Kevin's Watch

So, with all we've learned in Half-Blood Prince, what do people think is yet to come? How will it play out? Who is R.A.B.? Where are the Horcruxes? What will happen when Harry finally faces Voldemort?


Some of my theories:

I've already mentioned this elsewhere - I think Harry was accidentally turned into a Horcrux when Voldemort tried to kill him, hence the mysterious connection, Harry gaining some of Voldemort's powers, and the words of the prophecy, 'Neither can live while the other survives'.


R.A.B. - The message referred to Voldemort as 'Dark Lord', and it sems plain that the Horcrux was stolen by a Death Eater who had betrayed his master - my personal theory is that this was Regulus Black, who Rowling made a point of mentioning twice in HBP, as a Death Eater who was murdered after trying to leave them. It would make sense, I think, though it would make Regulus a much more accomplished wizard than has been suggested (we have'nt heard anything about him having any kind of exceptional power or ingenuity).



And some rambling about Snape: He had no choice on the tower, as we all know. He'd sworn the Unbreakable Vow, which meant that when Malfoy wouldn't kill Dumbledore, Snape had to do it. Dumbledore clearly realised that the most important thing to do on that tower was save Draco - he had to stop Draco becoming a killer, because killing on Voldemort's orders would have sealed his fate, he'd've been trapped, a Death Eater from then on.
I don't think Snape told Dumbledore about the Vow, however - Dumbledore assumed Snape was lying as part of the act when Harry told what he overheard. Dumbledore begged Snape not to kill him, though I think he realised Snape had little choice, with or without the Vow - if Snape refused then it was likely that Draco, Snape, and Dumbledore would all be doomed.
Snape may also have been trying to protect Malfoy by killing Dumbledore himself - if he'd not acted immediately Malfoy may yet have been forced to do it, and I think Snape saw the same necessity to prevent this that Dumbledore did.
So, I think Snape acted in the only way he could, and this will be shown in the seventh book, when we finally discover what Snape did to earn Dumbledore's trust, which I'm certain we will.


One last thing: Who do you think will take over Gryffindor House when McGonagall is Headmistress?


So, what do other people think of these ideas, or do you have theories of your own to share?

Murrin wrote:I've already mentioned this elsewhere - I think Harry was accidentally turned into a Horcrux when Voldemort tried to kill him, hence the mysterious connection, Harry gaining some of Voldemort's powers, and the words of the prophecy, 'Neither can live while the other survives'.

This is a very interesting theory, one I hadn't heard or thought of! Do you think a Horcrux could be placed inside a living person without the person being aware of it? I would imagine it would be more like what Quirrel had.

Murrin wrote:R.A.B. - The message referred to Voldemort as 'Dark Lord', and it sems plain that the Horcrux was stolen by a Death Eater who had betrayed his master - my personal theory is that this was Regulus Black, who Rowling made a point of mentioning twice in HBP, as a Death Eater who was murdered after trying to leave them. It would make sense, I think, though it would make Regulus a much more accomplished wizard than has been suggested (we have'nt heard anything about him having any kind of exceptional power or ingenuity).

:::nodding:::

Yes, I think that one is pretty obvious, as well as the locket which couldn't be opened that was found in the Black house in OotP turning out to be the locket R.A.B. took. I think duchess called our attention to this in a different thread?

I am still confused about Snape, and don't really have any theories. So many posters here have offered very thought provoking ones, so I think I'll leave it to J.K.R. to enlighten me in the next book.

Murrin wrote:One last thing: Who do you think will take over Gryffindor House when McGonagall is Headmistress?

Aaaaaahhhh...

I don't trust Boards of Directors/Regents/Govenors, et. al. How many times have we seen a wonderful interim University President/CEO/etc., only to have them replaced by someone who doesn't do nearly as good a job but played the politics much better?

It will be interesting to see which other teachers are from Gryffindor besides McGonagall, but I have a strong feeling she'll be back as Head of House.

That is, if the storyline does return to Hogwarts.

Murrin wrote:So, what do other people think of these ideas, or do you have theories of your own to share?

I do worry about the Weasley and Granger families. I think Harry trying to call it off with Ginny isn't going to make any difference in the long run...

All of the Weasleys are in mortal peril all of the time -- and it doesn't matter if Harry attempts to disassociate himself with them or not. What he is doing to Ginny is groissly unfair in my mind -- you have no right to choose someone else's (as long as they are old enough to understand) tolerance of risk just to spare yourself pain. Hopefully Ginny will set him straight in no short order in book 7.

An adult, if accidentally turned into a horcrux, would undoubtably know. But would a baby? Would Harry have the slightest inkling, since he would have been one as long as he can remember?

I want to differ with you, Murrin, on one of your statements.

I definitely don't think that Dumbledore was pleading for his life in those last moments with Snape. It would be totally out of character for him to do so. Think about it, when has he ever shown a fear of death? He once said that death "is the next great adventure."

Many, in other forums I frequent, have commented on the long look that passed between Dumbledore and Snape. They were both accomplished Legilimens, so it is quite possible that some message passed between them.

I think that Dumbledore's pleading had some other meaning than the interpretation that Harry gave it. I have heard a lot of theories, and am still mulling it over.

I too, think it's possible Harry contains a piece of someone's soul, but, I think it's Lily's, not, Voldemorts. I think Harry may not have had Lily's eye's prior to that Halloween night, I think that's how he got Lily's eye's, her ancient magic, that she did, and sacrificed herself for him, put a piece of her soul into him. Not sure if it would still be called a Horcrux, though, since Lily is officially dead.

Yea, Dumbledore would never plead for his life. He's already lived 150+ years, Death is the next great adventure, and, he expected the Sorceror's Stone inventor to give up his life for the cause, so, how could Dumbledore do any less? His instructions to Harry to force him to drink the Potion from the Horcrux cave, if neccessary, I believe foreshadowed this (as well as saying HArry was more important than he was). Dumbledore was pleading with Snape, to keep his cover, and get it over with so Harry wouldn't be discovered, and Draco wouldn't be forced to kill.

Firm believer in the Snape-is-good theory, but here's a wrench in it: What if Dumbledore was pleading for Severus not to betray him? As in:

"Severus...please... please tell me you haven't lied to me all this time. Please tell me my faith in you was not misguided."

Dumbledore would never plead for his life, but I think certain circumstances could break him down to the point where he would plead for his faith. Finding out Snape was a traitor would be an incredible disappointment.

Does't fit with the other clues I see in regards to Snape' loyalty, but it is a possibility.

I was discussing the whole "Harry as Horcrux" theory with Foamy tonight, and she brought up a good point: If Harry was one of Voldemort's Horcruxes, why would Voldemort have tried to kill Harry? Wouldn't that have destroyed Harry's value as a Horcrux? I really didn't buy the whole "Harry as Horcrux" theory to start with, but that sort of clinches it for me.

Also, I am fairly certain that one cannot make a Horcrux accidentally. The description of it sounded like the making of a Horcrux must be a deliberate act. And if Voldemort thinks seven is such a powerful number, and wanted to make seven horcruxes, you can be damn certain he made sure what all seven of them are, and where they are hidden.

Alynna Lis Eachann wrote:Firm believer in the Snape-is-good theory, but here's a wrench in it: What if Dumbledore was pleading for Severus not to betray him? As in:

"Severus...please... please tell me you haven't lied to me all this time. Please tell me my faith in you was not misguided."

Dumbledore would never plead for his life, but I think certain circumstances could break him down to the point where he would plead for his faith. Finding out Snape was a traitor would be an incredible disappointment.

Does't fit with the other clues I see in regards to Snape' loyalty, but it is a possibility.

That is what i believe as well, Alynna.

We all know by now that we can never take what we see in J.K. Rowling books at surface value. She has suprised and decieved us time after time; therefore I don't think that Dumbledore was begging for his life as he appeared to be doing...

The reason I agree with Alynna is fairly simple, I rereqad the conversation between Dumbledore and Malfoy last night, and noted something. this is (more or less) what is said;

Dumbledore: "Snape has been keeping an eye on you at my request"
Malfoy: "You're wrong, Snape's been trying to help me all year."
Dumbledore: "Well, it appears that we must apgree to disagree on that point, it so happens I trust Severus Snape."

So Dumbledore was wrong about Snape. Because we know that Snape has in fqact been trying to aid Malfoy all year, and Dumbledore doesn't, and believes Snape to be good. However this is obviously wrong, and this is what breaks him and makes him beg.

No, Darth. Malfoy says Snape has been trying to help him - and of course, that's what Malfoy thinks. In The Unbreakable Vow, Snape is confronting Malfoy and tries to convince him to let him help, but Malfoy refuses - Snape has spent the entire year trying to get Malfoy to let him help, not actually helping him. He's been lying to Malfoy to find out what exactly Malfoy was doing, and how close he was to succeeding in it. Dumbledore was right on that point. The fact that Snape never actually found out what Malfoy was doing is shown in the fact Dumbledore didn't known what he'd done, and that Snape didn't know the Death Eaters were attacking until it started.

Snape also knows he's more valuable to the Order on Voldemort's side - he had to fight on the Death Eaters' side, or they'd realise whose side he was really on. Once Flitwick told him what was happening, he had no choice - he had to fight for one side or the other. And that meant losing his position in the school to keep his place as a spy. You'll notice he attacked no-one but Dumbledore, ran past everyone else without fighting - made the other Death Eaters leave quickly - killed no-one but the person his Vow forced him to kill.

Hmm, drat, Murrin -- those are good points. You've almost got me convinced that Snape's still working for the Order. But still -- I think about Snape's demeanor toward the other Death Eaters, particularly in Chapter 2, and contrast it with his usual demeanor at Hogwarts, and it just feels to me like Snape is showing his true side to the Death Eaters and stifling himself at the school. Maybe he's just really good at being a double agent -- but I dunno....

BTW, did we ever find out what Draco's been up to all year? My kids have absconded with the books....

Gotta say I think a horcrux cannot be made accidentally. That would be akin to inadvertantly transplanting a kidney or something. Not gonna happen.

Besides, then Harry would not only be connected to Voldemort, in a real sense he would be possessed by him. Harry doens't seem at all like that to me. He even acting instantly to save his vile cousin from a Dementor.

My own suspicion is that Regulus did in fact steal the locket and that it was found in the Black mansion at the start of OOP.

I also suspect that Harry will go to live there when he turns of age. Methinks there's some kind of information or the like that's waiting to be discovered somewhere in that old house.

Likewise, I think there is something Voldemort wants on the grounds of Hogwarts itself. Something he doesn't know the exact location of. Harry will need to be back at Hogwarts specifically for that reason.

I truly suspect Harry will not end up with Ginny.

I think Snape still considers himself to be primarily an agent of the Order, but he's still working for Voldemort at the same time. Whenever I read about a double agent like this, I think of Kurt Vonnegut's Mother Night, which had a character who had a Nazi radio propoganda show, in which he snuck codes to send messages to the allies. Vonnegut's moral was (If I remember correctly) "We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." I wonder if Snape's fate will be similar to Vonnegut's character:

Spoiler

He killed himself out of guilt, concluding that his work for the good guys didn't excuse his crimes.

My new theory: it wasn't Dumbledore who died, it was his brother, Aberforth, impersonating him.

Well... either that, or Aberforth will take over as principal of Hogwarts...

Abeforth was at the funeral, though... the barman from the Hog's Head. At least, the prevailing theory is that that's Abeforth. I forget if it was GOF or OotP, but when Harry goes in there, he thinks the barman looks familiar, and it smells of goat... and there was that thing about Abefoth and inappropriate spells on a goat.

As for what Malfoy was doing, aliantha... trying to get Death Eaters into the castle and kill Dumledore. That was his mission, as assigned by Voldemort in punishment for Lucius' failure at the Ministry.

A few theories, well, actually more questions asked than answered...

Can Voldemort still create new Horcruxes? He's got a body, he's technically alive, what's to stop him from splitting what's left of his soul a few more times to get back to that lucky seven? Isn't the theory that he used Nagini as a Horcrux after he died?

Why did Dumbledore immobilize Harry? Why not freeze Malfoy, wrap him in the invisibility cloak, and put him somewhere out of the way until the battle was over? Maybe I missed something there, because I'm not certain what point that served, except to take Harry out of action when he was needed most. Which doesn't make sense.

Likewise, I'm not certain why Slughorn's memories were so important. It seemed as though Dumbledore knew or at least suspected everything except perhaps the actual number of Horcruxes. Hadn't he been away looking for them all earlier that year? He knew what the ring and the diary were.

Why did Dumbledore need to drink the potion? Why not just create enough cups to remove the potion, or pour it into the lake?

Why did they think Tonks was in love with Sirius? Wasn't he her second cousin?

Moaning Myrtle has always bothered me a little. She's the severely depressed ghost of a student who was horribly murdered. Why didn't Dumbledore & Co. ever do anything to try to give her a sense of closure? Staying on topic, though she wasn't actually killed by Voldemort, he did kill her with the basilisk. Could there be a Horcrux involved in there somewhere? I rather doubt he considered her death significant enough. Though I can't help but think there's something more there than meets the eye.

I'll stop there, as I have a bad feeling someone's going to come along and make me look like a complete idiot.

Sorus wrote:Why did Dumbledore immobilize Harry? Why not freeze Malfoy, wrap him in the invisibility cloak, and put him somewhere out of the way until the battle was over? Maybe I missed something there, because I'm not certain what point that served, except to take Harry out of action when he was needed most. Which doesn't make sense.

Too tired to answer all your questions, but I think the answer to why Dumbledore immoblized Harry is fairly obvious - he did it to protect him.

Ummm...WOW!

Right, down to theories.

I must say I thought of Regulus Black as being RAB almost immediately after finishing the book at 4.30 on Sunday morning.

As for who will teach at Hogwarts, I suspect that Slugwort will remain as Potions master and head of Slytherin and McGonagall will be Transfiguration teacher and head of Gryffindor. Which means a new DADA teacher and a new Headmaster. I'm picking an existing character for Headmaster. Fudge crossed my mind, but I now think that that is unlikely.

I need to read more of these threads more carefully, so more from me later.

I think Snape is definitely Dumbledore's man and I question if Dumbledore is even truly dead. I just finished last night and I'm still thinking about it!

I was looking for Dumbledore to still be alive, but, I'm pretty sure he's gone. We've never met a portrait of a living person that interacted directly with people, and we did have a funeral and a burial.

The only portraits of living people I can recall are the ones Lockhart had, and they just went about like photographs.

I think that Fawkes might be relevant in Dumbledore coming back to life, like a phoenix from the flames.

Perhaps Fawkes is even a Horcrux?

Maybe the symbolism of the phoenix as Dumbledores "familiar" is too obvious, but then again..................maybe not.