Kevin's Watch

As we all know, there have been many deaths within this series, some have stuck with us, and some have probably been forgotten...

So which death would you say was the best? Most dramatic, shocking, horrifying?

For me, it is a hard choice between Dany's brothers death (Can't spell his name) Viseys? having a pot of molten gold poured on him was class. The little git got what he deserved... and it was the first death i think, quite shocking for me to read a seemingly main character just cut out of the story like that.

Tywin's death was particulary sadifying... he was a git. It was funny: "It turns out, in the end, Tywin Lannister did not sh*t gold".

Joffery's death; Loved it; In fact, this is probably my favourite death, I love reading about that little bastard having the life choking out of him. Well deserved, I had tears in my eyes; though I was cutting onions at the same time does not change the fact I loved this sequence.

Ygritte's death was probably the saddest death of the series... I liked her as a character; and she was feisty.

Lysa's death was amazing: "Only Cat". *Push off the cliff*. She really annoyed me. I hated her. Fly bitch!

Oberyn... what a class character he was. Just a badass. He was great, and the way he got his revenge was amazing. even if he did die in the act.

So what are yours?

Revan wrote: Most dramatic, shocking, horrifying?

Catelyn Stark. I knew her fate was going to be bad, but I didn't expect her to come back as the fatal revenant.

Still gotta go with Eddard's beheading myself. Or Drogo just wasting away.

I figured these two characters were around for the long haul. When Martin knocked both of 'em off, I realized that this series was going to have me shocked and guessing for every installment.

For sheer "Oh my God, don't do it, Martin," it has to be The Red Wedding.

The Red Wedding, bar none. Definitely didn't see that one coming...

Oberyn, i loved his death, possibly my favourite scene of the series.

Encryptic wrote:The Red Wedding, bar none. Definitely didn't see that one coming...

Oh I know, I was completely shocked at that... for a time I thought that Arya was killed as well, and I was really gutted, because she rules.

Two words: RED WEDDING. Never did a book induce heavy, fear-filled breathing in me, until that scene. I just remember being hunched over the book in bed, being acutely awake. My back was all hot, as if I were embarrassed or something. Real weird. I didn't even like those characters that much (Cate and her son, what's-his-name), but, I dunno--just something about it.

I also vividly remember Eddard Stark getting beheaded. I sat up straight in bed and punched the mattress, because I had honestly fallen into Martin's trap, thinking Ed was the main character. It was like seeing Covenant killed before reaching Revelstone. At first I was mad at Martin, but the more I look back, I realize that Eddard's death was what endeared me to the series and kept me reading.

An excellent post Lord Foul... and I completely agree with you about Eddards death. And Robert's, in fact, all the deaths in book one suprised me. Dany's brother and husband; all characters I would have thought would be there until the end...

I thought myself desensitised to it, however the Red Wedding and Joff's death completely took me back. Now I no longer hold any assumptions on who is to live and who is to die, it could be anyone.

Heh, now i expect everyone to die.
LF's post begs the question, who is the main character?

IMHO got to be either Jon or Dany.

I think there is no main character. Moreover, I don't even try to think of who will "win" in the end--just who will freaking survive! I'm putting my money on Arya. She's getting more and more resourceful. She's the only one who is learning tactics where she can actually hide her identity.

The rest of the "hopefuls" (Tyrion, Jon, Dany, etc.) stick out like sore thumbs to me. I think they're going to gather steam, strike out in an overt manner, and then go down in a blazing fury. They'll most likely create a huge change/kill some key characters, but I doubt they will make it out alive. Too many factors are setting up/pressing down. Of course, pure speculation. But with this series, that's where half the fun is.

An outwardly honest character is not going to get what he/she deserves, simply because Martin is showing us that in Westeros it is not about "deserves". Just look at the most atypical "white knight" character (Eddard), who found himself under the executioner's axe before the first book was out. Eddard was a most bitter lesson to the reader that those who wish to survive the Game of Thrones will have to be unscrupulous--or at least very clever gits.

Lord Foul wrote:I think there is no main character. Moreover, I don't even try to think of who will "win" in the end--just who will freaking survive! I'm putting my money on Arya. She's getting more and more resourceful. She's the only one who is learning tactics where she can actually hide her identity.

The rest of the "hopefuls" (Tyrion, Jon, Dany, etc.) stick out like sore thumbs to me. I think they're going to gather steam, strike out in an overt manner, and then go down in a blazing fury. They'll most likely create a huge change/kill some key characters, but I doubt they will make it out alive. Too many factors are setting up/pressing down. Of course, pure speculation. But with this series, that's where half the fun is.

An outwardly honest character is not going to get what he/she deserves, simply because Martin is showing us that in Westeros it is not about "deserves". Just look at the most atypical "white knight" character (Eddard), who found himself under the executioner's axe before the first book was out. Eddard was a most bitter lesson to the reader that those who wish to survive the Game of Thrones will have to be unscrupulous--or at least very clever wits.

Good post again Lord Foul. if people got what they deserved, then a lot of the characters would be die, or others would be alive... this is plainly not about "deserving"... Which in my opinion is the entire reason that makes these books so damn compelling. You don't know what is going to happen. Anything could happen... I mean most storylines, most people know for a fact what the ending is going to be, if not how it is going to come about... we all know Rand will defeat the Dark One, Harry will beat Voltemort, Frodo beats Sauron, but with these books, you can't guess. They're amazing.

Well, nobody will believe me, but I've been saying since 1996 (when I read A Game of Thrones) that Daenerys, Tyrion, Jon and Arya will survive until the final book. I've been fooled by many of the character's demises, but not for an instant did I think Arya had been killed in Storm of Swords.

In the final book, though, all bets are off.

For my part, I didn't believe Theon Greyjoy had actually killed Bran and his companions in spite of all appearances. I definitely feel Bran will be a "keeper," too, at least until this three-eyed crow business is seen through.

Another character who IMO will remain significant, maybe even to the end, in spite of appearances at the end of ASoS: Sandor Clegane. Seems to me he (or our perception of him) has been "growing" up to that point. Anyway, I suspect Arya still needs him.

Edmure's wedding was IMO definitely the best-written and set up of a number of strong possibilities. The careless reader floats along for pages and pages unprepared for the shock; a somewhat less careless reader might note certain ominous signs, incl Lord Frey seemingly acting totally out of reputed character.

I agree too that Lysa's death was the most unexpected. Littlefinger is quite the cold-blooded treacher, after all (I could sort of see his betrayal of Eddard Stark as perhaps part of a plan that could have worked out for the best for everyone, were it not for Joffrey and Stannis at least) But then again, who wants to be married to Lysa and have spoiled-brat little John as a stepson?

I'll have to nominate the way Danaerys turned the tables in the slave city (names, doggonit! DHBWM!) tricking them out of all their Unsullied defenders without giving them a dragon. It's not wise to insult a Westerosi dragon princess in High Valyrian assuming she can't understand you, especially if you should've known darn well her family were Valyrian nobility themselves! (Since when did the Targaryens develop such a concern about slavery, anyway?)

As of the ending of ASoS, the mot significant death in terms of the progress of the story definitely has to be that of Lord Tywin. Up to now he's been the Godfather and the patient spider and chess player in control of almost everything that had gone on in Westeros. With him dead, Tyrion a fugitive, and the late lamented King Joffrey croaked (literally!), the whole Lannister/ King's Landing apparatus by default falls into the unready hands of Cersei and Jaime. Both have shown their shortcomings as strategists and political schemers. Jaime, who otherwise would have been Tywin's heir, is in an ambiguous legal position by continuing to be a member of the Kingsguard. Furthermore, looks like the Mountain and the other chief reavers of House Lannister are headed out of the picture, too. The whole political equilibrium has undergone a major upheaval as of this point.

Agrred, the signs for the Red Wedding were there. Grey Wind behaviour especially.
But as i was reading it i wanted to ignore these and hope they would survive.