Kevin's Watch

Foul said he had Jeremiah.

Now he shows up with Thomas Covenant at Revelstone.

So, was Foul lying?

Did TC snatch Jeremiah out from under Foul's nose?

Or, have Covenant and Foul become one being? In constant struggle with each other similar to the duality of Esmer? But where Esmer is Hatred and Shame, TC is Hope and Despair.

Consider:

Both are able to possess Anele when the old man stands on grass. TC on the lush, healthy grass. Foul on the scrubby, near death grass.

Further, the law of death is broken. Lord Foul can reanimate the spiritless dead to serve him. The law of life is broken as well. A person's spirit can be made to reinhabit their dead body and continue as if they had never died.

Therefore, an attempt made by Foul to ressurect TC to serve him would also result in TC's spirit reinhabiting his body. What if Foul kinda hitched along for the ride and now they both inhabit the same vessel?

Consider the line "Tell her I have her son." Who was he instructing? Joan? The Raver? And yet neither of them speak. It seems to me more like a command from within "(You Covenant)Tell her I have her son." and then Foul's voice come forth.

It seems like TC and Foul are at constant battle over control of the dual being. This explains why a TC possessed Anele says "He opposes me. Here, like this, he's stronger than I am" The "He" of course being Foul's part of TC's being.

The "Here, like this" seems to imply that TC is the more potent half and retains more control over the actual physical form (which explains why Jeremiah does not appear to have suffered distress and actually seems excited to be in the land) but Foul holds sway over the spiritual half. This explains why Foul has played no active hand in the current corruption in the land (because he can't affect it directly, holding sway over spirits only) but has only offered evil council (through dreams and possession perhaps?).

I imagine that while inside the vessel of TC, Foul is still able to communicate with his servants directly e.g. The Ravers

I also imagine that Foul's original plan was to have Linden come straight to Mount Thunder for a confrontation and there find a Foul possessed TC and thus become his servant in despair. However, she has reclaimed the staff (through TC's intervention "Do something they don't expect" "You need the staff" etc.) and thus holds power that Foul did not expect, forcing him to change his plans and ride out to meet her directly before she can stray further outside of his designs. The staff of Law likely enables her to "find" the true TC within the conflicted being and cast out Lord Foul.

A scenario like this, in sooth, fits SRD's style (Inner struggle and strife). The question is, does she succeed in casting out Foul? Does he assume his own form then? Or does Foul possess another host? Jeremiah? Liand? Linden herself? Or maybe TC/Foul steals the Staff from her or destroys it

Lots of possible outcomes.

Esmerlover, I think that this is totally the BEST idea I've read here

Linden is told to fear Thomas Covenant from at least three people in the book, including Thomas himself.

Idon't know, I have a problem with TC and Foul being one person -- YET. I have a feeling that TC and Jerimiah are riding to Revelstone for the same reason that Covenant went there the first time -- as Foul's messenger.

I think that it's very plausable Foul and TC are sharing the same form.
It is possible that it went the other way around.
when Foul came back into strength this time...TC was the arch of time...he was Fouls boundry, what better way to keep him out of the way, than to possess him. Or maybe he didn't have a choice, being an arch of time, maybe you liose the ability make decisions, so he had to join with Foul.

esmerlover wrote:Foul said he had Jeremiah.

Now he shows up with Thomas Covenant at Revelstone.

So, was Foul lying?

Did TC snatch Jeremiah out from under Foul's nose?

Or, have Covenant and Foul become one being? In constant struggle with each other similar to the duality of Esmer? But where Esmer is Hatred and Shame, TC is Hope and Despair.

Consider:

Both are able to possess Anele when the old man stands on grass. TC on the lush, healthy grass. Foul on the scrubby, near death grass.

Further, the law of death is broken. Lord Foul can reanimate the spiritless dead to serve him. The law of life is broken as well. A person's spirit can be made to reinhabit their dead body and continue as if they had never died.

Therefore, an attempt made by Foul to ressurect TC to serve him would also result in TC's spirit reinhabiting his body. What if Foul kinda hitched along for the ride and now they both inhabit the same vessel?

Consider the line "Tell her I have her son." Who was he instructing? Joan? The Raver? And yet neither of them speak. It seems to me more like a command from within "(You Covenant)Tell her I have her son." and then Foul's voice come forth.

It seems like TC and Foul are at constant battle over control of the dual being. This explains why a TC possessed Anele says "He opposes me. Here, like this, he's stronger than I am" The "He" of course being Foul's part of TC's being.

The "Here, like this" seems to imply that TC is the more potent half and retains more control over the actual physical form (which explains why Jeremiah does not appear to have suffered distress and actually seems excited to be in the land) but Foul holds sway over the spiritual half. This explains why Foul has played no active hand in the current corruption in the land (because he can't affect it directly, holding sway over spirits only) but has only offered evil council (through dreams and possession perhaps?).

I imagine that while inside the vessel of TC, Foul is still able to communicate with his servants directly e.g. The Ravers

I also imagine that Foul's original plan was to have Linden come straight to Mount Thunder for a confrontation and there find a Foul possessed TC and thus become his servant in despair. However, she has reclaimed the staff (through TC's intervention "Do something they don't expect" "You need the staff" etc.) and thus holds power that Foul did not expect, forcing him to change his plans and ride out to meet her directly before she can stray further outside of his designs. The staff of Law likely enables her to "find" the true TC within the conflicted being and cast out Lord Foul.

A scenario like this, in sooth, fits SRD's style (Inner struggle and strife). The question is, does she succeed in casting out Foul? Does he assume his own form then? Or does Foul possess another host? Jeremiah? Liand? Linden herself? Or maybe TC/Foul steals the Staff from her or destroys it

Lots of possible outcomes.

This was my theory!!! thief!!!!!

heh. Good one... i suppose... if you didn't get it off me...

hehehe. i always thoughtFoul was Thomas all through this book... though in a way that we don't understand... yet...

I disagree with your belief that TC and FOul are the same entity now. I suspect that Foul is linked with Covenant, but like all of Foul's plans it involves setting someone up to make choices that destroy what they love. Somehow, letting Covenant and Jeremiah is what Foul wants, for he believes their natural choices will doom the Land and set him free.

As examples, the use of Pietten to destry the Ramen and the Ranyhyn, the infection of Covenant with venom... then letting him run around free in the hope that he breaks the Arch of Time with uncontrolled wild magic, the belief that Linden will despair and refuse the power to heal, the torture of the Waynhim to force the Lords to summon Covenant (which went pretty much according to plan, TC's presence screwed things up for the Lords pretty badly.) TC and Jeremiah are free because Foul wants them to be, and he believes their actions will serve his purposes.

Plus, he can't be TC, since we ALL know Roger Covenant is actually Foul. Well, ok, I think so.

Sorry Revan! Didn't know you had already posted something like this.

Regarding the theory that Covenant is Foul:

In one of his oldest interviews (probably on his web site), SRD said something like the following:

Spoiler

In the 1st Chronicles, Covenant defeats Foul

In the 2nd Chronicles, Covenant surrenders to Foul (although not really, if you consider how he then promptly defeats him!)

In the 3rd Chronicles, Covenant will become Foul (!)

When we first heard about SRD writing the Last Chronicles, I was one of few that said that they had some sense of dread about what might happen in the Last Chronicles. I was mostly worried about the statement above, that TC would become Foul, that he would truly become evil. I was also a bit worried about where SRD had gone with his more recent writing; it seemed less compassionate and less gentle, more capable of depicting evil. (see his reply to my question about evil in the October gradual interview).

I was somewhat relieved to read Runes, it seemed to blend well in style with the other Covenant books, but I still wonder what dastardly deeds lie ahead for TC and Foul.

So, it is very possible that we are seeing both Thomas and Lord Foul a gallopin in to Revelstone! SRD is having a field day with breaking both the Law of Time and the Law of One Personality to a Body!

srtrout

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Esmerlover - I don't think your theory holds water anymore.

In the battle at the end of the Power that Preserves, Covenant then shrugged of Fouls attempt to merge with him.

Then at the end of White Gold Weilder, when Foul had the White Gold in his hand, Covenant demonstrated that he could have the ultimate control of the White Magic that Foul threw at him.

Thomas Covenant has beat Foul in mastery of the WILD MAGIC itself, the power on which everything is based. How then can Foul possess Covenant? I can't buy it! No, it was game, set, and match, and Covenant won!

Covenant bested Foul outright! In any direct conflict between them, Covenant has the upper hand.

Covenant's weaknesses are Joan and Roger - and Foul has engineered (or taken advantage of) their entry to that World.

Roger Covenant is a person who has decided to abandon his fellow humans, and be entirely reckless of everyone else's lives.

Roger has not only decided to be *happy* to destroy people, he has decided to take *ecstasy* in killing people as he has decided to BE *ecstaticly*, 100% for himself, with 100% recklessness of all else.

Which is exactly what Foul has decided to be.

Roger wanted the White Gold before he entered the Land, and yet he *didn't get it*.

Instead he has a body riddled with bullets, and a mind that revels in destruction as he helps himself. And he is all undone. He would have allowed Foul to possess him absolutely, simply in order that he may live. ("Worship Me").

And what's more, I bet he *jumped* at the chance of being possessed by Foul.

"Tell her that I *have* her son"

I think it is inevitable that Foul *has* Roger!

I like the idea of Foul possesing Roger. It would make it difficult for TC to kick butt this time. Come on it's his son.
Now Linden on the other hand would smoke Roger in a minute. Of course it may be tough if Roger didn't drop the gun he had when he came to the Land. Lord Foul with a gun, won't that be fun when the time comes.

That could be true, also. It may be Joan serving Foul's purposes, not Linden. And Roger who he has possession of. That would mean Linden just misinterpreted the whole thing.

I can't wait to find out!

To esmerlover's quote about when TC first uses Anele and talks to Linden. When TC say's that 'He is to stong here' the 'He' isn't Foul, it's Esmer. Linden even confronts Esmer about it, he replies "That which lies hidden in the old man displeases the dancers of the sea"

Foul and TC possess Anele, but so does the fire creature (skurj?) and to a point even stone does. In TWGW TC tells Foul your even starting to look like me.
But, SRD has said that TC still has something to learn, could it be that he and Foul are not the same person?