What is it you believe?

Post by **I'm Murrin** » Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:06 pm

It came up Secular Humanist 100%, Unitarian Universalist 98%, Nontheist 90%.
I looked at the info on the second one, and I don't agree with their beliefs.

Basically, I do not believe their is any great power behind life or the universe, I find sufficient explanation for everything within my experience in physics. I don't believe in an afterlife. Jesus was just another man, and if it wasn't for Paul's inventiveness (like beginning the practice of incorporating local mythology into the stories of Jesus in order for his new religion to be more readily accepted by these other societies) most of us would never have heard of him.

Post by **Baradakas** » Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:30 pm

if it wasn't for Paul's inventiveness (like beginning the practice of incorporating local mythology into the stories of Jesus in order for his new religion to be more readily accepted by these other societies) most of us would never have heard of him.

Sorry, Murrin, my reply does not involve your statement per se, but the source. It was in fact Constantine (and his advisers) who began the incorporation of other pagan cultures into apostolic christianity. Other sources, such as Simon Magus, perverted many of the basic doctrines, but Constantine, and then Justinian, incorporated sun worship into christianity, such as Christmas which was in fact the winter solstice celebration which was part of sun deification. Other cultures (the greeks most notably) at the time helped to incorporate symbols and saint worship (halos and the Virgin Mary (worship of Diana) to name two). The cross was intertwined about the time that the egyptians were being converted. (Thier symbol, the ankh which represented rebirth anyway was all too easily incorporated) Paul was never involved with this form of misegination, at least in no credible document I've ever read....

The entire reason Constantine did thisc was because the christian church had already grown too powerful to be stopped. Needless to say, we certainly WOULD have heard of Christianity whether or not the Roman Empire had absorbed it or not.

-B

-B

Post by **duchess of malfi** » Sun Aug 22, 2004 10:28 pm

My belief-o-matic top scores:

1. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (100%)
2. Liberal Quakers (95%)
3. Unitarian Universalism (92%)
4. Neo-Pagan (87%)
5. Bahá'í Faith (75%)

I was expecting secular humanist.

Incidentally, I was raised as a Liberal Christian Protestant.

Post by **I'm Murrin** » Sun Aug 22, 2004 10:40 pm

Thank you for the clarification on that point, Baradakas. Forgive me if I wasn't being very accurate in that post--a combination of bad memory and laziness--it was Paul's version of the Jesus faith that made it possible for those incorporations to occur - it began when Paul allowed non-jews to convert without having to begin eating kosher.

Post by **hierachy** » Mon Aug 23, 2004 12:03 am

Unitarian Universalism (100%), but I don't know what that means

I don't believe in God/s. And I don't believe we have a soul. I think when you die, you die.

I do, however, believe that choice is an illusion, as everything that ever has and ever will happen has been certain since the universe came into existence, right down to the tiniest, most insignificant thoughts in your head as you read this post.

Post by **Loredoctor** » Mon Aug 23, 2004 12:20 am

Hierachy wrote:I do however believe that choice is an illusion, as everything that ever has and ever will happen has been certain since the universe came into existence, right down to the tiniest, most insignificant thoughts in your head as you read this post.

I absolutely agree. Cause and effect - the only truth in the universe.

Post by **The Leper Fairy** » Mon Aug 23, 2004 1:34 pm

Uff, no choice?

I dunno... I believe that we do make our own choices

Post by **CovenantJr** » Mon Aug 23, 2004 1:57 pm

I believe in choice, at all levels.

Post by **Worm of Despite** » Mon Aug 23, 2004 2:22 pm

Whether we like it or not, a lot of our choices are made by media, culture, and our values. Eh, but that's for another thread. Don't pay attention to me--it's the sociology class talking.

Post by **Loredoctor** » Tue Aug 24, 2004 12:23 am

What? Did you say something, Foul? Wasn't paying attention

Post by **Avatar** » Tue Aug 24, 2004 5:54 am

Interesting thread indeed.

Caer-- "Thou art God." Excellent post, although it probably raises more questions than it answers, I really thought it was great.

As for myself, well, that's not an easy question. I like to believe a lot of things, but when you get right down to it, it's only because they amuse me. I have no real faith in anything apart from myself.

It mostly amuses me to call myself a Discordian. It's a kind of neo-paganism, and theoretically, we worship Eris, the Greek Goddess of Chaos and Confusion. Practically, we don't do much worship at all, but tend to let Her get on with it.

I like it because it doesn't require any faith. You don't have to believe in Her, because She doesn't worry about it. Chaos is an indisputable force in the Universe. We just anthropormophise it into a Crazy Bitch with a wicked sense of humour. If I recall, it was started as a direct opposite of masculine, warlike, and prohibitive deities.

It's a religion that incorporates Zen and Taoist ideals, a good dose of common sense, and a lot of humour. It's been described as a guerilla religion disguised as a joke, and I love it.

If anyones interested, put "Discordian" into your search engine, there's plenty out there. If you can sift out whats serious from whats not, it's good for another perspective at least. Also recommended are The Pricipia Discordia (Our "Bible"), Zen without Zen Masters by Camden Benares, The Honest Book of Truth and The Dishonest Book of Lies.

As someone said about the Principia "If you read this, and don't laugh, you have missed the point. If you read it and ONLY laugh, you have missed a chance at enlightenment."

Take it easy folks, and keep laughing.
--Avatar

Post by **matrixman** » Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:19 am

Avatar wrote:It's been described as a guerilla religion disguised as a joke

Now that's inspired! I like it already!

I have no interest in being affiliated with any religion, but yours certainly sounds entertaining. Whatever works for you, Avatar.

Post by **Avatar** » Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:53 am

Matrixman wrote:Whatever works for you, Avatar.

That's the thing. It works for me in whatever way I want it to, if it does at all. As I said, it's mainly a question of amusement. My "religion" doesn't require anything of me, although it suggests certain things.

It doesn't require that you be affiliated with it, or insist that you take it seriously. In fact, the by-line(for want of a better word) of the organisation that Discordian Churches traditionally claim affiliation with, is
"An Irreligious, Non-Prophet Dis-Organisation."

As I said, it speaks to the sense of humour in me, and I fundamentally agree with many of the ideals, which prize freedom and choice above all else.

Later
--Avatar

(Edit: By the way, we don't proselytise, so I forbid any of you from joining.

Unless you really want to of course.)

Post by **Fist and Faith** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 12:51 pm

Regarding free will, here's a thread I started because I didn't believe it existed either. And, in a rare moment, I agreed with what Sky said

, and changed my mind.

p210.ezboard.com/fahirashangarfrm18.showMessage?topicID=21.topic

Post by **Skyweir** » Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:40 am

geesh that was a brilliant post me!!

:LOL:

Fist are you Highdrake?? I always thought it was Pitch!c

I think I have harboured this confusion for many a long year

Post by **Revan** » Wed Sep 08, 2004 10:38 am

Fist and Faith wrote:Love

LoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLove
LoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLove
LoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLove
LoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLove
LoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLove
LoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLoveLove

Never spoken a truer word

Post by **Loredoctor** » Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:07 am

I don't believe in love. I believe in truth. Love is illusion. Truth is release and freedom.

Post by **Revan** » Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:14 am

Ur-Vile wrote:I don't believe in love. I believe in truth. Love is illusion. Truth is release and freedom.

Don't believe in love?

You're never going to be completely content with your life Ur-Vile...

It saddens me that one can't believe in love.

and it's saddens me more that that person is you

Post by **Loredoctor** » Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:19 am

Don't be saddened. Be happy. It frees me in more ways than one.

Post by **Revan** » Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:24 am

Ur-Vile wrote:Don't be saddened. Be happy. It frees me in more ways than one.

Hmmm... *Considers once again whether to start a topic based on an idea that another member gave to him*

Love free's you Ur-Vile....ahhh... if you only knew of it, you would be freed in so many ways.

Kevin's Watch

Kevin's Watch

What is it you believe?