Kevin's Watch

I know that this might sound a bit stupid, but i personally think that maybe the Creator was the cause of Covenants leprosy.
However i do not think that he gave it out of spite, or cruelty. But rather out of necessity for covenant to overcome lord foul.
I mean think of how different the entire situation would be if he had never got leprosy. i mean the creator could have chosen any other person on the earth, that owns a white gold ring, to save the land. because there have got to be other people with white gold rings that would quit the unbelieving attitude and get right down to saving the land. so the creator gave covenant his illness to give him a certain type of wisdom only the incurably sick can comprehend.

Interesting idea, Tuvor; my perspective is different from yours. I see the battle in the Land is paralleling Covenant himself. That leaves two things that can represent Covenant's leprosy: Foul himself or the Illearth Stone.

Foul - because he is a foreign element (a metaphor for an infection perhaps) in the Land, and he seeks to destroy it. The Illearth Stone - because it is more obviously a sort of infection (it is green, it corrupts, it is the very opposite of normal health).

Either way, if we want to read the parallel now backwards, we get to my perspective here: Foul and the Illearth Stone are things that are wrong, and are where they should not be. There is no specific reason for their being there (except that perhaps every thing must have its opposite: the Creator - Foul, etc.). So Covenant's leprosy in this reading of TCTC was not caused by anyone, it's just a wrongness. Which is exactly what leprosy is like in the real world.

I saw it proposed here once that Joan gave it to him by result of a yeast infection. Completely hypothetical, but a surprisingly compelling argument.

I thought the implication was that he became infected when he went to that old shack to start work on his next book, something about a rusty nail sticks in my memory. It's interesting that Donaldson repeatedly refers to Covenant's infection by 'the bacillus" when Leprosy is in fact caused by a Mycobacterium (M. Leprae, to be precise). I wonder if this is just because it sounds better, or if it was a hole in his research.

was this known in '77

Microbiological techniques have been established for a fairly long time, so I had always assumed that Donaldson had in fact made a mistake, and was struck by how this would been unlikely given his experience with sufferers of the condition. A quick bit of research reveals that many organisms originally classified as being part of the Bacillus genus have since been reclassified; Donaldson's information was correct at the time of writing.

For those who are interested, a brief overview of the pathology of the condition is given here: cancerweb.ncl.ac.uk/cgi-bin/omd?query=leprosy

The nine banded armadillo?

I have always believed that the leprosy is an expression of Lord Foul, and that the Land and Covenant are linked.
With events paralelling each other eg.
Writing of book = Berek / Staff of Law
Burning of his book = Ritual of Desecration

Anonymous wrote:I have always believed that the leprosy is an expression of Lord Foul, and that the Land and Covenant are linked.
With events paralelling each other eg.
Writing of book = Berek / Staff of Law
Burning of his book = Ritual of Desecration

I developed an Idea the the book's are a deliberate corollary between TC biological fight with Leporsy and his mental fight to stay sane in the land. (I cover some of this in a thead called immune systems) .

So from that point of view I do agree that there is a parallel between leporsy and the land.

But wait! Is leprosy wrong? I mean it's natural...like Sandgorgons. There were unhealthy plants and stuff in the Land, unhealth is a natural thing when it doesn't come from Despite. I don't think leprosy is a wrong in this world like Foul and the Illearth Stone are in the Land. After all, they both come from outside the original creation, not intended to be there. Leprosy is just doing its job, making people sick. We don't like it any more than fleas like flea spray, but that's just a point of view.....JMHO anywayz

fightingmyinstincts wrote:But wait! Is leprosy wrong? I mean it's natural...like Sandgorgons. There were unhealthy plants and stuff in the Land, unhealth is a natural thing when it doesn't come from Despite. I don't think leprosy is a wrong in this world like Foul and the Illearth Stone are in the Land. After all, they both come from outside the original creation, not intended to be there. Leprosy is just doing its job, making people sick. We don't like it any more than fleas like flea spray, but that's just a point of view.....JMHO anywayz

Leporsy is a wrong in the land they have no experence with it and have limited exposure to other disease as theland has (had) the power to fight disease on its own prior to the illearth war and of course the sunbane. Leporsy did not belong in the creators world any more than Lord foul did.

Well, okay. But I see FMI's point. If you're drawing parallels between stuff in TC's "home" world and the Land, and you're saying that leprosy in TC's world is in parallel with Lord Foul in the Land, then you're saying that both are Evil. Or both are, um, a necessary evil? A canker for which there is no cure?

SRD has cast Lord Foul as the transcendant evil in the Land (altho Despite is in each one of us). I don't see leprosy, or any disease (even cancer or AIDS), playing that role in TC's world.

But yeah leprosy would be a wrong in the Land...but not an Evil as it was not done on purpose, even if everyone had got it that would be bad but it's not anyone's fault. Did TC ever willingly go to the Land? No. The IES and Lord Foul were on purose, i.e. Foul's purpose, so they are a wrong and an Evil. JMHO

The stark reality of leprosy is indeed the anti-magic of our world that enures TC 2 Foul's attacks and helps 2 foster 'unbelief', 4 the most part--as Syl has alluded: I talk about a yeast infection and did TC pet an armadillo? xtensively in my terribly long post in the Townfulosombitches, USA thread...pg. 4

I think Foul is a "wrong" in the Land, something from outside that shouldn't be there. But in the big picture of things, Foul is the opposite of the Creator; he is there to Despise the Creator's Creation. So in that respect Foul is "natural".

Likewise leprosy in our world - it's a wrong for the person infected, but in the large scheme of things, it's 'natural' (sadly).

JMHO

Drinny wrote:I think Foul is a "wrong" in the Land, something from outside that shouldn't be there. But in the big picture of things, Foul is the opposite of the Creator; he is there to Despise the Creator's Creation. So in that respect Foul is "natural".

Likewise leprosy in our world - it's a wrong for the person infected, but in the large scheme of things, it's 'natural' (sadly).
JMHO

Does this mean that the creator had no choice but to cast the dispiser from the heavens to the land durring his creation process? With out the evil of Lord Foul, no contrast to the beauty of the creator's creation exsists, so how can it be precieved by the people of the world.

Does good require evil?

VT u sound like Carl Sagan: "How would we precieve life in a flat dimension?..." (very cool little story, btw...)

One of my favorite people! My Signature is from his into to a"A Brief History of Time"

I believe that SRD had no choice but to have the Creator/Foul antagonist to create his story. In this world I don't know I do not belive we have to have evil and eventualy we may homoginize the absolute good and evil toward something in between that all can agree to. the religion component is a big problem here; Like Carl Sagan I believe that religion as we know it will have to adapt considerably to alow this to happen.

Covenant picked up his leprosy about the same time that Kevin desecrated the Land,

always struck me as interesting

Hmmm that's quite plausible!

leprosy takes about seven years to settle in, so (basing this suggestion on the view that covenant and the land are involved together in some way) maybe covenants leprosy is caused by the destroying of the one forest, and the beings that cut them down are his leprosy. like little infections cutting away at one forest (covenant). this also raises questions about the forestal Wildwood.

interesting..........