Kevin's Watch

Possible "Lord Foul's Bane" film: bad news

It doesn't look good. So far, the project has been rejected by Fox, Sony, and Dreamworks. "Too dark." "Too much like LOTR." The prospective producers have decided to change their tactics. They are now hoping to get a reputable director "on board." If they succeed, this may increase the project's credibility.

I'll post more news when I have some.

Is anyone really surprised?

New Line! Miramax! Have they talked to Drew Barrymore, the head of Flower Films?? NO! Let them leave no tern unstoned! Not that I condone avian violence, or anything...erm. Sorry.

No, not really surprised. Thanks for the update, though, Dilby.

I'm disappointed, of course, but am I surprised? Nope. SRD was rejected 47 times before Lord Foul's Bane was accepted for publication, so now it's the movie producers' turn to endure rejection, heh.

Thanks for the news, dlb. It's a good reality check.

"Too Dark" we all guessed. "Too much like LOTR" I, at least, guessed too (that dang ring).

So in a way, this is merely an affirmation.

Wasn't LFB rejected 47 times?!?!

I am not going to be too disheartened here. If they're still looking for a directory, then it's still alive.

I don't think it's anything like LOTR.
Not unless Frodo Baggins is like Thomas Covenant. I mean directly, personality wise and in his actions, not in religious and secular metaphors, mind you.

Can you imagine how LOTR would have gone, had it been like the First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant?
Moderators, if I'm going off-thread topic, my apologies, but it is too funny:

Gandalf: Frodo, you are Gil Galad reborn. And you shall save or damn the world, because you have the One Ring. You must confront Sauron and destroy him.
Frodo: This is all a dream. When I wake up, I'll be safely back in Endor with the ewoks.
Rosie Cotton: I'll go with you, Frodo.
Frodo: (rapes Rosie)
Farmer Cotton: I'll lead you to Barad Dur, Frodo, but I'll hate you forever.
Sam: I'll kill you for this, Frodo!
Mrs. Cotton: Remember your Oath of Peace, Sam. I forbid!
Elrond: We cannot See you, Frodo. We must verify if you are a friend or foe.
Frodo: You don't understand, Elrond. I'm trying to protect you from an even bigger lie.
Elrond, Arwen, Glorfindel, Erestor: We shall go with Frodo to overthrow Sauron, and wrest back the Staff of Law.
Frodo: What is a Staff of Law? Why do we need a Staff of Law?
Elrond: Because our true foe is the one who spoke to you at the start, Morgoth, and you are really Fingolfin reborn, only this time you shall prevail against him, and ...

Or, if the First Chronicles had been like LOTR:

The Creator: Lord Foul is going to destroy my creation.
Thomas Covenant: I shall defeat him. I have the Wild Magic, and I shall prevail. I must save your world!
Doctor Berenford. I'm Covenants' friend. I shall go.
Sheriff Litton: We real world people must stick together. I will go.
Covenants' Lawyer: I have always understood Covenant. I will go.
High Lord Mhoram: I shall create a Fellowship. Against Lord Foul and his Ravers shall be set Nine Companions. With Thomas Covenant shall Sheriff Litton his faithful companion go. For the people of the Land, Quaan and Tohrm. For the Raynhim, Manethrall Lithe. For the Haruchai, Bannor. For the Giants, Saltheart Foamfollower. The last two shall be Lords.
Sheriff Litton and Covenants' Lawyer: But that leaves no room for us! We want to go.
High Lord Mhoram: That is because do not understand the danger that you face.
The Creator: Neither does Thomas Covenant.
(later on) Quaan to Thomas Covenant: How I would drive the hosts of Lord Foul until I stood face to face with him. The Ring is yours only be chance. It should have been mine. Give it to me!
(yet later on) Sheriff Litton: Thomas Covenant is dead. That's what the Mirror was showing! (sobs)

-

Too dark?
TOO DARK?
LOL

(wonders if these producers have seen any Mel Gibson films, lately?)

ROTFL!

See, this has been one of my problems with the idea all along: People won't look past the surface of this being a fantasy, and they will refuse to accept that fantasy can be dark, and can educate. People see fantasy as entertainment - often children's (and geeks ) entertainment - not as something serious.

"What do you mean, we shouldn't have toys made? But won't children want their own Thomas Covenant action figure?"

"Er... not so much, no."

"Too much like LOTR."

Since when does Hollywood object to being derivative?

Variol Farseer wrote:

"Too much like LOTR."

Since when does Hollywood object to being derivative?

When they think they're being obvious about it.

Alynna Lis Eachann wrote:

Variol Farseer wrote:

"Too much like LOTR."

Since when does Hollywood object to being derivative?

When they think they're being obvious about it.

Agreed. They would jump through flames to find another classic fantasy with a pre-built fan-base.

But not one that the synopsys begins "There's a guy with an all-powerful magic ring ..." BEEN THERE! DONE THAT!

That is really insulting, "Too much like LOTR". Arrr. It may have its parallels but look at Harry Potter, who would say Rowling ripped off her ideas from Star Wars (who in turn ripped off their ideas from tons of myths and legends)??? Even Shakespeare got his ideas from myths and legeneds, I mean did anyone ever stop and think that both authors have the same source of inspiration? How come C.S. Lewis is so different from Tolkien, they don't say either ripped off each other, though there are obvious simmilarities with their works.
“There is nothing new under the sun.” Everything gets reused that is why we have archetypes, but the actual stories and characters are vastly different. On another note I don’t think they should make a film adaptation unless the budget and the production crew are both really good. I was really disappointed with the latest Harry Potter film, sticking to the book is very important, the third movie did a terrible job.

(Please excuse my semi-nonsensical ramblings)

You make perfect sense to me, Ariadoss. And hey, you're in New Mexico, I see: Donaldson country!

Edelaith wrote: Rosie Cotton: I'll go with you, Frodo.
Frodo: (rapes Rosie)

Oh... Hobbit sex... /shudder

You forgot to mention Drool as Gollum - "The Staff is mine! My preciousss! Lord Foul gives it to me!"

Ariadoss wrote:That is really insulting, "Too much like LOTR". Arrr. It may have its parallels but look at Harry Potter, who would say Rowling ripped off her ideas from Star Wars (who in turn ripped off their ideas from tons of myths and legends)??? Even Shakespeare got his ideas from myths and legeneds, I mean did anyone ever stop and think that both authors have the same source of inspiration? How come C.S. Lewis is so different from Tolkien, they don't say either ripped off each other, though there are obvious simmilarities with their works.
“There is nothing new under the sun.” Everything gets reused that is why we have archetypes, but the actual stories and characters are vastly different. On another note I don’t think they should make a film adaptation unless the budget and the production crew are both really good. I was really disappointed with the latest Harry Potter film, sticking to the book is very important, the third movie did a terrible job.

(Please excuse my semi-nonsensical ramblings)

Well, to be honest, I understand this initial impression - I can remember feeling the same way when I first read LFB - and not simply because both LOTR and LFB are set in a fantasy realm with magic and fantastic creatures.

There are a number of superficial similarities, especially in the first book, LFB - the rest of the series and especially the second series tread very new water, as far as I am concerned.

However, when you think about the creatures/concepts introduced in the very first book - you can see some similarities of setting and concepts:

The Ring - both series revolve around a super-powerful ring
Lord Foul - Though archetypal (as SRD points out - in order to differentiate hime from Sauron), he still fills a similar role as Sauron.
Ridjeck Thone - Mordor
Mount Thunder - Mount Doom (both with lava pits)
Cavewights -goblins
The catacombs of Mount Thunder - The Mines of Moria
The Ringwraiths - The Ravers
Revelstone - Rivendell
Woodhelvennen/Stonedowners - Elves/Dwarves
Ramen - The Rangers
Ents - Forestal
Mirkwood - various sentient forests
Even both titles begin with "Lord"
etc.

SRD himself has stated that he was inspired by the LOTR - that TCOTC would never have been written without LOTR.

HOWEVER, I believe the actual Story that SRD conceived was radically different than LOTR, but this story needed a setting. It is quite possible to me that in order to focus on his own story, he borrowed settings from LOTR to get started, to give a home for his story.

And after LFB, almost all new concepts/creatures/lore that he introduced were much more original (and in my opinion more original than Tolkien's creations). Even the rest of his stories/series are highly original - I know of nothing quite like them (that is not to say that he does not borrow some concepts here and there, but they are subservient to the plots - and in most respects trivial).

We, as his fans, see it that way... but the average movie-goer will not have read the books and will see only the similarities, not the differences.

You know what I think I'd enjoy, if it were done right? TC as anime. I'm not talking cartoons, kiddie anime or the mass-market stuff they have, but the classics and the well-done stuff. Think Akira. Maybe Cowboy Bebop. The last episodes of Trigun. Wolf's Rain, maybe. There are many more that I haven't had the opportunity to see yet. It is an established, respected (in the rest of the world) and expanding art form. It already has a modern-man-sucked-into-fantasyland theme.

I think that if done by experienced anime artists and writers, it would work, and it would work well.

Personally, I was thinking maybe puppets! *runs from Alyanna*

Alynna Lis Eachann wrote:You know what I think I'd enjoy, if it were done right? TC as anime. I'm not talking cartoons, kiddie anime or the mass-market stuff they have, but the classics and the well-done stuff. Think Akira. Maybe Cowboy Bebop. The last episodes of Trigun. Wolf's Rain, maybe. There are many more that I haven't had the opportunity to see yet. It is an established, respected (in the rest of the world) and expanding art form. It already has a modern-man-sucked-into-fantasyland theme.

I could see it an an anime - it would be fun, and animes are more likely to tread on more experimental territory. Also, a mini-series from the Sci-fi channel - a la Dune could do it justice.

Matrixman wrote:You make perfect sense to me, Ariadoss. And hey, you're in New Mexico, I see: Donaldson country!

Interesting you should say Donaldson country, I've met four famous authors here, including Donaldson (that was a fun occasion he gave me a free book, I wrote an article about it if anyone is interested pm me). Anime would be interesting actually, they could show everything then, have any of you seen the uncensored Japanese versions before they get to the U.S.? They can be really awesome, but if it were an anime I think it would lose some credibility unless you had a really famous/good director doing it and excellent animators.

An anime version could be really, really interesting. Did anyone see Grave of the Fireflies? Talk about pure drama. I bawl my eyes out everytime I see it. And it's totally realistic, if you ignore the fact that it's animated.

Puppets, Foul?

Or Muppets...?

ThomasKermit: It's not easy being a leper.

...

It's true that animation leaves so much possibilities to the creators: almost everything is feasible and possible, weird camera angles etc. There is one reason I wouldn't like to see TCTC as a cartoon: by necessity cartoon/anime faces are stylized, sketchy. And precisely TC and Linden, Mhoram etc. are characters with whom the face, the character is very important. I imagine Covenant to have a very marked face where every line and wrinkle and littel movement of the eye would be etched onto our minds by the end of the movie.

But I don't say it wouldn't be interesting to see it as an animated movie (although to see the Haruchai as huge-eyed manga characters...hmm.. *shudders*)