Kevin's Watch

all,
Have just finished the first 6 books of TC the unbeliever and cannot honestly see the reason for the final runes books. well okay maybe SRD was running a bit short on readies (oops that is being cynical).

It's quite simple, actually - the story wasn't finished.

of course the story was finished.
TC had defeated foul. remember the description of the way in which foul flung his utmost force against TC until the ring dropped to the dias for Linden to pick up. A new staff of law was made from Vain and Findail and the land was restored. how can that not be a finish. SRD must be down on his luck and as I said needing some readies.

cheers

Ah, but it wasn't finished. Not by a long shot. So many doors were opened, so many questions unanswered. Covenant didn't defeat Foul, he's not gone, just diminished. Yes, the Land was restored, and all seems wonderful. But...The Law of Life was broken. The Law of Death remains broken. And Foul isn't dead, he only spent himself. And Covenant...well he isn't dead either. The story isn't finished because they aren't finished. Something else remains to be accomplished.

Spoiler

Combat...Surrender...Acceptance. We haven't had the acceptance yet. That's coming, and what an end it will make.

Yup, what Furlsy said.

According to SRD, the Second and Third Chronicles formed themselves in his head at the same time, but he waited to write the Third because 1) He was wiped out after the Second, and 2) he didn't feel he was a good enough writer at the time (if memory serves).

Yep.

The Last Chrons have been planned ever since he began writing the Second.

CovenantJr wrote:

According to SRD, the Second and Third Chronicles formed themselves in his head at the same time, but he waited to write the Third because 1) He was wiped out after the Second, and 2) he didn't feel he was a good enough writer at the time (if memory serves).

duchess of malfi wrote:

Yep.

The Last Chrons have been planned ever since he began writing the Second.

That's definitely the latest version of the story. But it doesn't match the actual history. I can remember many SRD interviews during the 20 year gap where there was clearly no set plan regarding the Final Chronicles (if any) even then, much less in 1980.

My best guess based on what SRD actually said over the years as opposed to what is being said now is that he left the door open regarding a possible final TC series but there was never a master plan to do so.

See, e.g.:

1991:
www.personal.rdg.ac.uk/~sis00aaa/SD.html

That obviously begs the question: Are you going to write The Third Chronicles?

I don't know if I'm going to write it or not. I am a naturally born stubborn person ad the more people push me to write it the less likely I am to do it. I want to be able to make my writing decisions from conviction and strength, not from pressure and need. If my writing career collapses and the only way I can feed my children is by writing Covenant books then I will go become a plumber because I do not want to write on that basis. I have a very pure idea of what storytelling is about, and I want to preserve that. For me, whenever I am going to start a new project the main question is: would I write the same story if I could never find a publisher? If the answer is yes then I write it. If the answer is that I am writing it because they want to publish it then I don't write it.


1999:
www.hostultra.com/~penneysplace/donaldson/donaldson.htm

PN: Okay, you have to know what my first question is going to be-- I've been asking it since we started corresponding ten years ago. Is there going to be a third Chronicles of Thomas Covenant?

SD: It's possible that I will write the Last Chronicles of Thomas Covenant at some time in the future, but I spent ten years of my life writing the first two, and it was a major undertaking. I promised myself that I'd let a long time pass before I considered doing any more "Covenant". I'm probably closer to tackling that project now than I've ever been. But after seven years on the GAP books, I'm feeling a little burnt out, so it'll probably be some time before I'm up to making another major commitment like that.


2000:
www.farris.co.uk/books/archive/sdonalds.htm

Qtuoe from SciFi Wire (21st Jan 2000)Author Stephen R. Donaldson said there is no truth to a recent rumor that he is working on a new installment of his best-selling fantasy series The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever. Donaldson said that rumor has been kicking around for 15 years, but that "it's no more true now than it was in 1985--which is to say, not at all."

However, Donaldson didn't rule out the idea of writing more Covenant books at some point. "The possibility exists that I will someday write what I call The Last Chronicles of Thomas Covenant," he told SCI FI Wire. "But I've given the idea no serious consideration yet."

...and at no point did he ever say he didn't already have the idea.

I'm afraid that I don't see any inconsistency. The loose ends in 2nd Chronicles are plain to see. It's not as if SRD is making up the plot of Last Chronicles out of the air.

Ok. By his own admission, the 1st Chron was the full story. Then, when the publisher pitched a dreadful sequel, SRD "saw" the 2nd and 3rd. By own admission.... ideas sit on shelves until time to write them. The time for the final chron came in 2004.

Now... just because a story is long in coming and/or never written does not mean it didn't exist. Look at the DUNE novels. Frank had planned to finish the story after CHAPTERHOUSE, but died before it was written. Yet, the story does end but with open possibliities for continuence if desired. (That story is coming in the next couple of years)Same with 2nd Chron.... story ends but with open possibilities for continuance if desired.

I don't agree that RUNES is a ploy to gain readers, ergo $$sales$$. The time for that was after MORDANTS NEED, not 4 mysteries, 5 GAP, and 2 SHORT STORIES. SRD has proven to be an AUTHOR with stories to tell rather than a WRITER who hashes out variations of success.

Well spoken Master Po

...and at no point did he ever say he didn't already have the idea.

And who said he didn't? Certainly not I. I said he did. But leaving loose ends and having an idea of maybe someday coming back to the TC universe is not the same as having a master plan to do so at point X.

I have no problem with SRD coming back to TC, in part, for monetary reasons. And probably what you might call career reasons, too. A writer who has been popular, acclaimed, and financially secure can’t be blamed for trying to recapture those feelings by going back to his strengths. SRD himself seems to disagree with this attitude, judging by things I’ve read in the GR and the snippet from the 1991 interview I posted.

That's definitely the latest version of the story. But it doesn't match the actual history. I can remember many SRD interviews during the 20 year gap where there was clearly no set plan regarding the Final Chronicles (if any) even then, much less in 1980.

Way back in the early 80s, not long after I read the Chronicles, I recall seeing an interview with SRD in People magazine which stated that he planned a Third Chronicles, but had no immediate plans to begin work on the third trilogy.

Two different plans are being discussed here.

1) The plan for what the Last Chrons will be about. There's no reason to believe SRD did NOT have this plan. He knew the major points (and likely many of the minor) of what would happen in the Last when he began writing the 2nd.

2) The plan to actually write the Last Chrons, with schedules, publishing dates, etc. He certainly did NOT have this plan until... Romeo? When did this plan begin to take shape?

Thaale aparently meant 2) in his first post of this thread, but some, including me, thought he meant 1).

'k?

Hi all
Have read the answers that you have made and there maybe some valid points but to leave the final chrons for some 20 years after white gold wielder still seems very odd. I am sure all of use must have thought that at the time of wgw that the story was complete and never imagined this latest 4 books. sorry just being cynical again.

no_limits wrote:just being cynical again.

Yes, you are.

Myself, I thought the saga was done, too, way back in '83. But that's because I wasn't as perceptive a reader as some of the long-time fans here at the Watch who had noted all the doors SRD had left open. My excuse is that I was only 13 when I read the books, so a lot of the subtler meanings doubtless went right over my head. Now I realize how unresolved the story still is, and I look forward to the journey SRD has in store for us as he builds toward a more lasting solution to the problem of Despite.

If you're not convinced of the sincerity of SRD's intent or you don't believe his undertaking the Last Chronicles is a worthwhile endeavor, then the solution for you is quite simple: don't read it. If you've already dismissed it in your mind, then there's no point in wasting your time on it.

Hmmm, to be honest I thought they were complete as well; certainly, that was the opinion of most reviewes and many people here at the watch, too. For me, the stories have always been about the difficulties faced in the lives of TC and LA. They were about the characters finding the answers in their lives. Consequently, the Land mirrors their plight. While I am not disparaging the Last Chronicles (and am glad they are being written), I certainly don't think they are absolutely necessary. Remember, Donaldson is writing them because is a story teller - a story needs to be told - I don't think his principle reason was to answer loose threads.

good answer Loremaster.

Thanks!