970s, clinics have brought most of the constitutional lawsuits. If the Court sides against abortion doctors here, that may make it harder for anyone to bring abortion cases. And it would signal that the Court is starting to believe that abortion doctors do not look out for women's best interests.

[...]


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Mary Zeigler. (Credit: Courtesy to Crux)


[...]

If adding Kavanaugh to the Court doesn't deliver the results pro-lifers expect, do you think this might finally change way the abortion politics and debate works in the U.S.? When might be we see a new phase that isn't focused on judges and the Court?

I do think that we will move beyond a court-obsessed debate, but possibly not for some time. If the Court doesn't move as quickly as some pro-lifers hope, some will use that hesitation to make the 2020 election all about the Supreme Court. After all, the next president may replace Ruth Bader Ginsburg and/or Stephen Breyer (both of whom tend to vote against abortion regulations). So a Republican president could theoretically move the Court much closer to overturning Roe with two new nominations.

Ironically, I think a major victory -- especially the formal overruling of Roe -- would be the most likely way to move abortion politics away from a focus on the Court. Both sides would have to focus on what happens in state legislatures, especially in swing states without a clear position. Pro-lifers would also realize that the current Supreme Court (and perhaps any Supreme Court) is unlikely to recognize a right to life, at least in the near term.

Indeed, neither movement is likely to get what it wants from the Supreme Court, and sooner or later, everyone will realize that. Even then, though, I'm skeptical that anyone will move beyond the Court for long. Both political parties have benefitted from making the Court an election issue. It's hard to imagine either Democrats or Republicans giving that up.

[...]

Do you have any advice for those of us who would like to be more fair-minded and careful in these debates? Especially if we have strongly held views and if the power structures around us seem to demand that we take a particular position?

I'd start by talking to people who might respectfully disagree with you. Many of us are surrounded by people who share our views. That is less true for me, and it has been eye-opening. I live in a quite conservative town and work in academia, with generally progressive colleagues. I grew up in a strongly Catholic community and then spent most of my early adult years at Harvard surrounded by people without religious commitments. But what really helped me was to start conversations -- in my case, oral histories. Getting to know why people believe what they do can humanize someone you might otherwise be inclined to dismiss.

It's also good to remind yourself that many people don't fit cleanly into conventional pro-life or pro-choice categories (and have quite conflicted views). Most major polls confirm this: Americans may not want abortion to be criminalized but may favor lots of restrictions. Acknowledging these nuances can help anyone not only to be more fair-minded but also to be a more effective advocate. As a law professor, I teach that effective advocacy requires kindness and empathy, especially for those you see as adversaries. This should be as true in the abortion debate as it is anywhere else.


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Good advice 👌
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Northern Ireland's Legislative Assembly rejects UK-imposed abortion law
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Pro-life supporters are seen in a 2019 file photo holding signs outside the High Court in Belfast, Northern Ireland. On June 2, 2020, politicians in Northern Ireland rejected an "extreme" new abortion law imposed on the province from Parliament in London. (Credit: Brian Lawless/Reuters via CNS)


MANCHESTER, United Kingdom -- Politicians in Northern Ireland rejected an "extreme" new abortion law imposed on the province from Parliament in London.

Members of Northern Ireland's Legislative Assembly voted 46-40 to oppose a legal framework announced March 25 to permit abortion on demand in the first 12 weeks of pregnancy, abortions up to 24 weeks for undefined mental or physical health reasons, and abortion up to birth if the fetus is considered to be disabled.

The June 2 motion will not change the law directly, but it will put pressure on politicians in London to possibly revisit the legislation before abortion services are commissioned later in the year.

The vote was welcomed by the Catholic Bishops' Conference of England and Wales, which had previously objected to the imposition of abortion on part of the UK, where a majority of the population and their elected representatives oppose the practice.

"While this vote will not directly change the law in Northern Ireland, it does send a strong message that this decision should be made in Northern Ireland, not in Westminster," said a spokeswoman for the bishops' department for social justice.

"It can't be right that this is going to be imposed by Westminster against the wishes of the people of Northern Ireland and their Assembly," she said in a June 3 statement.

According to Right to Life, a UK lobby group, in June the British Parliament must either approve or reject the new abortion framework, and the vote will make it difficult to impose law if the Northern Ireland Assembly has explicitly rejected it.

The group said there would be increased pressure to redraft the guidelines or to scrap them completely and refer the matter back to the Northern Ireland Legislative Assembly, since abortion ordinarily is a devolved issue. The new law was passed at a time when the Assembly was suspended.

[...]


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Initiative to end late-term abortion in Colorado meets signature deadline
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A participant holds a sign during the March for Life rally in front of the Colorado Capitol in Denver Jan. 17, 2015. A 2020 Colorado initiative to end late-term abortion has received nearly five times the number of signatures needed to put the measure on the state's November ballot. (Credit: Eileen Walsh/CNS)


DENVER -- Organizers of Colorado ballot Initiative 120, or Due Date Too Late, said their volunteers turned in nearly five times the number of signatures needed to get the initiative before voters in November.

Volunteers turned in 48,329 signatures to Secretary of State Jena Griswold by their deadline of 2 p.m. May 29.

The initiative would prohibit abortion in Colorado after 22 weeks, with an exception for the life of the mother. Colorado is one of only seven states that allow abortion for any reason up until birth with no restrictions.

[...]

"This has been an historic day for the Due Date Too Late team and the volunteers across the state of Colorado. There has been an incredible amount of bipartisan support for Initiative 120," Lauren Castillo, spokesperson for the Due Date Too Late campaign, said in a May 29 statement.

"We are thankful to everyone who has dedicated their time to making this step toward saving lives and ending late-term abortion a reality," she added.

Under the measure, the mother is not subject to any criminal penalties, nor is a pharmacist "who unwittingly fills a prescription for an abortion beyond 22 weeks." The abortion doctor can be charged criminally but is not subject to jail time. Performing a late-term abortion is subject to a three-year suspension of a medical license.

[...]

The Due Date Too Late campaign has a network of nearly 500 volunteers throughout the state. Several thousand voters in Colorado's rural eastern and Western Slope communities from Cortez to Wray signed the petition.

[...]


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Post by TheFallen »

Wosbald wrote: Initiative to end late-term abortion in Colorado meets signature deadline
The initiative would prohibit abortion in Colorado after 22 weeks, with an exception for the life of the mother. Colorado is one of only seven states that allow abortion for any reason up until birth with no restrictions.
Although I was vaguely aware of such allowances, seeing them laid out in such stark relief in black and white is truly chilling.

Is this really still true in the 21st century? In a First World country, let alone a Western superpower? There are still seven states that allow elective abortion up to the moment of birth???

If so, I am simply staggered. Sure, I'm pro Choice - albeit uneasily. But if true, the above is so far beyond the pale as to be beyond abhorrent.
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Post by Hashi Lebwohl »

TheFallen wrote:Is this really still true in the 21st century? In a First World country, let alone a Western superpower? There are still seven states that allow elective abortion up to the moment of birth???
Democrats want this to be the standard for the entire nation. The ob-gyn sees the crown but if the mother says "I don't want it" then they want her to be able to choose to have the doctor abort it at that time.
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So much sweeping generalisations these days Hashi...

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